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crazyfingers619#3901 wrote:

What world are you people living in?

POE is fantastic, and has an INSANELY strong user base with CRAZY INSANE player retention.

It is exceeding ALL expectations.

Get a grip people. They know what they're doing, the game is already good, it will only get better.

-50% in 40 days isn't "CRAZY INSANE" retention.

They have a chance to do something pretty cool, but there is a lot that needs to be fixed to keep anyone engaged long term. The current endgame doesn't have the legs for it, and many systems that were crucial to retention in the last game have been gutted to the point of irrelevance.

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Gkek#1581 wrote:

"

crazyfingers619#3901 wrote:

What world are you people living in?

POE is fantastic, and has an INSANELY strong user base with CRAZY INSANE player retention.

It is exceeding ALL expectations.

Get a grip people. They know what they're doing, the game is already good, it will only get better.

-50% in 40 days isn't "CRAZY INSANE" retention.

They have a chance to do something pretty cool, but there is a lot that needs to be fixed to keep anyone engaged long term. The current endgame doesn't have the legs for it, and many systems that were crucial to retention in the last game have been gutted to the point of irrelevance.

But it is. Considering the end game is something they threw together with duct tape in a few months time it's incredible.

The starting numbers are incredible.

POE has charged onto the scene and it is DOMINATING.

There is so much cool stuff on the horizon and they are masterfully prioritizing short term fixes while keeping the big beats coming for the future.

Not everyone is in love with the game, but there is enough staying power with enough discerning players to show the potential. It will only grow in GGG's capable hands.

Frankly, this dooming is kind of amusing. POE could not be in a better position all things considered.

Is it perfect? Of course not. But for where they are in the life cycle of the game, we are all in for a wild and fun ride.

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crazyfingers619#3901 wrote:

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Gkek#1581 wrote:

"

crazyfingers619#3901 wrote:

What world are you people living in?

POE is fantastic, and has an INSANELY strong user base with CRAZY INSANE player retention.

It is exceeding ALL expectations.

Get a grip people. They know what they're doing, the game is already good, it will only get better.

-50% in 40 days isn't "CRAZY INSANE" retention.

They have a chance to do something pretty cool, but there is a lot that needs to be fixed to keep anyone engaged long term. The current endgame doesn't have the legs for it, and many systems that were crucial to retention in the last game have been gutted to the point of irrelevance.

But it is. Considering the end game is something they threw together with duct tape in a few months time it's incredible.

The starting numbers are incredible.

POE has charged onto the scene and it is DOMINATING.

There is so much cool stuff on the horizon and they are masterfully prioritizing short term fixes while keeping the big beats coming for the future.

Not everyone is in love with the game, but there is enough staying power with enough discerning players to show the potential. It will only grow in GGG's capable hands.

Frankly, this dooming is kind of amusing. POE could not be in a better position all things considered.

Is it perfect? Of course not. But for where they are in the life cycle of the game, we are all in for a wild and fun ride.

People just thrive on drama and angst these days. Its like they need things to be bad.

One initial thought that may defend the other (the 2 reps from GGG of the interview) side perhaps...their remarks were quite intentional (despite the lack of empathy), and it was in doing so for the best for the future, i.e. prepare those that think there will be change and that it will be diff from PoE1 (end-game/mapping) but he already knows it's a lost cause (currently leaning towards they are in-the-know re. general community sentiments [and perhaps there really is nothing they can/will do]). However, playing devil's advocate, given the past history of PoE1 and what many others have said for their track record - this also isn't anything new in a way...so perhaps this is again no different, and history repeats itself once again (in due time).

To re-iterate (TLDR): post-interview, (personally) my current (until more data arrives from the community/YT/forums/Reddit/etc) bet will side on past history, i.e. "melee < ranged" and "zoom zoom 1-shot" -- so, no real changes from PoE1, essentially (with the main outlier of the campaign for the 1st ~60 lvls or so...lol --- and new melee classes like Druid/Templar/Marauder...lol [bye Warrior...lol {I don't count Monk...lol -- nor minion/Witch...lol}]) -- and timing-wise, I'll just say 2026+ (so, guessing 1 more year of gamedev until full Release post-this EA).

(Post this interview w/ the 2 GGG reps, I just decided to bite the bullet and re-rolled Monk [finally?] for SSF [felt the additional handicap of SSF would help Balance it out...lol. {Merc lvl ~64, Witch lvl 21, Warrior lvl 66 -- considering trying out the Quarterstaff for my Merc -- Re-spec Again...lol -- and yes, will still be on the lookout for future Druid/Templar/Marauder...lol}])

PoE2s warrior class is the worst melee character rendition to EVER enter the arpg genre imo. I don’t get how GGG didint learn from the stop to attack clunkyness that was PoE1 and doubled down in PoE2. Super glad Diablo 4s new season is coming out because GGGs lack of concern and neglect for that which GGG deems worthy of neglect has made me not want to play anything PoE related until theirs evident EFFORT applied to this failed project.

