GZ FranzKafka, First level 100 on nemesis league!

Poasting in a thread about GGG being lazy and not getting their priorities right. Like stop adding shitty skills and fix buggy ones for example.

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knac84 wrote:

Poasting in a thread about GGG being lazy and not getting their priorities right. Like stop adding shitty skills and fix buggy ones for example.

That's an universal problem. It is far more sexy to announce that you have this new cool project you are working on, rather than to announce that you are spending money on maintenance.

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Qarl wrote:

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elvorette wrote:

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dorkrocktwo wrote:

Cast on Death, interesting. Unless there's going to be a super rare resurrection gem I doubt that will be used in HC/Nem.

Awesome gems, very happy to see Cast on Crit.

It's monster death, not player death

It is cast on player death. We don't really expect this one to be too popular in Hardcore.

But it was :)

Grats on 100. Nice character name.

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mazul wrote:

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knac84 wrote:

Poasting in a thread about GGG being lazy and not getting their priorities right. Like stop adding shitty skills and fix buggy ones for example.

That's an universal problem. It is far more sexy to announce that you have this new cool project you are working on, rather than to announce that you are spending money on maintenance.

Sadly true, but I would question what is the best marketing strategy for GGG, unfortunately I don't have information on their income distribution.


However I suspect that most of GGG income comes from 'dedicated players', which are by definition usually more informed about the game and less likely to be impressed by such tricks. It definitively makes me want to spend less on the game when I read about stuff like this than if I read that is being fixed shortly after being acknowledged. Or maybe just an statement about using a gem a way is not intended to being exploitative behaviour.

But who knows, maybe in the twisted world of CW he finds it is amazing and fun, as I've read/listen in some interview statements that seem to point that way.

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FranzKafka wrote:

And I don't feel attacked - I just feel that people are myopically commenting on this whole situation. It's as if they don't realize that I made it to lvl 98 on HC w.o this bug while playing melee since lvl 1 =(

That is actually very impressive! Gratz on that achievement. It is just a shame that you had to associate yourself with the abusers because if you had not, your achievement would have been far greater than it is now. Let's face it, if you hadn't grouped, you would not have reached level 100 before him.


Also, I'm not sure why people have been trying to defend the abuse of this bug/exploit on the account that it is the "clever use of game mechanics". It is anything but.

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Qarl wrote:

Regarding the abusing mechanics, we don't want players to be second guessing whether they are allowed to make a character in a specific way.

As the games high level content requires you to be using the mechanics to your advantage, it would be a bad precedent to set banning some uses of mechanics.

If there is an abusable mechanic, like the stun lock, it is on us (the game designers) to make sure it cannot be abused.

Stun is a game mechanic, same as status ailments (Freeze, Ignite, Shock - which was then subsequently nerfed due to spork).

An OP build is one that uses intended game mechanics extremely effectively and to its advantage. Being able to stun mobs was within the legitimate boundaries of this game's mechanics because it was intended. Being able to stunlock rares and uniques indefinitely although overpowered, was still a clever use of intended game mechanics.

Freeze mine although overpowered, was still working as intended before the nerf as everything it did, it did exactly as what the gem said.

Baker's achievement as a level 100 HC player, although due to playing an overpowered build, was still within the legitimate boundaries of this game's intended mechanics.

Pain attunement for instance provided More spell damage.
Righteous fire as well provided More spell damage.

The moment Zealot's oath came out, it was inevitable that someone would attempt to make both work. It did, and then GGG released Shavs, knowing full well that it would likely be used in combination with the above two.

Although an overpowered combination, and arguably an unintended combination use of the above keystones/gems, it was still based on intended game mechanics.

This exploit was anything but - it was an exploit of a bug - a bug because this was not an intended game mechanic. Even the wording on the COD gem itself is clear. It is clearly meant to be used on death, and traps and mines do not die. They get triggered or detonated.

I would expect most long term players in POE to really be able to tell the difference.

I am perfectly fine, even respectful of people being clever enough to find a bug, exploit it and then reporting it immediately (which was what Kripp would have done, although he might also have had other motivations for doing so). This however was a case of finding a bug, keeping hush-hush about it, while exploiting it for personal gain.

I do not expect nor do I want any action to be taken against the exploiters, as I do feel tat GGG was also at fault here, but nor do I expect people to actually laud the "achievements" of people who abuse bugs. It reflects a sad state of this community if "cheating to win" becomes expected amongst top players and anyone who finds a better way of cheating automatically enters the ranks of a "good player". It insults the good players.

Gratz mang, was fun playing with you some this league. Lookin forward to playing with you again next league.

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FranzKafka wrote:

(QUOTE FROM ANGRYWEASEL)

My post was not directed to you in any way if it should be directed at anyone it should be directed at HvR he would not have the position he has now if it hadn't been for that bug abuse. But nevermind that my post was never meant to point fingers but more to say that GGG should do more actively to make sure this doesn't happen for so long in future leagues.

But I guess you don't care what I actually wrote and just wants to feel attacked?

