when is next league out? surely not in early april?

you clearly didnt play diablo 3 on release i did i played as free to play user i played like 10-12 hours a day diablo 3 for several months farming up items to make my character stronger and guess what i couldnt do the hardest game content not even close but i could have bought items for like 20$ per piece wich were 10x times better than my items to enable do the hardest game content blizzard have milions of people like you with the same exact mindset deffending pay to win mechanics and saying how it isnt a bad thing

"

Pashid wrote:

You will realize that the end of the next league is approximately around the same time as the exile con this year.
Probably means that we either get PoE 2 after the next league or a league after that cause they for sure want to keep up with D4.


D4 could have some potential but I highly doubt that they learned out of their mistakes in D3. Story is probably nice and the gameplay is going to be decent at first, if not already watered down right away. I mean the last wow expansion is somewhat a good indicator of how little effort they put into their games these days.

There is a zero percent chance that PoE 4.0 is released in 2023. We will be lucky to see an open beta in the winter.

"

Gopstop22 wrote:

you clearly didnt play diablo 3 on release i did i played as free to play user i played like 10-12 hours a day diablo 3 for several months farming up items to make my character stronger and guess what i couldnt do the hardest game content not even close but i could have bought items for like 20$ per piece wich were 10x times better than my items to enable be do the hardest game content you are the reason why scum companies are still alive and doing well becuz you are white knighting and deffending scummy pay to win companies that in itself is ridicilous

Stop worrying what other people do with their money and you will feel much better.

You cannot P2W anything in PvE games beyond time savers and QoL. For some people their life and time is more valuable than a few dollars or upsetting some sort of individual gaming purity stance.

If you dont value your own time or your QoL, that's fine, but don't put that on others. That's a you thing.

And just curious, who isnt a "scum" company to you with this standard? Or maybe you just dislike them all.

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

"

Orbaal wrote:

I dont think D4 is going to be a longterm competitor.
A couple of weeks, possibly months, yeah sure.
But then what? Players will run out of new content to interact with rather sooner than later since D4 wont be able to compete on that front at all.

Based on what though? Is it just like a gut feeling you have or feeling a certain way about Blizzard?

None of the above ;)

My assessment or estimate is based on the belief that PoE is catering to a different group of ARPG enjoyers than D4 does.
There is going to be a huge overlap initially but ultimately I dont think both are really competitors.

As a terrible example:
If both games were restaurants serving food and one was specialized in meat and the other one in vegan stuff, then both are sort of competing over the same crowd (hungry folks) but also arent really competing all that much.

If that makes sense

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

"

Gopstop22 wrote:

you clearly didnt play diablo 3 on release i did i played as free to play user i played like 10-12 hours a day diablo 3 for several months farming up items to make my character stronger and guess what i couldnt do the hardest game content not even close but i could have bought items for like 20$ per piece wich were 10x times better than my items to enable be do the hardest game content you are the reason why scum companies are still alive and doing well becuz you are white knighting and deffending scummy pay to win companies that in itself is ridicilous

Stop worrying what other people do with their money and you will feel much better.

You cannot P2W anything in PvE games beyond time savers and QoL. For some people their life and time is more valuable than a few dollars or upsetting some sort of individual gaming purity stance.

If you dont value your own time or your QoL, that's fine, but don't put that on others. That's a you thing.

And just curious, who isnt a "scum" company to you with this standard? Or maybe you just dislike them all.

either you simply ignored my post or you didnt even understand it either way its kinda pointless to try talk some sense in you becuz your mindset is set on deffending pay to win and how its a good thing to have for games

"

Orbaal wrote:

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

"

Orbaal wrote:

I dont think D4 is going to be a longterm competitor.
A couple of weeks, possibly months, yeah sure.
But then what? Players will run out of new content to interact with rather sooner than later since D4 wont be able to compete on that front at all.

Based on what though? Is it just like a gut feeling you have or feeling a certain way about Blizzard?

None of the above ;)

My assessment or estimate is based on the belief that PoE is catering to a different group of ARPG enjoyers than D4 does.
There is going to be a huge overlap initially but ultimately I dont think both are really competitors.

As a terrible example:
If both games were restaurants serving food and one was specialized in meat and the other one in vegan stuff, then both are sort of competing over the same crowd (hungry folks) but also arent really competing all that much.

