Why is GGG caving in to casuals' demands?

I didn't read all of this, seems like its stemming from the ability to choose loot options in a party? How has this gotten so many replies...

Anywho. PoE's only 'non-casual' component is the RNG which increases the need to grind for hours. That's the only thing that isn't casual about it. So, get off the soap box.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

Several of my friends have left PoE over the last season. Nobody was protesting "loot options" as a reason or anything like that... (Several of them even liked PA) I still play PA in pub games because that’s what everyone else does - so whatever. They left because it was not fun anymore. Nobody felt the need to team up and really work together, anyone of us could just join pub games and there was hardly any difference.

No disrespect is intended, but if you find public games to be equal to playing with friends, that sounds like either you or your friends had pretty terrible characters. There is a massive different for a lot of people, I believe even the majority, though my evidence for that would be anecdotal.

all this desync qq lol

i facepalm irl

stfu and play the game

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geniusbean wrote:

all this desync qq lol

i facepalm irl

stfu and go away

Fixed!

Really? PA is a problem? PA is one of the main things I like about this game. With friends we will play SA or sometime FFA but teaming up with other people idk would make it near impossible for my ranged characters to get any good loot if PA wasnt in. My most hated thing about D2 and d2:LoD was that lag or range made me lose out on the best items every freaking time.

While I agree that a game designer should not always listen to their community, take a look at MWO to see just how bad it can be when there is a total disconnect between what the players want and what the devs do. They keep adding more mechs($500 dollars for a gold skinned mech, to be delivered 7 months from now...), but what the fans want is end-game content and balance fixes. Things they promised but have delayed for over 2 years.

GGG are not designing this game for hardcore players or casuals specifically. They are not designing this game for themselves. They are designing it for fans of diablo-like ARPG and many more players would rather have the OPTION for PA. Sorry if your personal experience is somehow lessened because most players do not agree with you.

Also hardcore gaming does not necessarily mean cut-throat gaming.

I mean how are they supposed to succeed when they don't listen to their customers? There may be a disconnect between what consumers want and what will make their game more fun at times(consumers are not game designers), but in the end its the consumer who spends the money that supports their company.

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reboticon wrote:

No disrespect is intended, but if you find public games to be equal to playing with friends, that sounds like either you or your friends had pretty terrible characters. There is a massive different for a lot of people, I believe even the majority, though my evidence for that would be anecdotal.

I don't think this is connected to friends having terrible characters, as much as it is people who are simply not fun to play with, Rebo.
I played several public Ledge-farming parties, where people stopped to help a party member in trouble, had some (very short) form of chat going on, and left loot for each other based on character and (visually-apparent) build.

though it's impossible to beat the "fun factor" of the "map-team" we had with Morbo, Bill and Anuhart so long ago in mid Open Beta, some parties can be really fun.
public or otherwise.

and the reverse is also true: I played some non-public "friends of friends" map parties, where people pretty much didn't give a rat's ass about each other.

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mushioov wrote:

I see it happen all the time more and more. I had over 6 months break from this game and it has gotten 200% easier after I left. The reason? GGG has caved in for the casuals' demands about permanent loot, etc. nonsense that makes the game so much easier.

GGG seeing all these "active" threads (in reality it's 1 or 2 loudmouth demanders shouting to each other) thinks that these are somehow issues that "need" to be fixed. Well they aren't. The game was/is good when it's hard and the more casual demands go through, the more people who want to play PoE for the challenge are pushed away.

Why is GGG caving in to please the flimsy casuals who we all know will abandon this game the instant their instant-gratification meter is full? I hope the answer isn't that they are stupid, because I'm quite sure they aren't. Is it the money?

Discuss.

There are many players with exreme amounts of hours played (i.e. non-casuals) who prefer permanent allocation. In fact, adding allocation options instead of a streamlined setting for everyone increases game complexity, i.e. it's the anti blizzard/mainstream approach, which is good.

Edit: It doesnt add much to credibility, to moan about casuals, when you don't have a single point in any season races, nor a single character above level 60. Most casuals I know have actually beaten the game on merciless. It also doesn't seem credible to assert that "flimsy casuals" abandon the game and, therefore, GGG should cater development toward non-casuals (a category you seem to place yourself in), despite admitting to not playing for over 6 months yourself.

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johnKeys wrote:

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reboticon wrote:

No disrespect is intended, but if you find public games to be equal to playing with friends, that sounds like either you or your friends had pretty terrible characters. There is a massive different for a lot of people, I believe even the majority, though my evidence for that would be anecdotal.

I don't think this is connected to friends having terrible characters, as much as it is people who are simply not fun to play with, Rebo.
I played several public Ledge-farming parties, where people stopped to help a party member in trouble, had some (very short) form of chat going on, and left loot for each other based on character and (visually-apparent) build.

though it's impossible to beat the "fun factor" of the "map-team" we had with Morbo, Bill and Anuhart so long ago in mid Open Beta, some parties can be really fun.
public or otherwise.

and the reverse is also true: I played some non-public "friends of friends" map parties, where people pretty much didn't give a rat's ass about each other.

That's possible, but I really haven't had much of an issue with people being assholes in public parties, as much as just their characters being, well, bad. Overriding curses, doing almost no DPS, constantly being separated from the rest of the party, that sort of thing. Lately I've just been farming dominus with some people, and the chat in mumble is probably the most interesting part. I've also never really had a bad experience with anyone in ledge, because it is ledge. I was talking more about grouping for vaal or maps. That said, I also played entirely solo until fairly recently, and I still generally prefer it, but maps are too expensive to maintain solo and a party helps even out the modifiers.

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mushioov wrote:

I see it happen all the time more and more. I had over 6 months break from this game and it has gotten 200% easier after I left. The reason? GGG has caved in for the casuals' demands about permanent loot, etc. nonsense that makes the game so much easier.

GGG seeing all these "active" threads (in reality it's 1 or 2 loudmouth demanders shouting to each other) thinks that these are somehow issues that "need" to be fixed. Well they aren't. The game was/is good when it's hard and the more casual demands go through, the more people who want to play PoE for the challenge are pushed away.

Why is GGG caving in to please the flimsy casuals who we all know will abandon this game the instant their instant-gratification meter is full? I hope the answer isn't that they are stupid, because I'm quite sure they aren't. Is it the money?

Discuss.

Having a playable game != Catering to casuals

Not to mention that using "casual" as you do is retarded.

edit: Also: Shitty usability != hardcore

So much lolwat in this thread.

Want FFA? Play it. That's the thing about options--you don't need to use them =)

Want to challenge yourself? Go ahead and do it. Just don't make others suffer for your "fun".