You got to where you where mostly without the aid of HvR so congrats to you its still very noteworthy but not sure you would have gotten #1 without that aid but that is all theory and not really worth our time :)

Gz on 100 either way
(QUOTED FROM ANGRY WEASEL (SOme bug wouldn't let me quote him directly through the website)

This is true and thanks for the GZ =)
And I don't feel attacked - I just feel that people are myopically commenting on this whole situation. It's as if they don't realize that I made it to lvl 98 on HC w.o this bug while playing melee since lvl 1 =(

Are you krip's smurf

gg bjd(bjb is all lies!)

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Invalesco wrote:

Stun is a game mechanic, same as status ailments (Freeze, Ignite, Shock - which was then subsequently nerfed due to spork).

An OP build is one that uses intended game mechanics extremely effectively and to its advantage. Being able to stun mobs was within the legitimate boundaries of this game's mechanics because it was intended. Being able to stunlock rares and uniques indefinitely although overpowered, was still a clever use of intended game mechanics.

Freeze mine although overpowered, was still working as intended before the nerf as everything it did, it did exactly as what the gem said.

Baker's achievement as a level 100 HC player, although due to playing an overpowered build, was still within the legitimate boundaries of this game's intended mechanics.

Pain attunement for instance provided More spell damage.
Righteous fire as well provided More spell damage.

The moment Zealot's oath came out, it was inevitable that someone would attempt to make both work. It did, and then GGG released Shavs, knowing full well that it would likely be used in combination with the above two.

Although an overpowered combination, and arguably an unintended combination use of the above keystones/gems, it was still based on intended game mechanics.

This exploit was anything but - it was an exploit of a bug - a bug because this was not an intended game mechanic. Even the wording on the COD gem itself is clear. It is clearly meant to be used on death, and traps and mines do not die. They get triggered or detonated.

I would expect most long term players in POE to really be able to tell the difference.

I see why you think there is a difference. I don't think being able to reduce boss stun thresholds to zero was an actual intended mechanic though, and the fact they fixed it as quickly as they could is evidence of that. Yes, Stun is an intended mechanic, but it was being used in an unintended way, much like COD (I mean the gem, not the fish).

As I said eariler in the thread, I have a lot of respect for you and I understand why someone like you who has spent so much time putting together OP builds based on intended mechanics would feel frustrated seeing someone succeeding by playing a different way, but overall I still think the guy deserves a lot of credit, and I don't feel any shame in giving it to him.

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MonstaMunch wrote:

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Invalesco wrote:

Stun is a game mechanic, same as status ailments (Freeze, Ignite, Shock - which was then subsequently nerfed due to spork).

An OP build is one that uses intended game mechanics extremely effectively and to its advantage. Being able to stun mobs was within the legitimate boundaries of this game's mechanics because it was intended. Being able to stunlock rares and uniques indefinitely although overpowered, was still a clever use of intended game mechanics.

Freeze mine although overpowered, was still working as intended before the nerf as everything it did, it did exactly as what the gem said.

Baker's achievement as a level 100 HC player, although due to playing an overpowered build, was still within the legitimate boundaries of this game's intended mechanics.

Pain attunement for instance provided More spell damage.
Righteous fire as well provided More spell damage.

The moment Zealot's oath came out, it was inevitable that someone would attempt to make both work. It did, and then GGG released Shavs, knowing full well that it would likely be used in combination with the above two.

Although an overpowered combination, and arguably an unintended combination use of the above keystones/gems, it was still based on intended game mechanics.

This exploit was anything but - it was an exploit of a bug - a bug because this was not an intended game mechanic. Even the wording on the COD gem itself is clear. It is clearly meant to be used on death, and traps and mines do not die. They get triggered or detonated.

I would expect most long term players in POE to really be able to tell the difference.

I see why you think there is a difference. I don't think being able to reduce boss stun thresholds to zero was an actual intended mechanic though, and the fact they fixed it as quickly as they could is evidence of that. Yes, Stun is an intended mechanic, but it was being used in an unintended way, much like COD (I mean the gem, not the fish).

As I said eariler in the thread, I have a lot of respect for you and I understand why someone like you who has spent so much time putting together OP builds based on intended mechanics would feel frustrated seeing someone succeeding by playing a different way, but overall I still think the guy deserves a lot of credit, and I don't feel any shame in giving it to him.

Agreed, not being able to reduce boss stun thresholds to zero was probably not intended, but it was still an unintended amplification of an otherwise intended mechanic.

I like the way you've managed to divert this back onto the topic of fishing ;)

COD is not an intended mechanic. It is a bugged skill gem. It is completely unrelated. The way it is being abused is not even a mechanic to begin with, much less intended or unintended. It cannot be a clever use of game mechanics when it isn't even a mechanic.

I appreciate your compliment, but please do not associate me with a bug exploiter - our purposes were completely different. I put together OP builds for the sake of making the builds themselves and not for any other purpose other than that. After that, I published them and let others have their fun. That was me done. This guy did not create an OP build. There was nothing in this build that would have been considered OP. All he did was exploit a bug, a broken gem to reach level 100 and involved others around him as well.

I'm talking about Havoc of course, not FranzKafka, who by all accounts deserves credit for having reached L98 as a melee player, of which I will not deny him of.