D3 vs Poe: Which has worse itemization?

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theeze wrote:

1.1 failed, as nothing has changed since OB, yeah you do have more support gems to deal with but it's still a pain in the ass to have to go through their broken RNG.

No offense, but all I see is one lvl17 character in 1.1. How would you know if 1.1 has failed? Hell, even if you had a lvl80 char in Invasion it would still be too early to tell if 1.1 has failed.

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Before anyone jumps on me and says RNG is RNG, D3 2.0 has RNG but it's much more realistic in terns of when you'll get an upgrade.

In D3 out of 100 elite mobs, you're likely to get an upgrade that suits your build and class. In POE you might get something decent after 400 mob kills and still not suit your build and end up being vendor trash. More than likely it'll be a blue drop or an underwhelming 4L rare.

The point is, D3 is headed in the right direction, it's not quite there yet but it's at least taking the necessary steps.

Disagree. It's not the 'right' direction, it's the 'easier' direction. Finding upgrades frequently and making gold BoA is basically catering to newbs so they spend money on the expansion. All the 'normal' players will get sick of not being able to find any upgrades due to topping out - in 3 months, RoS will be populated either by 1) ultra hardcore players who love the game.. ie Druin, Reaper666 or 2) newbies who play for an hour every day or two and are slowly progressing through the game.

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POE in it's current state is where D3 was in it's release. Influencing RMT with it's tedious drop rates. Do they really think the majority is gonna spend 12 hours a day farming for a piece? They ignored the request of an SFL league, while D3 with Bind on Account and the removal of the AH has become self-found. Guess which one is getting all the attention?

Not even close. Release d3 was unplayable, even after they lowered difficulty as well as fixed some OP mechanics (ias), it was a huge struggle - the game was and still is dominated by ~3 cookie cutter builds per class. The SFL/BOA bullshit was began by whiny kids who were jealous of what others had. You want to play SF? Don't trade. How hard is that to understand?
And you think d3 is getting "all the attention"? Are you serious? I have a plvl209 in d3, originally with all 5 classes of plvl70+, still keep in touch with some people in d3. Guess how many times I've heard about RoS? It rarely comes up in conversations.

And think of it this way, after they deployed loot 2.0 almost all of the old gear became irrelevant, which brought people back to hunt for new gear. There should have been MILLIONS of people coming back. I logged in 2 days ago into d3 to find 5 of my friends online - out of the original full friendlist full of very active, high plvl players.

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It's has nothing to do with being hardcore or casual, it's about not having the same amount of time as if we were still 13 years old.

This is the crux of the issue for you. It actually IS about being casual. Since you don't have time to play as often as most of the population, you think RNG is crap, while D3 is rewarding casual play with Loot 2.0.

Don't get me wrong, I'm in my late 20s with a live-in gf and a full time job, so I feel your pain.

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j0zef wrote:

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theeze wrote:

1.1 failed, as nothing has changed since OB, yeah you do have more support gems to deal with but it's still a pain in the ass to have to go through their broken RNG.

No offense, but all I see is one lvl17 character in 1.1. How would you know if 1.1 has failed? Hell, even if you had a lvl80 char in Invasion it would still be too early to tell if 1.1 has failed.

"

Before anyone jumps on me and says RNG is RNG, D3 2.0 has RNG but it's much more realistic in terns of when you'll get an upgrade.

In D3 out of 100 elite mobs, you're likely to get an upgrade that suits your build and class. In POE you might get something decent after 400 mob kills and still not suit your build and end up being vendor trash. More than likely it'll be a blue drop or an underwhelming 4L rare.

The point is, D3 is headed in the right direction, it's not quite there yet but it's at least taking the necessary steps.

Disagree. It's not the 'right' direction, it's the 'easier' direction. Finding upgrades frequently and making gold BoA is basically catering to newbs so they spend money on the expansion. All the 'normal' players will get sick of not being able to find any upgrades due to topping out - in 3 months, RoS will be populated either by 1) ultra hardcore players who love the game.. ie Druin, Reaper666 or 2) newbies who play for an hour every day or two and are slowly progressing through the game.

"

POE in it's current state is where D3 was in it's release. Influencing RMT with it's tedious drop rates. Do they really think the majority is gonna spend 12 hours a day farming for a piece? They ignored the request of an SFL league, while D3 with Bind on Account and the removal of the AH has become self-found. Guess which one is getting all the attention?

Not even close. Release d3 was unplayable, even after they lowered difficulty as well as fixed some OP mechanics (ias), it was a huge struggle - the game was and still is dominated by ~3 cookie cutter builds per class. The SFL/BOA bullshit was began by whiny kids who were jealous of what others had. You want to play SF? Don't trade. How hard is that to understand?
And you think d3 is getting "all the attention"? Are you serious? I have a plvl209 in d3, originally with all 5 classes of plvl70+, still keep in touch with some people in d3. Guess how many times I've heard about RoS? It rarely comes up in conversations.

