Invasion League - Clearly not overtuned.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Perhaps the phrase "session termination" is more appropriate.

Your session on the client or your characters session on the server?
Words, man, they suck :(
Why not just say what you really meant anyway: There is no (reasonable) way to prevent the player from closing the client.

At least you don't think that it's impossible for a character to stay logged in when the user is not, i was getting a bit concerned there when i originally read the post i responded to.

I just want to sya, i am done banging my head on this wall of a league. There is NO fun in it, constantly running from Bosses. I refuse to cheat and make special logout hotkeys, to me, that defeats the point of trying to PLAY the game. There should NOT be mobs in any level, yet alone normal or cruel, that can decimate any correctly leveled and decent enough gear to kill piety and or Dom, and yet get knocked the hell out by random bosses in mini zones. I was hoping for fun and challenge, NOT a migraine headache for gods sake. I am sick and tired of wasting my time leveling and redoing these quests, just to constantly play in fear of what is around the corner.

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MasterAxe wrote:

I just want to sya, i am done banging my head on this wall of a league. There is NO fun in it, constantly running from Bosses. I refuse to cheat and make special logout hotkeys, to me, that defeats the point of trying to PLAY the game. There should NOT be mobs in any level, yet alone normal or cruel, that can decimate any correctly leveled and decent enough gear to kill piety and or Dom, and yet get knocked the hell out by random bosses in mini zones. I was hoping for fun and challenge, NOT a migraine headache for gods sake. I am sick and tired of wasting my time leveling and redoing these quests, just to constantly play in fear of what is around the corner.

Well to be fair if you don't want to play in fear of what's around of corner and dying why are you playing hardcore?

I mean I'm all for making them not overtuned but I have no idea why people period want to be hardcore but don't actually really like the fact that they can die.

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Xendran wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

Perhaps the phrase "session termination" is more appropriate.

Your session on the client or your characters session on the server?
Words, man, they suck :(
Why not just say what you really meant anyway: There is no (reasonable) way to prevent the player from closing the client.

At least you don't think that it's impossible for a character to stay logged in when the user is not, i was getting a bit concerned there when i originally read the post i responded to.

Well basically the problem is the same, regardless of how you word it. If the client is closed you don't know why. You don't know why the client isn't responding anymore. And since you can't know such things it is propably safer to assume that the player lags the ability to keep on playing and log him out to prevent any harm. I actually never died in PoE to a crash of my client, because when it crashed the game logged me out immidiatly.

I don't care if people use this feature in hardcore to trick death, only a minority of players plays hardcore, so it isn't reasonable to change it. I'm not even sure how high the amount of hardcore-players is that uses Alt-F4, since a lot of situations allow for simply running away or portalling out and Alt-F4 is mainly necessary in desync-issues which shouldn't be there in the first place. Of course Invasion might make Alt-F4 more important again, but even though a lot of the bosses are really dangerous I doubt that you are unable to portal out in most of the situations sometimes you might even be able to just walk away.

Although corrupted area-bosses and invasion-bosses are very similar as it seems they there is one important difference. Yes some of the corrupted bosses are impossible or almost impossible to defeat for certain builds. However if you want to face Atziri you can easily choose which corrupted area you want to farm and which of these bosses fits you build the most. Invasion however just throws random bosses at you with often the only option being quick retreat. I can't see some builds handling some of these bosses, even though the same builds might have no problem in maps and the normal content.

The big problem I see in Invasion is that you basically need a build that can face all these invasion-bosses or at least being able to run away from them. That propably limits diversity by a lot. Before there were some bosses or exspecially rogue-exiles that were troublesome but you always had the choice of avoiding them.

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Of course Invasion might make Alt-F4 more important again,

Just a fun fact: So i played invasion up until the most recent patch.
I have alt F4ed in invasion in that small time period more than on all of my other characters combined, which includes but is not limited to:

Closed Beta
LS Marauder
LS Templar 1
LS Templar 2
Bow Templar 1
Bow Templar 2
Bow Marauder
TurboTank

Open Beta
Bow Marauder
Bow Witch

Release
AOF 2h 1
AOF 2h 2
AOF 2h 3
AOF 2h 4
Spectral Dagger Crit
Facebreaker
Split Arrow Crit


I got pretty unlucky with my invaders, and constantly got ridiculous ones. When your movespeed is in the negatives and you're using an HDD, portalling is not going to be a good idea.

I switched to ambush because i realized invasion actually detracts from the game and in no way improves it.
It's nothing more than bosses to skip and more mobs to get desynced on.
The invasion bosses are never worth killing unless you can instantly kill them, because the easy ones just waste your time which could be spent killing other things.

