Experience loss driving some players away?

Here's another example of the problem the penalty creates. As soon as I made level 72, I went for Piety (I only had barracks waypoint). Fighting my way to Piety got me around 30% of my experience for level (this was starting from Barracks waypoint). Died twice doing Piety solo, but got her.

Back to 0%.

I ran docks to get from 71-72 so I'm a bit burned out on it. Decided to do a Dried Lake map. Slow undead. Perfect and easy for a LA Ranger. Dropped the boss without a problem. Was getting some descent experience; was around the 15% mark when I was nearly done with the map.

BAM. Dead. Even now as I write this, no idea how. 3200 health, was full, fighting. Never saw what got me (there weren't any insta-hit mobs). Didn't notice Desynch. Went back and killed mobs without taking a single hit. Regardless, it was a BS death I couldn't even pinpoint.

Back to 0%.

Finished map. Had about 2% when done. So, getting to piety and doing the map was around an hour of gameplay experience. All gone.

I got crap items from Piety, and nothing good from the map. Overall, it was a wasted experience (save the 2 points from completing the quest), and left me irritated; because if I don't get any drops, I can only benefit from the experience (not counting the one time quest). If I don't get any experience or drops, the entire endeavor is a failure.

This is the sort of problem the experience penalty system creates. People play these games to progress. To build. To obtain rewards. I haven't played a game that takes your experience away in a LONG time (5+ years), and feel the risk factor is now overtaking the fun factor, especially as each level I make causes the 15% cost of experience per death to be greater and greater, yet the game drives you to do harder and harder content to obtain experience and pursue better gear. The game pushes you to die.

There is a fine line between fun challenge and stress challenge. I certainly hope the goal of PoE is to serve a fun challenge to its player base.

Ultimately, the current penalty system is not a good one. It angers players by causing a complete loss of gaming experience (e.g. if you get no drops after losing experience you have nothing to show for your gameplay), endorses a dated mechanic that other games have already figured out is unnecessary, and serves no legitimate purpose.

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Drahken wrote:

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Adultery wrote:

i don't know if this has been brought up yet, but Diablo 2 did have an experience penalty on death. BUT, in a later patch they made it to where you got most of it back if you recovered your corpse(s) without leaving the game.

later patch? im pretty sure it was like that from the start

Can confirm that was a core feature of release D2.

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Adultery wrote:

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DothQuothTheRaven wrote:

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My friend isn't the only one who won't play a game with experience loss. I talked to my wife about trying the game out as well (she played D2/D3/Sacred/Dungeon Siege, etc) and she won't play it either because she doesn't want to deal with the XP loss penalty.

This is not the first time I have seen this comparison. I think some people don't really remember all the details.

D2=Loss of gold and xp on death in higher difficulties

D3=Loss of gold(repair costs) on death after (I forget what level)

Sacred 2=Loss of survival bonus, which is loss of stat points and magic find, even in bronze.
(Easiest level)

All Dungeon Sieges=no penalty for death

One of the mentioned games has an xp loss and most of the others have some penalty. POE seems to be in line with most other similar games. Sacred/Sacred 2's having the worst penalty IMHO, due to the fact you just got killed and now have lost life, mana, defensive and offensive stats making you even more prone to death.

i don't know if this has been brought up yet, but Diablo 2 did have an experience penalty on death. BUT, in a later patch they made it to where you got most of it back if you recovered your corpse(s) without leaving the game.

diablo 2 didn't have desync problems.

diablo 2 didn't have builds that needed to revolve around life nodes and ES nodes to survive >_>''

And yet another. Was doing a L66 dungeon with my level 73 LA ranger. Was going through the rooms; all is going well. I threw two volleys into a room with new mobs - unknown to me - blackguard elites...

2 shots. BAM. Dead from full health. Never saw it coming.

Doing maps that's about 30-45 mins of experience loss, just because I let 2 volleys go in a room with new mobs I didn't know had elemental reflect.

Getting experience is already tedious. Put a good 4-5 hours (if not more) into the game today and I was barely at 75% of level. Now I'm back to 60%.

Is anyone at GGG getting how plain stupid the death penalty is, and how it's not "penalizing" players, but punishing them for simply playing the game?

If you want to penalize players for death, put a debuff that stacks and lowers experience gained for a few mins per death or something...

I know no one cares but I quit 2 months ago because of exp loss. I work full time have family, I don't have time for that stupid exp loss crap. I also stopped spending $$ on this game two months ago, if I wanted to play HC I would...but I don't.

It's like we need a supersoftcore or something, with no xp loss at all!

Just glanced at this trainwreck of a thread and saw someone say d2 never had desync.

So I guess someone just never used Charge + Hammer huh?

You do realize THERE WAS AN ACTUAL STRATEGY IN DIABLO 2 BUILT AROUND CAUSING AS MUCH DESYNC AS YOU POSSIBLY COULD SO NO ONE WOULD KNOW WHERE YOU WERE COMING FROM UNTIL IT WAS TOO LATE IN DUELS RIGHT?

SERIOUSLY? NO DESYNC IN D2? REALLY? SERIOUSLY AND TRULY?

I LOVE D2 IT'S MY MOST FAVORITE PC GAME OF ALL TIME, LITERALLY.

BUT EVEN I WONT SPOUT SUCH GARBAGE AS TO SAY D2 HAD NO DESYNC.

Jesus christ almighty.

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varybadkitty wrote:

It's like we need a supersoftcore or something, with no xp loss at all!

Yup, just call it "excusecore". The 'I have a family and a job and a life and don't play 20 hours a week (as do another massive group of people who don't find xp loss terrifying)' core.

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Mooginator wrote:

Is anyone at GGG getting how plain stupid the death penalty is, and how it's not "penalizing" players, but punishing them for simply playing the game?

As you know, they're not punishing you for 'simply playing the game', they're punishing you simply for not playing the game well. If it's that hard for you - as it is intended to be, you're getting into the higher levels now! - roll up another toon and keep playing on the levels you can handle. No shame in that. The rest of the game is just as much fun.

Other ARPGs are coming in the next few months, hopefully they won't punish us for playing them :)

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Other ARPGs are coming in the next few months, hopefully they won't punish us for playing them :)

sure hope so. we have way too many "not so skilled" players :)