One shot in T7
" What am I building and playing around? I think I died from an auto attack that did over 1.7K damage, and since it wasn't elemental (no way of knowing), I'm disregarding my RES cap or other defenses. How much HP do I need to avoid that in the future? When did I solve the problem? Right now, I'd need to give up INT/DEX nodes for strength. How many? Who knows, but "adjust your build," right? I could also wholly build away from Evasion and stack Energy Shield since ES is the game's most potent form of defensive layering. However, let's pretend that the POE2 layering isn't shallow and ES won't solve all my problems (even though it 100% will), so I stick with Evasion. So I have more HP. Now I need to go into a T7, stand in front of a monster, wait for it to hit me with an auto attack, hope it had the same buffs and stats as the previous rare, and then see if I died. If I die, I clearly don't have enough HP, and I have to adjust my build. How much HP? Who knows, but this game doesn't hold your hand. It's a deep and engaging guessing game that rewards players for maybe solving the problem they are facing. Lynk, I am sure you are a very bright dude, and I am not asking the game to "solve my problems for me." I am asking the game to tell me how much damage something did or even a ball park. It is still on me to solve the problem. If guessing, testing, dying, and losing 15% XP, only to test again and "hope I fixed it this time" makes the game deep, then I'm a fucking moron. Last edited by RootwallaTL#1578 on Dec 28, 2024, 7:35:45 PM
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Well there is no real number to things they can technically give you, because EHP depends on your class and the build you choose with it.
Pure HP will never be the only factor. Eva/Armor/ES based characters are different from eachother and need different HP depending on the build. Then theres also map modifiers like critical hit chance/damage, minus maximum elemental resistance, elemental weakness curse etc. So every map encounter can be a bit different you can't really flatten it down to "a rare mob hits me with an autoattack, how much hp do i need" because theres just so many factors going into this. The best they can do is give you a damage log on death maybe that's something that would be nice but i doubt thats gonna happen. ES also isnt defense layering, its a single layer. And yes its overperforming at the moment. However i do play a full eva character myself and i don't run in these issues. In my case its simply RES Cap (dont neglect chaos), 75% Evasion after Acrobatics penalty to deal with splash damage hits etc, Tailwind+Windward since im a Deadeye, Wind Dancer with defensive support gem setup, decent movement speed to make it easier to avoid and outwalk AoE and stuff. Im on 2k HP and while i get hit rarely, i dont die in one hit. Usually the only thing that ever oneshots me is one-death effects that get lost in visual clarity problems. Im running T16+2 with this setup and do not have any issues. However to make the point - It's 2k hp here combined with other defensive layers but on another class, or even same class with different build it can also be an entirely different story. So what kind of indicator are you wishing for then? I mean really just give us an example because i don't see a good solution that works universally considering all the factors going into what ends up your basically unique encounter. But like i said, best shot at this imho would be a damage log of idk the last 10 seconds before you died. But i doubt GGG is gonna give us that and even if, could still just be down to a random set of unlucky modifiers. Last edited by Lynk#4447 on Dec 28, 2024, 8:04:29 PM
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" Here’s my idea: when you die, the game could give you a bit more information to work with. Something like this: 1. What kind of attack was it (basic, unique, etc.)? 2. How much damage did you actually take (rounded up or down)? 3. How many sources of damage hit you? 4. What type of damage was it? 5. How was the damage amplified? I’m sure there are more polished ways to handle this, but off the top of my head, this feels like it would give me (and probably others) enough to start figuring out defensive layering problems without just guessing. Let’s be honest, the community—just like with POE1—is going to end up making spreadsheets for defensive thresholds, boss damage, and all that anyway. But adding something like this would be a solid first step toward giving players better tools in-game, so they don’t have to rely on outside resources as much. It would also help GGG move closer to their goal of providing more useful info directly in the game. |
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i think the op is right to be upset.
ok dude, hes the deal. ive been playing poe1 for about 20,000 hours over the last 12 years. i can tell you this for sure, the game has never been in a perfect state of balance. there has always been at least one defence mechanism that is under performing, one set of builds that is wonky. there is always some kind of monster in the game that is currently over tuned. almost every league launch we get a bunch of new monsters, at least one of them will be a total piece of shit that one shots you in a horrible way and makes you mad. the game has just been launched, the balance is wildly out of whack in places. so much is wrong right now, the item system, the mechanics, the monsters, skills, so many pieces of the puzzle need tuned, and when one gets tuned another pops out of joint and now that needs tuned... expect shit to be a mess and to continue being a mess for a while. best thing you can do is note what the monster was. what does it look like? was it a quadrilla? a nasty snake? what sort of attack did it hit you with? as a community if we want the game to not feel hard we cant just say i got 1 shot game too hard. if we tell them what specific monsters are out of line then at least they can go in and see ok, yeah we agree that dude is out of balance or not. thats our only hope right now. but for ourselves, our own sanity, know its gonna be a mess for a good while. expect it, we just got to take notes and give the most clear actionable feedback we can. i died in a t7 map earlier, i dont even know what killed me sadly but given my defenses its bullshit. there is bullshit in the game for sure. I love all you people on the forums, we can disagree but still be friends and respect each other :)
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Info about what killed you, specific damage type, how much your defences contributed etc. would be really nice actually.