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RagnarokChu wrote:

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MasterAxe wrote:

I just want to sya, i am done banging my head on this wall of a league. There is NO fun in it, constantly running from Bosses. I refuse to cheat and make special logout hotkeys, to me, that defeats the point of trying to PLAY the game. There should NOT be mobs in any level, yet alone normal or cruel, that can decimate any correctly leveled and decent enough gear to kill piety and or Dom, and yet get knocked the hell out by random bosses in mini zones. I was hoping for fun and challenge, NOT a migraine headache for gods sake. I am sick and tired of wasting my time leveling and redoing these quests, just to constantly play in fear of what is around the corner.

Well to be fair if you don't want to play in fear of what's around of corner and dying why are you playing hardcore?

I mean I'm all for making them not overtuned but I have no idea why people period want to be hardcore but don't actually really like the fact that they can die.

There is a difference of dieing from my own mistakes, or an occasional OP MOB, and the NOW league of OP random MOBS EVERY FREAKING ZONE. i dont mind dieing and rerolling when i screw up, or even an occasional lag/desync, but when i am constantly having to reroll because of mobs that require you to be 10+ levels over leveled and geared just to even think about taking them on, is ludacris. Running away is NOT a fun ingame activity, and not one of my better abilities. I feel if i am level 24, playing in a level 24 zone, there should only be a challenge easily overcame by game play, NOT level 40 and gear for level 40, and there should NOT be any mob that scares EVERYONE who is appropriate level to run on sight.

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Emphasy wrote:

Well basically the problem is the same, regardless of how you word it. If the client is closed you don't know why. You don't know why the client isn't responding anymore. And since you can't know such things it is propably safer to assume that the player lags the ability to keep on playing and log him out to prevent any harm.

On Windows it should be possible for PoE to launch a separate process that monitors the state of the client process. When the client terminates for any reason, the monitor process can then send an affirmative logout request to the server to terminate the client's session. This would make no difference when the player is in-town outside of a game instance. But if the logout request is received while a game instance is running, the server would recognize this as equivalent to an Alt-F4. A client that went silent due to a power outage or network failure would be unable to send a logout request from the monitor process.

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RogueMage wrote:

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Emphasy wrote:

Well basically the problem is the same, regardless of how you word it. If the client is closed you don't know why. You don't know why the client isn't responding anymore. And since you can't know such things it is propably safer to assume that the player lags the ability to keep on playing and log him out to prevent any harm.

On Windows it should be possible for PoE to launch a separate process that monitors the state of the client process. When the client terminates for any reason, the monitor process can then send an affirmative logout request to the server to terminate the client's session. This would make no difference when the player is in-town outside of a game instance. But if the logout request is received while a game instance is running, the server would recognize this as equivalent to an Alt-F4. A client that went silent due to a power outage or network failure would be unable to send a logout request from the monitor process.

People would just need to have a script/programm that handle that, it would be quickly circumvented most likely.

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Fruz wrote:

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RogueMage wrote:

...if the logout request is received while a game instance is running, the server would recognize this as equivalent to an Alt-F4. A client that went silent due to a power outage or network failure would be unable to send a logout request from the monitor process.

People would just need to have a script/programm that handle that, it would be quickly circumvented most likely.

No, the idea is that you'd want the server to get the message that you've intentionally logged out of the client, so it can terminate the session ASAP. GGG have made it clear that Alt-F4 is a legitimate combat tactic, and this would make it a safer option for Hardcore.

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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Xendran wrote:

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

There's no such thing as preventing logouts.

Sorry but this made me laugh really hard, and makes me think that you may not have any previous experience with online games.

It's called being online on the server without the client being there. Happens in tons of game. Client crashes, character remains in game, sometimes long enough that it can hinder your next login attempt.

You can't prevent client shutdowns. You can prevent logging out.

Either that, or the way you worded it was just incorrect. That may be a possibility.

I think it's very important to remember that the game is played by players, and not by servers. As such, no, when there is a power outage, you are not logged in. The server may give you the status of "logged in," it may treat you as if you are logged in, and your character may suffer consequences as a result. But you're not.

Now in terms of terminology, you're probably right. After all, the word "log" means a register, which implies that one is registered with someone. Perhaps the phrase "session termination" is more appropriate.

See this is why ScrotieMcB posts drive me insane sometimes. Even if the facts within are legit, it's just not relevant one way or the other, try to see the forest through the trees man. I generally only post facts that actually apply to the topic. Whether or not the client is open is just mincing words, we all know what the intent is and in fact the actual terminology was probably accurate anyways.

Having said that though, I think this game would be balanced a lot better if it were impossible to save your character with alt-f4 and the game was built with that in mind, instead of built around the alt-f4 mindset.