Tbh was kind of sad about the minion nerfs at first but now

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satanttin wrote:

now i kind of start wondering maybe it's a buff with the minion shield and rings and the +2 helmet it could be even better than it was before. not sure though but i'll league start it probably and see how it goes xd

guess it depends on new gems if there are no new ones that i would like to try minions would be my league starter for sure :)

also the 100 uniques that have been changed wondering about that as well everything is still possible with the lack of information we have so far.

If you were running Power and Frenzy charges in your build, the nerf is massive.
I've lost ~70% dmg in my builds.

No amount of minion affixes on Rings is going to give me 70% dmg to recover from that loss.

Shield is interesting though, I'm not gonna gain any dps from it. But it would allow me to run a % life on block shield with Convoking Wand type stats which would be great for survivability.

GGG said that they nerfed the baseline Dmg and HP of ALL minions by ~20%.
This lost dmg is supposed to be recovered from the new minion bases.

This however, does not count for the 70% dmg loss from losing Charges though, which will be unrecoverable.

People have mentioned the +2 to minion gem ascend so much, that I'm beginning to wonder if " Bone Barrier " is weak? Since they always only mention +2 to minion gems & never mention bone barrier as helping minions enough.

Why isn't Bone Barrier good enough for minions, or is it, extra hp won't help enough? Even with the hp to energy shield minion node.

Any minion build other than Spiders and Skeletons gonna be better than before... if you are ready to invest into it.

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Aynix wrote:

Any minion build other than Spiders and Skeletons gonna be better than before... if you are ready to invest into it.

Absolutely not. All minions, that include SRS, Golems, Skellies, HoP et.c. ALL got nerfed 20% in dmg across the board through a blanket minion nerf.

On top of that, Skeletons mages got nerfed specifically with a 25% nerf, so they got double nerfed.

SRS, Non carrion/stone golems, Phantasms got buffed.
Bleed, Poison and Ignite minions got buffed, but I think it'll still be garbage.
We will have to wait and see though. I've tried making Poison minion builds and all poison minion builds I've seen do abyssmal dps.

This is basically how it will look:
- If your build used Frenzy and Power charges, they're gonna be MUCH worse than before.
- If your minion build did not use charges, they're gonna be worse in the early game but better in the endgame.

If I had to guess, SRS is the best minion next league. Since it's temporary they don't get hurt by the minion survivability nerfs. They already do very high dps and the changes to the SRS skillgem will be a net buff in dmg, despite the blanket 20% dmg nerf to minions.

+2 to nerf hurts itemization also as you need to think a way to reach 25 level spectre yet again.

Probabil with 2 convoking wands which will hurt your defence.

Or just go with what you have and lose the damage.

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RuneLuthien wrote:

People have mentioned the +2 to minion gem ascend so much, that I'm beginning to wonder if " Bone Barrier " is weak? Since they always only mention +2 to minion gems & never mention bone barrier as helping minions enough.

Why isn't Bone Barrier good enough for minions, or is it, extra hp won't help enough? Even with the hp to energy shield minion node.

Bone barrier is extremely lackluster.
Unnatural Strength was just better as +2 levels provides ~20% more dmg and 20% more HP to affected minions since minions get ~10% dmg and HP from 1 level up to level 30.

Also, the actual Bone Barrier ability is just extremely weak. Most people prefer running Molten Shell which blocks upwards 10k dmg instead of 2.2k and lasts way longer which makes it more comfortable to use.

The best substiution for Unnatural Strength now is Plaguebringer.
It will provide 10% more dmg and reduce dmg taken by 10% which is about ~50% as effective as old Unnatural Strength. It'll also give 30% increased AoE which is decent, especially for melee minion builds who use things like Melee Splash or Explodey AGs.

Most minion builds already use trigger wands for their offering + Desecrate. So might aswell use Divergent Desecrate to spawn 6 corpses(Offering consumes 5) which leaves 1 corpse on the ground for boss fights to provide the buffs.

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Deadandlivin wrote:

"

Aynix wrote:

Any minion build other than Spiders and Skeletons gonna be better than before... if you are ready to invest into it.

Absolutely not. All minions, that include SRS, Golems, Skellies, HoP et.c. ALL got nerfed 20% in dmg across the board through a blanket minion nerf.

What blanked nerf? Not every build used Necromancer nor went crit and used apes.

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DarthSki44 wrote:

If Guardian and Scion end up being better for minions than a damn Necromancer, well then GGG fucked up badly.

lmao can't disagree there x'D

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kuciol wrote:

"

JoeUtopia wrote:

While I agree that any class can do anything….but shouldn’t there be a clas that something is their primary Focus? I mean, if not, the why have classes and ascendancies - everyone can start as a blank slate and go where they want.

There are few that focus on same thing or different aspects of this thing. In this case you have 3 classes that focus on minions so im asking why exactly Necro should be the best. It like you would have champion, berserker and rider and said that champion must be the best for blade flurry.

Skills have many tags so many ascendencies can boost some aspect of it. We had a trap example above. Why elementalist or inquisitor shouldnt be just as good for them? Maybe not fire trap exactly but lets say ice trap? I see no reason to besides "i said so". Do you?

I think there should be classes that have specific bonuses for a skill. Yes, I do.

If not - then why have any? Some games have done this with allowing the player Togo down any path they wish and specialize.

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satanttin wrote:

"

DarthSki44 wrote:

If Guardian and Scion end up being better for minions than a damn Necromancer, well then GGG fucked up badly.

lmao can't disagree there x'D

Guardian, Elementalist and maybe even Scion were already better, for some minions, than Necromancer. Now Necromancer might be just the worst of all instead being on par.