And think of it this way, after they deployed loot 2.0 almost all of the old gear became irrelevant, which brought people back to hunt for new gear. There should have been MILLIONS of people coming back. I logged in 2 days ago into d3 to find 5 of my friends online - out of the original full friendlist full of very active, high plvl players.

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It's has nothing to do with being hardcore or casual, it's about not having the same amount of time as if we were still 13 years old.

This is the crux of the issue for you. It actually IS about being casual. Since you don't have time to play as often as most of the population, you think RNG is crap, while D3 is rewarding casual play with Loot 2.0.

Don't get me wrong, I'm in my late 20s with a live-in gf and a full time job, so I feel your pain.

To be fair, I've wanted a fresh start, so I got rid of my standard characters, I had a facebreaker build, summoner, dual spork, Split arrow and the tanky templar.

I've enjoyed all of them but in order to get there, I had to go through a marauder groundslam build which I was bored out of mind but grinded it out and then split arrow build with a duelist.

The combined, efforts of these two made me afford some gear of builds I actually wanted to play. Such as a face breaker for instance.

There was no chance I would be able to try that build with one run...isn't the point of the game to be challenged yet have fun doing it? Why must you go through a chore process before finally getting to play the build you've wanted?

Don't think I'm bashing this game and praising Blizzard like they are god's gift. I love that POE stuck to it's true roots but it needs better execution. I still log on from time to tome, but when something feels like a chore, you should stop playing or try another build.

It would be easier to just make a character in standard and just roll with the gear I have in the stash, but I'm looking at it for what it is for someone starting out. Like I've said before I have enough currency in the stash in standard but for someone starting out it's intimidating, even D2 LOD wasn't this punishing.

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Morgoth2356 wrote:

So true. Almost every person in this post claiming itemization is better in D3 says "In D3 I know I can find upgrade in xxx amount of time, in PoE i get shit all the time". It has nothing to do with itemization.

Considering the OP

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sammuelsedai wrote:

I see complaints about D3 itemization all the time on the D3 forums: Can't find good upgrades from drops and prices for good gear on the AH are sky high because of flippers.

Poe was suppose to fix all of that, but instead I see the same complaints on the POE forums: Spent all my currency and couldn't roll a 6L and prices for good gear are sky high because of flippers.

Which game is more frustrating to gear up?

Well the OP does ask this question:

"Which game is more frustrating to gear up?"

And considering the entire thoughts in the OP, it's not rocket science why players are answering the way they are.

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Baskerville wrote:

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Morgoth2356 wrote:

So true. Almost every person in this post claiming itemization is better in D3 says "In D3 I know I can find upgrade in xxx amount of time, in PoE i get shit all the time". It has nothing to do with itemization.

Considering the OP

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sammuelsedai wrote:

I see complaints about D3 itemization all the time on the D3 forums: Can't find good upgrades from drops and prices for good gear on the AH are sky high because of flippers.

Poe was suppose to fix all of that, but instead I see the same complaints on the POE forums: Spent all my currency and couldn't roll a 6L and prices for good gear are sky high because of flippers.

Which game is more frustrating to gear up?

Well the OP does ask this question:

"Which game is more frustrating to gear up?"

And considering the entire thoughts in the OP, it's not rocket science why players are answering the way they are.

And it changes nothing to the fact that is has nothing to do with itemization.

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theeze wrote:

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majesw wrote:

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theeze wrote:

In D3 out of 100 elite mobs, you're likely to get an upgrade that suits your build and class. In POE you might get something decent after 400 mob kills and still not suit your build and end up being vendor trash. More than likely it'll be a blue drop or an underwhelming 4L rare.

No... I get no upgrades in D3 or PoE from playing... This happens when you've reached end-game in all ARPGs. They just can't drop you better items. Only problem is that in D3 I can't trade for anything better...

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theeze wrote:

POE in it's current state is where D3 was in it's release. Influencing RMT with it's tedious drop rates. Do they really think the majority is gonna spend 12 hours a day farming for a piece? They ignored the request of an SFL league, while D3 with Bind on Account and the removal of the AH has become self-found. Guess which one is getting all the attention?

This is a joke. PoE is miles beyond where D3 is NOW... PoE actually has multiple builds that you can go back and explore, and items that make you want to do that. The end-game of both PoE and D3 needs work, but at least PoE makes me want to go back and make new characters.

How many of these diverse builds are usuable to someone who's just starting out? For Me or You, it's not a big deal, we've accumulated enough since OB but how limited are the newcomers?

The fact you can't fully respec for a fee is why they lean towards cookie cutter builds in which they can't even afford. They don't want to make mistakes which screws up their build to the point where it's not even worth using respec points.

You can talk about diversity all you want but the majority on here use cookie cutter builds, because they are most viable.

I got these after 3 days and you can all use every single of them in a a build thats completely difference from eachother and cost almost nothing:

I've given up on both POE and D3 for Grim Dawn and Darksouls 2.

