Do defences even matter anymore?

Ironic? It's the "feedback forum".... to provide feedback to the devs on the game. It's not a "help me with my build" area, there is an actual link in the index for that. So.. what conversation was there? Between the player and the mods or devs or whoever on the company side reads or does not read the posts? I read the forum index.

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morganbritches wrote:

Ironic? It's the "feedback forum".... to provide feedback to the devs on the game. It's not a "help me with my build" area, there is an actual link in the index for that. So.. what conversation was there? Between the player and the mods or devs or whoever on the company side reads or does not read the posts? I read the forum index.

When you provide feedback criticizing an aspect of the game, especially in language as strong as what was used in this post....it is entirely appropriate for other players to judge whether you have any idea what you are talking about. And that comes from spying on your build.

If I say something like: Why doesn't my 90% physical reduction do anything, defenses are broken! But then my build is running like 40k armour with no actual physical damage reduction....it invalidates my entire opinion both to the devs and the community at large.

The fact that he even tried to weasel himself out via editing his post loses even more credibility dude lol

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Coconutdoggy wrote:

The fact that he even tried to weasel himself out via editing his post loses even more credibility dude lol

Yea I came in post-edits, sorry.

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jsuslak313 wrote:

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morganbritches wrote:

Ironic? It's the "feedback forum".... to provide feedback to the devs on the game. It's not a "help me with my build" area, there is an actual link in the index for that. So.. what conversation was there? Between the player and the mods or devs or whoever on the company side reads or does not read the posts? I read the forum index.

When you provide feedback criticizing an aspect of the game, especially in language as strong as what was used in this post....it is entirely appropriate for other players to judge whether you have any idea what you are talking about. And that comes from spying on your build.

If I say something like: Why doesn't my 90% physical reduction do anything, defenses are broken! But then my build is running like 40k armour with no actual physical damage reduction....it invalidates my entire opinion both to the devs and the community at large.

Here's the thing, it seems to me, after having played this game for over 2000 hours, that the meta has been pushed more and more towards filling every spare inch of my build covering defenses. Spell suppression being a prime example, capping max res to 80. (I didn't really get into the game until near middle of harvest, but I was around when no one could even find maps unless they were in the cool club and Bringer of Rain was the end all and be all unique to have). Do we have more tools to do this? Yes, are the tools proportionate to the increasing need for layered defense? I would argue that the balance is regressively shifting towards towards no. Now, we get showered in uniques that used to be considered a game-changing windfall and they mean nothing. Because I gotta get my defenses up to handle red maps. I think it's unfortunate. Go look at POE ninja and see what the spread is for item use. Everyone building the same and using the same things.

Digressing though, so this guy maybe posts something invalid, it's an opinion to begin with, call something as subjective as an opinion valid or invalid is still another opinion. He came to the right part of the forums for it. Calling him a weasel and the general level of animosity that gets displayed to people on these forums really just feels like it validates the idea that this game is moving in the direction I'm talking about, an angry metafest. This person isn't a criminal. To a point, I don't think it hurts GGG or the community at large for them to hear feedback that might be erroneous in details but accurate in the overall message. What was his overall message? What was the title of the post? I'm really not enjoying running past every unique or imperfect thing I find to get the 5 or 6 exact things I need to get my build up to snuff. This keeps getting pushed more and more. So functionally, at some point you have an end-game with millions of different permutations on the gear and only 10 or 12 that matter at all. It becomes more wide and more shallow.

Right now, D4 is slowly getting better. Before I get flamed over that, I don't like it or play it, but I read reviews. The user reviews are improving slowly but surely. If the option for the average player becomes ripping all the time on POE because they didn't get their max fire res to +5 or had 80% suppression instead of 100, vs. they'll leave if the alternative is good enough. Swarming over posts posts on the feedback forum isn't going to help that.

That isn't true at all if you check the SC ladders you see tons of builds that have hardly any defence to speak of. However, if you want a well-balanced build you have to consider defences at all. No one said PoE is an easy game and it offers a myriad of ways to make your character tanky. What you mentioned are a few easy ones. The real list is far more extensive

Opinions are just that: opinions. They are based on whatever information the person has at the time and evaluated with their beliefs. The value of one's opinion can be judged based on if the information it is formed on is valid / complete. For OP that is not the case

D4 is a game I'd recommend to a casual gamer or someone who's just dipping their toes into ARPGs for the first time. Anyone who wants to play a game with more depth and established endgame plays PoE anyway

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ArtCrusade wrote:

That isn't true at all if you check the SC ladders you see tons of builds that have hardly any defence to speak of. However, if you want a well-balanced build you have to consider defences at all. No one said PoE is an easy game and it offers a myriad of ways to make your character tanky. What you mentioned are a few easy ones. The real list is far more extensive

Opinions are just that: opinions. They are based on whatever information the person has at the time and evaluated with their beliefs. The value of one's opinion can be judged based on if the information it is formed on is valid / complete. For OP that is not the case

D4 is a game I'd recommend to a casual gamer or someone who's just dipping their toes into ARPGs for the first time. Anyone who wants to play a game with more depth and established endgame plays PoE anyway

I'm looking at SC depth ladder, not sure I would say there are tons of builds at the top without defenses. I would also say that with the depth they are at, defenses matter so little that they aren't stacking them anymore. It doesn't mean they weren't.

As far as OP? Again, it's a feedback forum, the top locked post by GGG says to be nice. They created a forum for feedback and are likely in a position to adjudicate which opinions are valid or not based on better tools than we have, when people don't want to post because they see nothing but attacks on other people's feedback by other players, they don't post. GGG doesn't get as much feedback and we end up with a narrow and boring meta.

Are you looking at the delve ladder? Because that isn't really what usual PoE builds look like

And no one says not to be nice to new people, but feedback has to be vetted somehow and put into context. It matters when evaluating feedback whether the person says "I keep dying to league content, this season sucks" and then you check and they have 5k evasion + arctic armour, uncapped spell suppression and that's that.

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ArtCrusade wrote:

Are you looking at the delve ladder? Because that isn't really what usual PoE builds look like

And no one says not to be nice to new people, but feedback has to be vetted somehow and put into context. It matters when evaluating feedback whether the person says "I keep dying to league content, this season sucks" and then you check and they have 5k evasion + arctic armour, uncapped spell suppression and that's that.

Vetted by whom? Whose context? The players aren't the intended audience for the sub-forum. It's pretty straight forward. Also, if they don't need defenses to do well than who cares what their spell suppression was? Maybe they used one of the multitude of other ambiguous ways to build defenses that you mentioned. You can be as evasive as you like, you guys are gatekeeping in the sub that was literally not intended for it.

Wdym gatekeeping? This is a public forum where things are being discussed. It 100% matters if the person plays a glasscannon build and complains about content being too rippy vs someone with a well-balanced character saying the same