Why Standard League is irrelevant, and why that's not good for PoE.

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gibbousmoon wrote:

Perhaps you don't understand their reasoning: For a brand-new player who is intimidated by Hardcore, there is no reason *not* to create a Hardcore character. Everything can be moved into the Standard League at will, after all, including their character and everything they find. This makes Hardcore more accessible to casual players, which was GGG's intention.

Well, i know their reasoning and their reasoning is plain wrong: a brand-new player (aka casual) who is intimidated by Hardcore should make a Standard character and that's that.
Hardcore, as in when you're dead then you stay dead, not ressurect exactly the same in another league, is only for the dudes that know exactly what they are doing and it doesnt have to be "accessible to casual players". The casual player that plays the game for enough time becomes a prosumer player and eventually a pro player and from prosumer level he can try hardcore if he wants.

A league should be closed world, absolutely nothing gets out of it!

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

...I play standard almost exclusively and there is absolutely no problem with the influx of hc gear, it has no real effect on things ... There is nothing wrong with standards economy, its one of the most stable economies ever seen in an ARPG.

I dont know if you're dreaming or deluding yourself.

Personally, I've yet to see a single reason to play in any league but standard.

I've got a ton of stuff stashed in standard that I've accumulated over many months. Why would I want to wipe all that away and start again?

Well...you could farm the HC-type leagues and do currency cross-trading...or even the Anarchy analogue, that's still good ratios.

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mobutu wrote:

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Snorkle_uk wrote:

...I play standard almost exclusively and there is absolutely no problem with the influx of hc gear, it has no real effect on things ... There is nothing wrong with standards economy, its one of the most stable economies ever seen in an ARPG.

I dont know if you're dreaming or deluding yourself.

no, Im deadly serious. a koams heart in standard went from 25 exalts, to 30 exalts, then back to 25 exalts over a period of about 6 months. A godly 6 link life/armour base chest went from 25 exalts 6 months ago to... 25 exalts now.

In D3 a godly echoing fury went from 5 million to 20 million to 50 million to 100 million to 1 billion, to 2 billion, to 20 billion to 44 billion over the same time period.

I dont know what planet you are living on but the stability of PoEs economies in every league is nothing short of a miracle in game design, you are seriously deluded if you think otherwise.

There is stability in the sense of high end items retaining most of their value until a unique is released that destroys its dominance.

Some examples being

-vaal regalias losing worth once shavs was released as low life = deeps and people love deeps.

-Voltaxic heavily displacing lionseye though the latter was already devaluing heavily due to an excess of supply.

-soul taker making most 1 handers worthless

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Nephalim wrote:

There is stability in the sense of high end items retaining most of their value until a unique is released that destroys its dominance.

Some examples being

-vaal regalias losing worth once shavs was released as low life = deeps and people love deeps.

-Voltaxic heavily displacing lionseye though the latter was already devaluing heavily due to an excess of supply.

-soul taker making most 1 handers worthless

true to some extent but vaal regalias have resurfaced thanks to the recent dominance of ci, shavs is not the goal of the majority of es users, a 1000 es val regs is. Lioneyes was a problem because it devalued all other bows, I think it needed something like voltaxic to help balance things and have 2 decent bows in the game rather than 1, but bows in general are in a bad place and always have been in ob because of lioneyes existence, and that echos what you say about high end uniques and how they effect the balance of the market.


I disagree with the soul taker though, its a phys weapon, most cleave users are elemental and cant use that axe for their build, it cant be used with reave, it cant replace crit daggers/claws. I think I have 4 one handed melee builds and none of them can use that axe.

Of course what you say holds up as a general principal, with new items/skills/passive balances being added to the game certain items will shift in price due to their demand. But in games like D3 things were not shifting because new content was added, the economies had no inherent stability and just rapidly descended into nonsense. I have never seen a game with an economy this stable, ever, I didnt even think it was possible in an ARPG.

you're comparing d2/3 with millions of active players with poe that has prolly like 0.1 millions active players.
There is inflation in poe, you just don't see it. Its true the level of magnitude is lower, exactly like the number of active players is.

Allowing cross-league transfers is bad design, no matter how you look at it.

GGG needs to increase the drop rates in standard for about 10-20x, creating a good pool to mess around with the game, and have 4-month leagues with normal drop rates. That way everyone should be happy.

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mobutu wrote:

you're comparing d2/3 with millions of active players with poe that has prolly like 0.1 millions active players.
There is inflation in poe, you just don't see it. Its true the level of magnitude is lower, exactly like the number of active players is.

Allowing cross-league transfers is bad design, no matter how you look at it.

the level of magnitude is so tiny you cant even see it... ok, so godly 6 link moving from 25 exalts to 25 exalts compared to a godly echoing furying moving from 5 million to 44 billion is representative of the difference in player base? no, sry its not, its representative of a completely stable economy vs a completely unstable one. D3 does not have millions of active players, nowhere near that amount. I doubt it has more than 4x that of PoE, and its prices have not shifted by 4x that of PoE, theyve shifted by about 10,000 x as much as PoE in the few cases where you can actually see an economic shift in this game, given this game is constantly being added to and that game stayed consistent for a long time it is even more telling.


Allowing cross-league is fine, you havent made a single point against it and there are many points for it. Imo you are wrong.

I don't care for cross league trading because it lets people who were rich in one league get a leg up in another. That said, I've done it several times. I just think an even playing field would be better.