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Gkek#1581 wrote:

"

crazyfingers619#3901 wrote:

What world are you people living in?

POE is fantastic, and has an INSANELY strong user base with CRAZY INSANE player retention.

It is exceeding ALL expectations.

Get a grip people. They know what they're doing, the game is already good, it will only get better.

-50% in 40 days isn't "CRAZY INSANE" retention.

Yes it is. You have no frame of reference except your own emotions, and you're using numbers to sound objective. However, if you compare PoE2's number to any other early access game ever, you'll see that PoE2 is doing amazing. Phenomenally well. Crazy insane, even.

Baldur's Gate 3 was in early access for four years. You can wait four months.

i mean you guys knew that New World reach 950k++ player on their peak right?

Joke aside, POE 2 current endgame condition is a complete mess, plus lots of feature or is still "coming soon", hence the population will keep dwindling.

Most of those player probably waiting for the next league, hoping it will be much better.

Put numbers of players playing aside, it pretty clear the game design and endgame is not working out, and it is even more worrying that the current endgame is going to be the actual endgame.

Not many people seem to realize Grinding Gear is tripling down on their bad design with the patches. They think tuning numbers are all they need to do while it is plain to see that the design itself need to be redesigned.

The min/max buff and nerf approach is killing the game because the development team does not realize the impact cascade down to non min/max build. This ironically forced players to turn to Meta builds more than ever. The sick need to "balance" things confused the developers as well. It created a tunnel vision of one step forward and one step back. Going about in circles. Sadly, this is a pretty common situation with a lot of game developers in other games as well. This was a common situation too in Path of Exile 1.

It really feel like the game is someone's pet project. People should start paying attention to how many times "I feel" is used during Grinding Gear interview. It is as if all the decision is done based on emotions.


Beside these, players should start talking about hook and dumping players for profit. Years ago, Chris - who oddly describe Path of Exile 1 as a MMO - once mentioned that the game profit off dolphin and not whales with leagues. Intentionally or not, Path of Exile 2 unfortunately come off as a bait and switch.

The meaningless positivity crowd is blind to a few facts.

1. An EA does not mean putting out bad concepts and tripling down on it.

2. Being positive is not exclusive of criticism.

3. Most long format criticism are constructive and hold merits.

4. The game have very fatal fundamental design problems.

5. Glaring incompetent and outdated coding where characters are not tagged by unique accounts ID, but unique name tag should not be a thing in 2025.


This company is in need of a overhaul too. Grinding Gear seem to forget they are not immune to responsibility. There is no other way to say it but the recent event shows that the company is intentionally irresponsible.

1. Allowing scams to run amok because of some misguided belief in "friction trading" - The worries of trivializing the game should be laugh at. If trivializing the game was the main concern, trading should be removed all together.

2. The radio silent over a considerable period over data breach and locked up accounts does not spell professionalism. The excuses "it is holiday" and overwhelming numbers of backlogged tickets are not a passable reasons to keep quiet and allow anxious to build up.


All these issues warrant the questions -

1. is the current development team the right fit for Path of Exile 2?

2. Or someone is abusing their authority and overriding the team?

3. Will they realize Path of Exile 2 success depend on broader audience?

4. The game is made for who? Personally I do not think Grinding Gear dare to answer this question because it will lead to mass exodus once they reveal their true target audiences.

5. Is the company led by the right person?

The current community reminded me of another game, Marvel Hero Online where a bunch of very loud min/max minority became very friendly with the developers on a personal level. The developers literally acted on every advices these minorities gave. These minorities were also very aggressive to anyone who were critical of the design decision. They broke the game and caused a premature death of the company. The funny but horrible sad irony is that these minorities were the first to abandon the game.

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hboi#6131 wrote:

Yeah there's 244k people playing on steam alone on a Monday afternoon school/work day almost 2 months after launch. The game isn't falling off a cliff this forum is delusional.

You are the one delusional.

Good games in the ARPG genre are few and far between. Hyped new games in the genre often have a good amount of sales and players the first few weeks or months. Even D3 that´s considered a massive fail, had HUGE amount of copies sold and HUGE playerbase early on.

Even the games that end up completely dying and losing 95++% of the playerbase within the first year, often go through this high amount of copies sold and high early player numbers process.


Now if POE2 will manage to keep big enough playerbase to continue as the #1 ARPG, time will tell. I think will if they remove this Ruthless mindset and add the current state of the game as Ruthless as a game mode and give players a real Softcore option if they gonna keep a big playerbase in the long run.

But to act like nothing wrong with the game due to either many copies sold or high player numbers in the weeks/months after release, are delusional.