Bots

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TechnoMage wrote:

Trust me, within weeks of launch if not before we will have group chat channels similar to the # % @ and local options with # chat costing a small fee.

I highly doubt it. You could restrict global chat access per a certain level, while still maintaining access to chat channels like a Newbie Channel, Local, Trade, etc. Mods plan on being out in full force and doing nothing but chat patrol come Open Beta's Live start.

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TechnoMage wrote:

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Blockhead wrote:

Agreed thoroughly, it will be very sad if this does happen in the long run. Apart from that, the spamming of bot farming websites shouldn't be too much of a worry, but since the game is going F2P who knows how they will approach this.

Small micro-transaction fee to use global chat (Approx $1 for 10 messages) and the introduction of in game 'clans' with clan chat will mostly solve the issue. It is about the only way for things to work as they cannot allow players to moderate chat due to labor issues. (This was tested in court for the old MMO Ultima Online, technically these people are preforming a service for GGG and thus entitled to minimum wage in the US. A very thorny area and one best avoided)
At least with micro-transaction for global model it is win - win. We players get access for broadcast messages, private chat groups and don't have to put up with spammers as most of the time the $1 fee makes it unprofitable to spam.

Interesting concept, but in my opinion it would never be implemented because the Global chat is one of the key fundamental features in the game, communicating/trading/helping out newcomers, etc. Apart from that, I don't see why GGG can't find a few dedicated PoE enthusiasts to moderate the chat 24/7.. it doesn't seem like a hard thing to accomplish if you find the right people.

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jaankoo wrote:

I wouldnt worry about this too much because:

1) botting cant be prevented
2) The currency system in POE will work efficient to stop inflation
3) POE can be played quite solely

2) is absolutely and completely wrong, sorry.
This game WILL have botters and goldfarmers, and that WILL introduce inflation in the system.
Inflation occurs (in game economies) when there is more wealth added to the system than there is taken out. Farmers will farm and trade for GCP's (or which ever orb the player base starts using as a base currency for convenience), and that will push up the prices.

If there are no solid wealth sinks from regular playing, then this will happen. Currently there are no noticeable wealth sinks that hinder or slow down botting/farming.

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CiceroSUN wrote:

If there are no solid wealth sinks from regular playing, then this will happen. Currently there are no noticeable wealth sinks that hinder or slow down botting/farming.

Using hundreds, and possibly thousands of the same orb to get an end-game weapon or armor piece the way you want it is a considerable wealth sink I'd say.

It's impossible to compare inflation of a product with another product that does something completely different, especially in this game due to the value of that product being heavily based on what the character needs right now.

No two types of orbs in this game does the exact same thing, you wouldn't compare inflation pricing of a lawnmower with that of a garden hose. They perform to different sets of tasks within the same arena.

With the inclusion of private leagues, and the difficulty of judging Return on Investment based on RNG, from a business perspective I could definitely see large botting companies steering clear of this game. They're better off making their money in larger markets anyway like TL2 or D3

I agree that inflation will simply increase the rate that orbs are used, which should in theory fix the inflation. If that doesn't happen, then GGG can look at alternative sinks.

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CiceroSUN wrote:

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jaankoo wrote:

I wouldnt worry about this too much because:

1) botting cant be prevented
2) The currency system in POE will work efficient to stop inflation
3) POE can be played quite solely

2) is absolutely and completely wrong, sorry.
This game WILL have botters and goldfarmers, and that WILL introduce inflation in the system.
Inflation occurs (in game economies) when there is more wealth added to the system than there is taken out.

Inflation has nothing to do with wealth added to a system. It simply means, that the currency looses value compared to goods.

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CiceroSUN wrote:

Farmers will farm and trade for GCP's (or which ever orb the player base starts using as a base currency for convenience), and that will push up the prices.

Thats also not true. I will show this at the example of orbs of fusings:
I assume the chance of getting a 6link item is 1/400 (this is totally made up). This means a 6link is worth 400 fusing orbs. This is fix and wont ever be changed by bots (GGG could change it so).
But a 6link item cant loose value because its usefullness in the game stays always the same.

When currency looses value items gain value. But the value of currency directly depends on item value, so everything stays (almost) the same. Only the values between different types of currency can change.

Very few people are going to be things like GCPs when the game comes to launch because a lot of people just don't care about the benefit so they are just going to sell them off and there are going to be a lot of them circulating to the point where they aren't worth as much and the only people buying them are the competitive players.

Look at the Scroll of Wisdom for example, I have a surplus of 60 of these on Hardcore and I'm only level 30, and I've used a lot of them. I have no idea what to do with them, I could get even more if I wanted to start selling things. Same with orbs of chance-esque items, I just waste these things at this point because I truly don't care, but I could hold onto and have a surplus to release into the game's economy. Orb of Regrets will become very obsolete because people will either a) plan their builds ahead of time or b) only fuck up slightly that they will need one or two, which they'll probably already have.

Not having a defined currency is not going to prevent inflation, even look at games like Team Fortress 2, that game's economy is just so piss-poor. There are few items worth a ton but currency items like refined metal and keys have dropped rapidly and so have a lot of unusual hats. The only things that maintain value are items that can no longer be obtained.

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I assume the chance of getting a 6link item is 1/400 (this is totally made up). This means a 6link is worth 400 fusing orbs. This is fix and wont ever be changed by bots (GGG could change it so).
But a 6link item cant loose value because its usefullness in the game stays always the same.

Until bots release a large amount of 6 link items into the game, at which point they become easier to get and worth less as competition for selling increases, and part of the competition doesn't give a shit, because they didn't farm it manually so they're just happy to unload it.

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bferret wrote:

Very few people are going to be things like GCPs when the game comes to launch because a lot of people just don't care about the benefit so they are just going to sell them off and there are going to be a lot of them circulating to the point where they aren't worth as much and the only people buying them are the competitive players.

And that's the beauty of the system that will prevent inflation. What YOU think is valuable and not valuable is still used by others. Personally, I think by end game come Open Beta GCP will be a hot commodity to not only get, but USE. It's the finishing touches on a character. While some may put prices on what's worth what, depending on your situation in game orbs will be valued by the individual player and what they think it's worth to them at the time.

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bferret wrote:

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I assume the chance of getting a 6link item is 1/400 (this is totally made up). This means a 6link is worth 400 fusing orbs. This is fix and wont ever be changed by bots (GGG could change it so).
But a 6link item cant loose value because its usefullness in the game stays always the same.

Until bots release a large amount of 6 link items into the game, at which point they become easier to get and worth less as competition for selling increases, and part of the competition doesn't give a shit, because they didn't farm it manually so they're just happy to unload it.

And what do botters sell 6links for? Currency? think about it!

You cant be 100% safe from bots NEVER EVER !
Most of people think no gold = no bots plz... xD
Power lvl + power lvl gems or like 100 Alchemy orbs for like woot 1-2$ and more more...