NERF freakin daggers

I think I'd rather see a nerf to Accuracy.

Hard hitting crit builds would fall in line with high APS builds and RT builds if it was a made little harder for crit to get high accuracy.

OB: BazzVone - 83 Dual Spork Totem Templar /w CI and minions
CB: BazzVfourteen - 80 Dual Spork Totem Templar /w CI
CB: BazzVtwo - 73 Dual Spork Totem/LS Templar
CB: BazzVseven - 76 Lightning Strike Mara
CB: BazzVfive - 78 Lightning Strike Mara
"
BazzV5 wrote:
I think I'd rather see a nerf to Accuracy.

Hard hitting crit builds would fall in line with high APS builds and RT builds if it was a made little harder for crit to get high accuracy.




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@Bazz: I appreciate the direction your approach would have for overall weapon balance, but the problem is that nothing is more boring in an aRPG than whiffing.
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Step 1: Moan about something that they think needs nerfing.

Step 2: Everything that has been moaned about gets nerfed by GGG.

Step 3: See that everything that has been moaned about has been nerfed...See that there are no current nerf please threads....proceed to step 1 as there positively must be a nerf thread as the PoE forum isn't complete without one.



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daggers are cooler sorry
IGN: SplitEpimorphism
"
LSN wrote:
The state of balance with daggers leaving all other melee weapons behind by far and people defending the position of them (for whatever reason) is a ridiculous one.

I don't know if you have played together with a 400k reave dagger build in a group or not yet. If you had you would know that such dagger builds deal with the highest content in the game faster than you can say "one".

The question is if you want to enable all weapons to create these 400k+ reave dagger builds and the likes or not.
The anser imo is easy: This build (as an example) would be even way overpowered for the existing content in the game with only 150k dps instead of 420k.


Obviously this leaves us only with the option to mainly nerf daggers because they are way too strong and completely out of bounds.

Buffing all melee weapons to this kind of level would simply make everyone feel like dagger elitist (I mirrored a dagger instead of a 2 hand axe you moron and therefore I am better and more intelligent than you and deserve to keep this status). Unfortunately there is no content in the game that requires such high dps at all. If you one hit 78 map bosses or one hit them makes no difference. If you 3 hit or 5 hit them barely does.

I played with a 350k flicker strike dagger recently. I was sure he is playing most of the time alone as the other friend in the group with us was as well walking behind him exclusivly like me. The flicker guy was 1hitting just everything and we were walking behind and watching. Yes lets make all kind of weapons like this please.



What I want to say with this: It is very clear that in the whole picture daggers are way too strong and other weapons maybe only slightly to weak and not the opposite.


the 420k reave u mention has not much to do with the opness of daggers, but rather with how elemental auras scale much better the higher your attack speed (daggers go above 2 base) and the fact that CoE exists (shields can roll over 70% spell dmg).

What do u propose? To limit gg daggers to 100k dps reave by nerfing the base values? How much to nerf em? u can make the base dmg 5-10 for amubhsher and daggers will still be better after rolling the top mods coz of how dmg sources scale in the game.

The biggest problem are not the daggers them selves but rather CoE and ele auras scaling with them.

But who cares? All this talk is for STD elitists, in new leagues daggers are underplayed coz of how hard it is to get them and the cost of such an endeavor.

You cant balance daggers on std and not literally make them unusable in temp leagues.

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"
RagnarokChu wrote:

The optimal choice after diminishing returns is still stack Crit/crit multiplier on the fastest weapon with the base crit chance, and after you are little over the cap you stack other multis such as more attack speed, weapon elemental damage ect all the way to flat damage if you must.

You are still milking it for every last percent you can get, that is what min-maxing is. Also what the hell is comboing crit with "other synergistic" skills. Crit combo with every single skill that can crit because it increases it's damage and applies the status effect automatically. It does not broaden build diversity because if you are intended to build more damage, outside stacking damage of your weapon type/category/elemental/physical type the only way to build from there is crit or attack speed.

By synergistic I wasn't referring solely to maxing DPS, but about actually crafting a well-rounded build for a change. Piling on more and more DPS is futile when you can't get close enough to deliver the melee blow or don't have the crowd control skills to pin down fast moving targets. Here's Poutsos describing exactly what I mean:

"
Poutsos wrote:
When you go crit melee, the only thing that keeps you alive is your leech. Really, after so many points that you need to invest on crit, there is not much room for increasing your defenses. And daggers generaly do shit damage when they do not crit, so it's something that you will not be able to rely on anymore.

The cure for this malady is freeing up a good deal of those skill points that are currently monopolized by the single-minded obsession with crit. That's what diminishing returns would achieve, in addition to reigning in the most excessive cases of DPS overkill.
Last edited by RogueMage on Aug 30, 2014, 5:57:04 AM
"
Cactus_CZ wrote:
NERF NERF everywhere... what about buff to shit skill gems/weapons/whatever instead of NERFING everything and pissing people off ?

Agree. Instead of nerf this and nerf that, it would be better to buff the weaker weapons up to dagger levels. PoE is hard enough (for the 99%) without GGG imposing more nerfs on us. No more... no more!
"You've got to grind, grind, grind at that grindstone..."
Necessity may be the mother of invention, but poor QoP in PoE is the father of frustration.

The perfect solution to fix Trade Chat:
www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2247070
This is why I gave up on 2handed weapons. Why bother when a dagger is the best option AND you can use a shield also.
Yep now i can confirm tha daggers are broken. I 've had my 96 flicker character for so long, and he sure feels OP but i had spent 52 points on offense and have fairly large ES pool due to gear. It felt reasonable due to the risky nature of flicker.
But yesterday out of curiosotity i respeced an abandoned 89level templar, to test spending fewer passives on offense, go balls on ES and use a "safer" skill=double strike. In the end i ve ended up spending 17 points on offense and everything else on defense.
Here's the tree, which is completely unpotimised and would be tons better if it was on a witch:


And here is the gear:
Spoiler


Ended up with 15K+ ES, 600 ES regen per second, 30% block, instant leech and 52K DPS with double strike + melee splash. Definetely an HP non crit user would have no chance in achiving such stats, even with better gear. Daggers suck up to some point, and then become rediculously OP compared to other melee choices after you get geared.
https://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/417287 - Poutsos Flicker Nuke Shadow
Last edited by Poutsos on Aug 30, 2014, 8:48:23 AM

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