would GGG sell license for a "pay to win" server?

I think you mean 'support', not 'mods'. There is most definitely a report post option under my name.

And reporting support to themselves isn't exactly going to do much. You'd be better off emailing support@grindinggear.com with your reports and grievances, since that email is checked by more than just the Support staff member on duty at the time.

Not that any of this is at all relevant to the thread, so that's all I'll say on the matter.

"

GeorgAnatoly wrote:

"

Charan wrote:

"

lolbam wrote:

this games all ready p2w

if winning would be to make it to top of the ladder.... i kno for a fact that most the people in last ladder and this ladder that are top 20 use jsp to buy currency and maps

[broken record]That is not what p2w means in this context but I know you don't care and nothing I say will change your mind and no I don't think what you're saying is untrue it's just not pay to win any more than any other game where you can cheat and deal with shady people to go against the devs' wishes is pay to win
[/broken record]

To be fair though the ladder doesn't care under what context you're trying to ascribe p2w. If it remains true that the top seats consistently go to those who spend real money for them it's still technically p2w regardless of context as the end result remains the same.

Do you really want to go there, Georg? Do you really want to start blurring the line between pay to win as defined in the gaming industry (developer-sanctioned-and-run monetisation of in-game components) and the ability to cheat the game, any online game, with cash outside of the developers' wishes and intentions?

Think very carefully before answering. Or, even better, think very carefully before not answering.

"

Charan wrote:

Do you really want to go there, Georg? Do you really want to start blurring the line between pay to win as defined in the gaming industry (developer-sanctioned-and-run monetisation of in-game components) and the ability to cheat the game, any online game, with cash outside of the developers' wishes and intentions?

Think very carefully before answering. Or, even better, think very carefully before not answering.

I was merely providing some food for thought, I didn't mean to offend you. :)

Oh, goodness. No offence taken. I'm just pointing out it's not really that defensible a position. You can see PoE as pay to win as a player, but that's myopic at best and misleading at the very least. As long as 'pay to win' is a negative term in the industry, and as long as that negativity stems from the fact that it's the developers being greedy bastards about the p2w aspects of their own game, then it is unfair to GGG to call Path of Exile pay to win.

Further, if indeed PoE is p2w because you can go 'off the books' so to speak and play dirty, essentially 'cheat', then please tell me one multiplayer game or even a real life sport that isn't just as potentially pay to win in its own way.

And if you feel they're all pay to win, and many certainly do give you advantages when you put money in, then there's really no point in pointing out that Path of Exile is pay to win by virtue of its high-end players cheating, because, well, that's the standard if everything's pay to win, isn't it?

So sure, it's easy to say 'the game is p2w, people are paying money in jsp to win!', but it's much harder to retain that stance when you actually think about what pay to win means in a world where, everywhere you turn, money can give you an advantage *and it's part of the system*.

At least here, it is not. The only people making PoE p2w, if indeed it is, are the players. The very same players who are here *because* the game isn't inherently pay to win.

Good job, players.

"

Jake_GGG wrote:

"

lolbam wrote:

this games all ready p2w

if winning would be to make it to top of the ladder.... i kno for a fact that most the people in last ladder and this ladder that are top 20 use jsp to buy currency and maps

We are actively targeting players who RMT via jsp. If you could provide us with any evidence at support@grindinggear.com, we would really appreciate your help.

If there are people on d2jsp who have never bought gold in their life, but have FG from just selling items legitimately. How does that make it RMT? A better question, how would you even go about for solid proof for this? Seems to me, it's a waste of time to try to find people on jsp who sell/buy with FG.

Technically speaking, you cannot make that claim that it is really RMT. (I know theres rules regardless of RMT or not and acquiring items outside of the game, but for the RMT's term my point stands).

"

monkuar wrote:

"

Jake_GGG wrote:

"

lolbam wrote:

this games all ready p2w

if winning would be to make it to top of the ladder.... i kno for a fact that most the people in last ladder and this ladder that are top 20 use jsp to buy currency and maps

We are actively targeting players who RMT via jsp. If you could provide us with any evidence at support@grindinggear.com, we would really appreciate your help.

If there are people on d2jsp who have never bought gold in their life, but have FG from just selling items legitimately. How does that make it RMT? A better question, how would you even go about for solid proof for this? Seems to me, it's a waste of time to try to find people on jsp who sell/buy with FG.

Technically speaking, you cannot make that claim that it is really RMT. (I know theres rules regardless of RMT or not and acquiring items outside of the game, but for the RMT's term my point stands).

Im sure the screenshots of items for sale on d2jsp along with screenshots of verified items on the forums by accounts with the same name I sent in would be a decent start, too bad he still plays.

It would make all the sense in the world to get rid of the people being paid to copy paste 'play nice' messages on the forums and hire someone who contacts people from common RMT sites to determine who is serious. You know, since proof isnt enough proof.

"

Jake_GGG wrote:

6. Restrictions: Under no circumstances, without the prior written approval of Grinding Gear Games, may you:

(h) Perform in-game services during your use of the Website, Materials or Services for any form of compensation outside of POE.

See my edit in my post. I know about that, didn't edit in time sorry :)

But, your post:

"

Jake_GGG wrote:

We are actively targeting players who RMT via jsp. If you could provide us with any evidence at support@grindinggear.com, we would really appreciate your help.

"Actively targeting players who RMT Via jsp" is not correct. Because you cannot prove that a user with FG derived that gold from a purchase from d2jsp or from a legitimate sale. However, since it is technically illegal under (H) above; It's still wrong. I'm not saying it's not wrong, but saying "RMT Via jsp" technically is.

"

monkuar wrote:

"Actively targeting players who RMT Via jsp" is not correct. Because you cannot prove that a user with FG derived that gold from a purchase from d2jsp or from a legitimate sale. However, since it is technically illegal under (H) above; It's still wrong. I'm not saying it's not wrong, but saying "RMT Via jsp" technically is.

"

Chris wrote:

Real Money/External Trading

Buying and selling items or accounts for real money or external currencies (such as Forum Gold) is not allowed and we will ban people who attempt to engage in it in-game or on the pathofexile.com forums.

The following things are examples of behaviour that could get you banned under this rule:

• Posting a trade thread where you ask for things other than Path of Exile items in exchange for your gear.
• Offering people money or external currencies in exchange for their Path of Exile items or accounts.
• Advertising external item sales sites. It's best to avoid mentioning them by name.
• Running a service where you sell items or accounts to people for things other than Path of Exile items.

It doesn't have to be bought/sold with real money, GGG's use of the word RMT also includes external trading.

"

Jake_GGG wrote:

"

lolbam wrote:

this games all ready p2w

if winning would be to make it to top of the ladder.... i kno for a fact that most the people in last ladder and this ladder that are top 20 use jsp to buy currency and maps

We are actively targeting players who RMT via jsp. If you could provide us with any evidence at support@grindinggear.com, we would really appreciate your help.

Oh really ? Actively ?

I have a friend who uses jsp since Open Beta.

He is still playing.

I guess you are just trying to fear people, but people who use jsp know they won't get banned.