Daggers too OP

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ffogell wrote:

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Rampe69 wrote:

I'm going to get alot of crap for this but i'm still going to say it. This game is drifting towards Diablo 3, where 95% of builds are crit based.

its not drifting its already there ;)

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ahcos wrote:

It's not a good idea to either just flat out nerf daggers or to flat out buff other weapons. I really hope they come up with something more innovative than just adjusting numbers, and in my oppinion there are already some mechanics in the game to balance out the different choices.

Don't forget that it's just straight boring if every choice is just equally good in terms of achieving certain goals, so this has to be the main focus. Imo, it's fine if daggers offer the most DPS (alongside with bows + wands + claws), but they also offer better defense via block/spellblock and better utility with Surgeon's. There's no good reason to go 2Hand, you'd have to rework what all the weapons offer:

- daggers: flat out DPS. Drawback: the least range of all the weapons, you really have jump in the face of the enemy. This might affect Reave, for example, so Reave used with Daggers has 30% less AoE. You might also limit AoE damage, or damage from creating projectiles (Lightning Strike or Molten Strike).

- 1hand Swords: less DPS then daggers, but higher range, maybe even buffing the AoE for attacks like Reave. Basicly, with swords you'd be able to attack the enemy from a (small) distance.

- 1hand Axe: built in bleed effect, much like Ignite. Normal range. The harder you hit, the greater is the bleed effect's AoE. The important part here is that bleed would not be reflected.

- 1hand Mace/Scepter: Like daggers, you have to be close, but instead of daggers maces offer a build-in AoE splash; less effective than Melee Splash, but strong enough so you can use Heavy Strike for instance as an AoE attack without modifying it. The harder you hit, the greater the AoE.

- 2Handers: follow the thought pattern of the 1Hand weapons, but as a catch they all have a built-in AoE effect - for Maces, this AoE effect would be even stronger, naturally.

- Staffs: keep them as they are, but expand the options to set a staff using character up for block. Ofc, they'd also profit from the build-in AoE effect of 2handers.

The basic ideas that are in the game so far would stay in the game, as in: Axes = high dps, Swords = accurate, Maces = stun.
Also, flask pre- and suffixes would have to be reworked so there are options similiar to Surgeon's - they would not have to be just as strong, but it'd help non-crit builds immensly in terms of utility.



These are just random ideas, and they're by no means perfect or completely thought through - just what i came up with on the fly. The basic idea is that you neither limit the DPS of daggers nor just flat out buff the DPS of the other weapons, but rather offer more interesting choices so other weapons have their niche. In my example:

- Swords are very versatile and very safe to play with a great range in general
- Daggers have the best DPS expecially against single targets, like bosses
- Axes make you more or less immune against reflect no matter your setup, you can spam DPS mindlessly
- Maces annihilate huge packs of enemies the quickest

- 2handers in general can spare AoE support gems and add more DPS support gems. As they offer two potential 6Ls and wouldn't need one dedicated AoE setup anymore, that'd free up space for innovative setups like cast on melee kill or maybe even 2Hand-Melee + Summons, Hybrid caster or anything else you can imagine with 2x 6L.
In other words, imagine 2Handers as a seperate modifier just like dualwielding, where 2Handers add AoE to single target attacks, more AoE to AoE attacks or additional projectiles to projectile attacks. This'd actually be a reason to use 2Handers over 1hand+shield or dual wielding.

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tl;dr: don't nerf dagger DPS and don't buff all other weapons in DPS as that'd be boring, instead make the other weapon choices interesting and increase diversity that way. Also, add additional pre- and suffixes for bottle utility similiar to Surgeon's.

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ahcos wrote:

you'd have to rework what all the weapons offer:

- daggers: flat out DPS. Drawback: the least range of all the weapons, you really have jump in the face of the enemy. This might affect Reave, for example, so Reave used with Daggers has 30% less AoE. You might also limit AoE damage, or damage from creating projectiles (Lightning Strike or Molten Strike).

- 1hand Swords: less DPS then daggers, but higher range, maybe even buffing the AoE for attacks like Reave. Basicly, with swords you'd be able to attack the enemy from a (small) distance.

- 1hand Axe: built in bleed effect, much like Ignite. Normal range. The harder you hit, the greater is the bleed effect's AoE. The important part here is that bleed would not be reflected.

- 1hand Mace/Scepter: Like daggers, you have to be close, but instead of daggers maces offer a build-in AoE splash; less effective than Melee Splash, but strong enough so you can use Heavy Strike for instance as an AoE attack without modifying it. The harder you hit, the greater the AoE.

- 2Handers: follow the thought pattern of the 1Hand weapons, but as a catch they all have a built-in AoE effect - for Maces, this AoE effect would be even stronger, naturally.

- 2handers in general can spare AoE support gems and add more DPS support gems. As they offer two potential 6Ls and wouldn't need one dedicated AoE setup anymore, that'd free up space for innovative setups like cast on melee kill or maybe even 2Hand-Melee + Summons, Hybrid caster or anything else you can imagine with 2x 6L.

In other words, imagine 2Handers as a seperate modifier just like dualwielding, where 2Handers add AoE to single target attacks, more AoE to AoE attacks or additional projectiles to projectile attacks. This'd actually be a reason to use 2Handers over 1hand+shield or dual wielding.