So far so good,can't complain about itemization with those two games.

I'll keep my eye on POE for future updates and the hilarity of reading solo/self found threads (in which they are all mostly trading and/or partying lol) and also for the cuteness of the blind boy defense brigade.


Cheers big ears

Temper

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Temper wrote:

I've given up on both POE and D3 for Grim Dawn and Darksouls 2.

So far so good,can't complain about itemization with those two games.

I'll keep my eye on POE for future updates and the hilarity of reading solo/self found threads (in which they are all mostly trading and/or partying lol) and also for the cuteness of the blind boy defense brigade.


Cheers big ears

Temper

So cute, someone who has nothing better to do than reading and making fun of the forums from a game he quit.

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Morgoth2356 wrote:

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Temper wrote:

I've given up on both POE and D3 for Grim Dawn and Darksouls 2.

So far so good,can't complain about itemization with those two games.

I'll keep my eye on POE for future updates and the hilarity of reading solo/self found threads (in which they are all mostly trading and/or partying lol) and also for the cuteness of the blind boy defense brigade.


Cheers big ears

Temper

So cute, someone who has nothing better to do than reading and making fun of the forums from a game he quit.

Even cuter is the guy/girl that replies. =)

EDIT: Unlike some,a few of us may stay interested in the games future and try to stay in the loop.

Something I said upset you ?

A heads up,not presently playing the game does not evict someone from the forum community,especially in an always online experience.

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Rai wrote:

You're delusional, up to date, there are still people using the AH, real money and all. But you can keep spewin your garbage. They are removing the ah because the AH created a delimma where there was mass amount of items out on servers so they created drop manipulation around the AH. Without AHs they can have more useful drops drop more frequently. And FYI, the itemization they're using now is what they used on system games to see how people would like it and apparently enoug people did (I personally did not like gear progression on xbox). People threatened to not buy xpac unless AH was removed so they all came here, after seeing how dated the trade system is, started asking for an AH.


And I love the way people try to demonize for profit companies. Get a fucking clue. Yes they will continue to make changes to get more money, maybe GGG should pick up on this. There are ways up ramp up profit without abandoning your mission. According to everyone here, blizzards mission is to make money and it's working because they'll be getting my $40. Mission accomplished.

Yep, still were some people using D3 real-money AH alright - those that have more $$ than brains to somehow justify that they wasted their initial cash on a POS title. And that pool of idiots was getting smaller by the day. Most gamers I know either never bought D3 because of the AH, or left it soon after purchase. Apparently, Blizzard's AH "delimma" [sic] wasn't bad enough for a whole year and 1/2 (lol!)...until they tired of the sales curve dropping and had to try salvaging what little is left of D3's failed rep.

Denial: it's not just a river in Egypt.

But you can continue to buy the Blizz propaganda, and their shit products. GG. However, there is a difference between a reasonable profit and screwing the pooch from insatiable greed. That's all Blizz does now.

After making 20+ lvl 85 characters in diablo 2 I had a huge hype for d3.
But in the end I played 200 hours on one char then got bored out of my mind and never picked it up again.

In PoE I've got 20 characters lvl 40+ and I'm constantly making new ones trying out new builds/gear strategies.

Not all the strategies are self made of course, but that's what makes PoE so awesome, the ability to build different characters based on getting a single item (like the sun-belt trapper build) is amazing.

Using the excuse that you need a 5 link or 6 link to make a character viable to do end game is just bs, you can make both melee / ranged / totem / caster builds with only 4 link gear.
Being unable to make the perfectly optimized build of supreme damage due to not having a 6 link does not make the <6 link builds unplayable, as long as you can progress / kill stuff a build is viable.

BUT every build should not be able to do everything, and if anyone makes a build dependent on getting a 6 link (without having the currency/6 link beforehand), that just makes the person stupid.

Myself like many others started with a searing totem build because it's a viable (but not ultimate) build thats cheap to make and doesn't rely on sockets (but gets a huge boost from + to fire gems gear), there are many other builds that also doesn't require any special items to play, but also uber expensive builds that require multiple high cost items.

Compare this to D2, how many actual self found enigma armors do you think there was ?.
With 8000+ hours I never found a zod for example, did that mean I didn't trade for zods ?, no ofcourse not.
And was a enigma armor necessary for your every day player ? (like 6l) hell no but for the occasional player wanting to make a pvp bone necromancer it was the minimum requirement.

This is what itemization is, having or not having items served on a platter is irrelevant, the issue is about having the possibility to access items that would allow something or a build that wasn't doable without the item in question and in such a way further increasing the number of possible builds that are doable.

The 6l cookie cutter builds are supposed to be the odd ones out and not the minimum standard everyone should aim for.
No one started D2 aiming to make a full rune-word geared smiter as their first character, the same is true for PoE, make characters and plan them dependent on the gear you have access to and not on your ultimate dream gear and then get angry when your ultimate dream gear ends up actually being hard to get.