For everything else.. just ask AI to explain PoE defences, it will do an excellent job, better than anyone on this forum would - it's just too case-by-case. |
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Well, you seem to have been playing poe for a while. You haven't gotten used to random one shots?
Poe 2 is just a reskin of Poe 1. All mechanics are basically the same, so you can use the same strategy for poe 1 softcore as i think most of us use. 1. Assume this is a game of rng. Everything here is luck based, also if you die or not. 2. Assume that you can only make your deaths less frequent, they are unavoidable, sooner or later some b**** will get you, because that is what ggg loves and wants. Have you ever wondered why after all these years of Poe 1 we still have on death effects that are just an absolutely unfair way to just erase your char? Why those effects made it to Poe2 and are the most consistent way to kill you here? 3. I just died in t5 map with no dmg mods. I killed a rare (my minions did), i was prepared for it, stood behind a wall with raised shield far away waiting for some b****. I made a mistake i stood on some plants so i didn't see a tiny blue orb that teleported (or i just didn't see it coming my way) and just exploded and erased my char. I have 2.5k ehp with 80 fire res, rest 75 with 20% less dmg taken (from minion asc), 20% of phys/light/cold as fire from ascendancy and pretty solid armour and i had 100% block chance as i was actively blocking waiting for some projectiles. Will i change my defenses - nope. Do i need a death recap - not really, i know everything - ggg b**** unfair mechanics decided to erase 25 minutes of my time, what else i will see in it? That some tiny almost invisible on death effect hit me with unblockable aoe for 500 mln dmg? 4. Do as we all do. Stack layers of defences to your death ratio preference. Mine is 50 maps for poe1, 10 for poe 2. If i die more than once in 10 maps to something real (not b**** like i described) i review my defenses. Its always the same formula res>ehp-base>1layer>2layer>3layer. In your case you have res, but your ehp_base (hp + mana on mom + es + recoups etc) vs your first and only layer of defense (eva at 80%) seems to be to low for what currently is ggg's preference. I would get more eva and life, maybe there are some conditional multi nodes for eva as there are such for armour (Like 200% armour against crit dmg, 120% armour if you are not on low es), don't know the tree yet, those are juicy and help a ton. 5. As it is the same game your other solution is damage and distance. You are an eva char so i guess ranger/archer, change your build to offscreen mobs and build everything in damage, ehp of bosses don't scale much through tiers in maps yet so just make sure you kill them before they even get to attack and you won't die. Still try to at least keep the res and decent hp as in poe2 they thought that more on death effects is better so those skeletons or whatever that leaves big dot areas might get you with too little hp. Don't invest in es if you don't go very high with it, as chaos here deals double damage to es and is common even in t1 maps. 6. Recap would be good, but you are requesting a problematic feature. GGG doesn't really want you to see why you died. The biggest problem is deaths like the one i described, they are absolutely unfair and with hardcore, and reliance on twitch for advertisement this wouldn't look good (do you remember the Ziggy totem?) and Poe 2 is absolutely full with those right now. It is an early alpha, it will get better. |
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" What makes POE2 better is leaving thoughtful feedback in the dedicated feedback section of the POE2 forum during early access. While I appreciate your advice, I’m not looking for defensive layer solutions from the community on how to avoid dying. I acknowledge that my defenses might be part of the problem, but that’s not the issue I’m raising here. My point is about asking GGG to implement features that align with their vision—features that help players understand what’s happening in the game without needing to rely on third-party tools. This idea that I have to “be used to” anything because of POE1 doesn’t really apply here—POE2 is its own game. There’s no need to make excuses for GGG or defend them. I find it interesting that in one breath you acknowledge how helpful a death recap feature could be for players, but then immediately pivot to saying it’s problematic for GGG. So, which is it? Is it a good idea for players, or are the assumed challenges for GGG outweighing that? My feedback is focused on improving the in-game experience, and I’d rather keep the discussion there. If you think this isn't an issue at all and GGG doesn't need to do anything it's alright to say that, but I won't because I think GGG can do better. |
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Sounds like you got crit, and if you're evasion for defenses that means 1.7k life is wet paper at mid maps. IDK what green side has for additional defenses, but you need more life bad.
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>>>While I appreciate your advice, I’m not looking for defensive layer solutions from the community on how to avoid dying. I acknowledge that my defenses might be part of the problem, but that’s not the issue I’m raising here. My point is about asking GGG to implement features that align with their vision<<<
This is spot-on. I'm enormously frustrated by the instant deaths because in 90% of the cases, I'm standing quietly behind my minions watching and then - poof, I'm dead. There's no visual cue, no indicator, no special effect, I'm just dead. Often with an accompanying lag spike. This is frustrating because of the LACK OF INFORMATION. I cant even give the developers good feedback - because I have no idea what I want changed - I *think* I want a preload-everything button to reduce death-by-lag. But I dont know if that's it. If i got hit 5 times, it would be nice to know. If it was one 40k hit, that would be nice to know too. But there's absolutely no way to tell, and that's an incredibly frustrating fact. |
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Adding a simple combat log would make it way easier to actually give feedback on things.
Though I'm not sure if they're even reading this feedback forum, I see zero communication from their side. |
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