If that makes sense

It does to me, at least :-)


PoE does have a portion of a playerbase that's just there because of lack of ARPGs on the market. There's a bunch of people eating at the vegan restaurant craving for meat. And after a while they'll eat meat and vegetables as a whole meal, mixing it (I bet).

The core group that lasts through leagues will grind through D4 in about a week, or less, and return. Some won't like the first bite, some won't even try. No issues there for GGG I think.

But then there's the factor on how well it does for streamers. Hideout warrior is considered bad content because it is boring to watch. Long trade sessions are boring to watch. Rolling maps, reconfiguring atlas stuff, checking outgame sources, all boring. And Diablo 4 has none of that, it's all play.

But how diverse and exciting will D4's endgame loop be? And how many different specs or classes or whatever are there? If it's anything like D3 there will be one for each class, so like...6? on the ladder, because they rotate the strongest build around with sets, more or less, per season.

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

D2,D3, and D2R performed outstanding in nearly every measurable, category. I don't see a massive deviation here.

And yet POE has managed to co exist alongside them just fine. Doesn't it follow that D4 won't really change that mid to long term unless it performs considerably better than D3? I just don't see that happening once the initial novelty has worn off.

"

RandallPOE wrote:

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

D2,D3, and D2R performed outstanding in nearly every measurable, category. I don't see a massive deviation here.

And yet POE has managed to co exist alongside them just fine. Doesn't it follow that D4 won't really change that mid to long term unless it performs considerably better than D3? I just don't see that happening once the initial novelty has worn off.

Well I would suggest that D4's plan is to outperform D3 over a longer period because of live service support. Who knows what will actually happen, but you do have to also consider the gaming market is larger now than 10 years ago, and casual/ slightly older gamer market is significant. (And will release on multiple platforms simultaneously)

I never said the two games cant co-exist, it will just be on vastly different planes in terms of numbers. PoE ain't dying, but I cannot imagine it growing, surpassing, or even maintaining its current metrics, unless D4 is absolutely terrible (which there is no indication I'm aware of)

"

Orbaal wrote:

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

"

Orbaal wrote:

I dont think D4 is going to be a longterm competitor.
A couple of weeks, possibly months, yeah sure.
But then what? Players will run out of new content to interact with rather sooner than later since D4 wont be able to compete on that front at all.

Based on what though? Is it just like a gut feeling you have or feeling a certain way about Blizzard?

None of the above ;)

My assessment or estimate is based on the belief that PoE is catering to a different group of ARPG enjoyers than D4 does.
There is going to be a huge overlap initially but ultimately I dont think both are really competitors.

As a terrible example:
If both games were restaurants serving food and one was specialized in meat and the other one in vegan stuff, then both are sort of competing over the same crowd (hungry folks) but also arent really competing all that much.

If that makes sense

It does make sense, I just disagree with the notion the type of PoE players you are referencing outnumber the casual/average PoE players Diablo will appeal to.

It's actually the reverse in my opinion. I think there are far more casual players in PoE that are here because they are limited by market choice, and are eagerly awaiting options. D4 will provide that.

PoE at its core can be frustrating, difficult to understand, difficult to discern what's happening visually, lacking key QoL that's gets outsourced by 3rd party tools, and overall performance is subpar. D4 wont have many, if any, of those issues.

Edit: not to mention fluid combat, character identity, and generally not difficult to keep up with. (No 15k word manifestos)

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

It does make sense, I just disagree with the notion the type of PoE players you are referencing outnumber the casual/average PoE players Diablo will appeal to.

It's actually the reverse in my opinion. I think there are far more casual players in PoE that are here because they are limited by market choice, and are eagerly awaiting options. D4 will provide that.

But what will it provide that D3 doesn't already provide for the casual player dissatisfied with POE?

One of the main focuses of D4 seems to be the open world stuff and that content is irrelevant after a few days. Very quickly people won't bother dismounting for an open world encounter while they ride from waypoint to dungeon and the world bosses are just big fat tedious loot pinatas. So you're left with dungeons which offer nothing over D3 rifts expect the joy of backtracking through empty corridors with no movement skills to get from objective A to objective B. I'm really struggling to see how they are going to move the game forward after release.