SEASONAL content directly in STANDARD as well as in LEAGUE

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Jyrlep#4788 wrote:

On paper, PoE2 was supposed to be its own thing next to PoE1.

Can you show us this paper, because for all these years I have opposite impression. I am very curious from what source you came with that.

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Jyrlep#4788 wrote:

new mechanics go into League first, live there for a while, maybe get tuned, and only then (maybe) come to Standard.

This.

Evergrey, you do realize Standard's economy is weird for a very simple reason - almost nobody actually trades there.

Most of the real buying and selling happens in League. By the end of a league, prices between that league and future Standard are already close, because all the stuff gets dumped over anyway. Early on, leveling gear is expensive because everyone is still climbing and endgame items basically do not exist yet. Later, when people are farming endgame, low- and mid-tier items flood the market and get cheap while the true chase items go up.

So for a new player who is not shopping for mirror-tier toys, Standard is not automatically some cursed zone. In a lot of cases it has cheaper "middle" items, simply because you do not have thousands of fresh characters all fighting over the same early uniques. Inflation on Standard mainly hits the very top - the usual "too much currency chasing too few BiS items" problem. That happens in both modes. And yes, bots and flippers exist in both too. That is a separate issue from "should Standard get seasonal content on time."

And no, I am not secretly bathing in mirrors or RMT. If I were spending real money on fake money, I would at least demand a yacht MTX.

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Dxt44#4050 wrote:

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Jyrlep#4788 wrote:

On paper, PoE2 was supposed to be its own thing next to PoE1.

Can you show us this paper, because for all these years I have opposite impression. I am very curious from what source you came with that.

People keep saying "PoE2 was never meant to be different from PoE1" and "GGG never said anything else." That does not line up with what they themselves have said.

Originally PoE2 really was presented more like a huge expansion bolted onto PoE1. In one of the early "everything revealed so far" style posts on the official forums around 2021, they described PoE2 as launching from the same client, being a second campaign alongside the original, and both campaigns feeding into the same Atlas endgame. So at that point it really was "PoE1 plus another campaign," not "two separate games."

Later, GGG changed that message very clearly. In a staff reply on the forums in 2023 they literally said that Path of Exile and Path of Exile 2 are now completely separate games, and in their 2023 recap they talked about each of them having its own cycle. That is already a different framing than "one game with two campaigns."

You can see the split in the details too. In the PoE2 Early Access FAQ they explain that PoE1 stash tabs will only work in PoE2 "where relevant," and that things like Currency tabs will hold different stuff between the two games. That wording only makes sense if they are actually diverging in mechanics and itemization.

On top of that, during ExileCon 2023 interviews Jonathan Rogers talked about PoE1 and PoE2 being separate, each with its own mechanics, balance, endgame and leagues. That is about as close to "its own thing next to PoE1" as you are going to get in one sentence.

So the timeline is basically this: first it was "one client, two campaigns, shared endgame," then it became "two separate games with their own cycles and systems." That is why I am pushing for PoE2 to lean into being different instead of just running the exact same seasonal structure as PoE1 and calling it a day. If GGG themselves say it is a separate game, then giving Standard a more casual-friendly treatment with timely seasonal content fits that idea instead of fighting it.

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Jyrlep#4788 wrote:

On top of that, during ExileCon 2023 interviews Jonathan Rogers talked about PoE1 and PoE2 being separate, each with its own mechanics, balance, endgame and leagues. That is about as close to "its own thing next to PoE1" as you are going to get in one sentence

I don't blame you. I known you made this all up. I watched literally everything, even some interviews with like 5k views. They are pretty happy with their seasonal model, and nothing will change with that.

You are still completely missing the actual point of this thread.

This section is literally called "Feedback". I am giving feedback. Whether you personally think GGG are thrilled with their current seasonal model or tattooed it on their foreheads is not the issue here. The whole point is to offer a different perspective on how PoE2 could work, especially if it is supposed to coexist with PoE1 instead of just replacing it.

GGG made a pretty loud statement by splitting the games and not shutting PoE1 down. If they wanted a straight "CSGO -> CS2" style upgrade, they would have just swapped the client and called it a day, like Valve did. Instead, PoE1 stays online and PoE2 launches next to it.

That tells me they want two games running in parallel, not one game evolving into the next. And if you have two games, it is not crazy to suggest that maybe they should not be carbon copies of each other in how they handle seasons, leagues, and long-term progression.

PoE2 is in early access. That is exactly the phase where players are supposed to say "here is what would make this worth playing for me" before everything is frozen in concrete. My angle is the casual player who cannot live the full-time league reset lifestyle. From that angle, a Standard mode that gets seasonal content in a timely way and is treated as a real home, not a junkyard, makes sense.

If the devs completely ignore that, fine, their call. If other players think it is stupid, also fine, they can say so. But pretending this thread is invalid because "nothing will change anyway" or because you personally like the current model is not an argument, it is just a way to shut down discussion.

So yes, I am going to keep treating PoE2 as a separate game that could, in theory, try different things. If that idea annoys you, there is an easy solution: stop reading the thread.

PS: Regarding of making things up, I have no idea what you mean by that. Made what up? That they decided to make PoE2 as PoE1 expansion in the beginning and later on (ExileCon 2023) announced it as separate game?
You can check out, starts in about 2:05:00
https://www.youtube.com/live/Vvah-HfhkYc?t=7500

So maybe the new standard could be SSF only. Then it wouldn't affect trade in any way, since people who actually want to trade would be in normal league always.

I agree, there is just no point not putting all new content into standard.

You will never get all the new content in Standard. This is something you have to accept as a Standard player. One main reason is GGG will not want their shiny new endgame boss killed 5 minutes after the season starts, with the video posted on reddit. It kills hype for people playing the league from a fresh start.


I'll still play Standard after launch. You still get the (adjusted) content, just 4 months later. There is also some benefits like the league content typically not being optimized well. So you don't get the 30 second drop to 20FPS in every map if playing in Standard.

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Jyrlep#4788 wrote:

IILU81II:
Saying "then don't play seasonal games" in a feedback forum is not exactly a galaxy-brain solution. There is a reason this subforum exists. People are literally asked to give feedback and suggest changes. "Leave if you don't like it" is not an argument, it is just shutting down discussion.

Reset is part of seasonal games, so if you dont like the reset you shouldnt play such games or pretend developers to completely rework a well tested winning formula just because you and those who you call casuals dont like it.
This is what i said, do not quote half sentences and tell people their feedbacks are useless.

Both games feels the same because they share the same exact content (campaign, endgame maps with breach, deli n stuff) and not because of the seasons mechanic that is one of the main reasons why poe 1 is still up and running.

With the thing you're proposing in its early access, a league in standard would last 2 weeks instead of 2 months (on a 4 months total schedule) because you'll start with everything and blast every single new shit in a matter of days then what?
Complain because endgame feels boring and repetitive?

And for those who like the reset there wouldnt be trade because the playerbase will split between the 2 modes with more league players playing standard because we have everything there.
So at some point leagues will have 0 reason to exist because everyone will be on standard, do you understand what i mean or maybe try to look at multiple scenarios that your feedback could cause?

Only reason league shills don’t want this changed is because it’s all they’ve known for the past 12+ years, like they’ve self institutionalised.
And “muh economy.”