Unique far pro builds are obsolete, out of reach via stat links. How2fix. & Why defense build > dps?

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DoubleU wrote:

Knowing what little I know of Charan, I am going to say that his response was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

Yeah, going back to read the WHOLE post, kind of made it seem like tongue-in-cheek. But we never really know on these forums.

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鬼殺し wrote:

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Phrazz wrote:

PoE isn't an MMO, nor will it be. Ever. If people drag their MMO experiences into this ARPG, that's on them

The OP has a point though. MMORPG: Massively. Multiplayer. Online. Role. Playing. Game.

Is PoE massive? Well, GGG are always banging on about player concurrency records so I'd say so, yes.

Is it multiplayer? .......technically.

is it online? Does an MTX bear shit in the hideout?

Is it role? Well, you certainly do a lot of that with the dice.

Is it playing? ................technically.

Is it a game? Well, someone's being played.

Ergo, PoE is an MMORPG.

And what do all MMORPGs have? CHARACTER CUSTOMISATION OPTIONS.

PoE clearly caters to real life human players with its selection of classes/archetypes but does a really poor job of representing real life elf players. We know GGG live in the past in some ways but their lack of awareness of the needs of real life elf players is reprehensible and should be addressed as a high priority. You know if Mathil were a real life elf they'd do it asap. Shit, maybe he is. Has anyone thought to ask him?

lol.

"

Phrazz wrote:

"

DoubleU wrote:

Knowing what little I know of Charan, I am going to say that his response was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

Yeah, going back to read the WHOLE post, kind of made it seem like tongue-in-cheek. But we never really know on these forums.

Tongue and cheek? Maybe the hair color part. The most of it is simply asking for fairness of pro builds that reach the other side of the skill tree.

Verses builds that don't waste 20 extra stat points, the build that used 20 less stat links is usually better. How to fix? & Why would players want starter zone pro builds only? They probably don't.

I'm sure I'm not the only person who wants this.

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RuneLuthien wrote:

Is everyone's builds glued to their starter zones to be premium builds?

no

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RuneLuthien wrote:

These starter zone area builds are always more op, than a traveled map unique build, right?

no

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

Or would unique builds like a axe melee witch for example; be more viable if they gave players a few benefits for gaining extra stat nodes.

attribute stacking builds have been among the most op builds in the game for many years.

and no, it wouldnt make a melee axe witch better. builds travel around just fine, but if all the nodes you want are on the complete other side of the tree and more importantly your ascendancy choices have very little to support what ur trying to do then its just a bad choice.


axe leans to 2h, energy shield leans to 1h, witch leans to crit, axe leans to res tech. you can make a melee witch just fine and path it all the way to marauder if it suits you. but what are u doing? occultist? its probably 1h crit or poison based, are you necro? then ur block, so a staff or 1h, if ur staff ur crit.

these arnt problems. if you can just do anything and it works then its not a game, in a game you can succeed or fail. the witch has a set of tools, you find a way to use them that makes sense. its got very little to do with being glued to a starting zone and not pathing.

"

Snorkle_uk wrote:

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

Is everyone's builds glued to their starter zones to be premium builds?

no

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

These starter zone area builds are always more op, than a traveled map unique build, right?

no

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

Or would unique builds like a axe melee witch for example; be more viable if they gave players a few benefits for gaining extra stat nodes.

attribute stacking builds have been among the most op builds in the game for many years.

and no, it wouldnt make a melee axe witch better. builds travel around just fine, but if all the nodes you want are on the complete other side of the tree and more importantly your ascendancy choices have very little to support what ur trying to do then its just a bad choice.


axe leans to 2h, energy shield leans to 1h, witch leans to crit, axe leans to res tech. you can make a melee witch just fine and path it all the way to marauder if it suits you. but what are u doing? occultist? its probably 1h crit or poison based, are you necro? then ur block, so a staff or 1h, if ur staff ur crit.

these arnt problems. if you can just do anything and it works then its not a game, in a game you can succeed or fail. the witch has a set of tools, you find a way to use them that makes sense. its got very little to do with being glued to a starting zone and not pathing.

Ye tho attribute stacking oriented builds only equate to 5% of the builds you would want to stretch travel for? Theme wise. That's nice you say they are valid, still that type of build is only 1 type of theme or reason to link travel. What about non attribute stacking builds that want to travel, the other 95% of the planners time?

Ye I get some builds that waste 20 extra stat points, may hang with some pro builds. Tho generally speaking. If you had to add the top 10 builds, I'd say most don't try to waste on stat points & would rather gain better buff than +10 stats. So generally, aren't non stat builds more abundant?

Are their more starter zone pro builds & do the starter zone builds perform better. Ye Melee witch for example. Well dagger Witch is nearer than Duel Wield Sword Witch. So saying something is viable for 10% of the players is meh. Dagger Witch will most of the time always be better than duel wield sword witch. Dagger Witch will most of the time be better than Axe Witch. & This goes on for every class example. Also people need to stop listing jewels as a reason for the fairness of this, or some niche armor item. This talk isn't about item builds. It's about general builds, which isn't some niche jewel build theme, it's all themes on average. Itemless skill tree average.

& the average has less to do with items & more to do with how many passives you're wasting on junk nodes you don't need. For the average build traveling around the map weakens the build.

I'm pretty sure a fire chieftain around the starter zone, jewels aside (jewels don't solve everything anyways), is stronger than some dude who wanted a unique build & flew to the other side of the map. For that same ascendancy. On Average. Ye you may show a rare 10% or less of the playerbase example, tho on average, passives are stronger than stat points. Thus link travelers need some sort of benefit.

What if they don't want a stat stack build & want to get to the other side of the road? While pro.

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RuneLuthien wrote:

Tongue and cheek?

I was referring to Charan's post, not yours.
I have made myself pretty clear on my opinion about your ideas for PoE.

there is some truth in here.

playing a duelist build that requires lighting mastery or a marauder build that requires chaos mastery sucks because all the related skills and masterys are in the other side of the tree



extra points wont solve anything, may be the solution is in scion.

Scion is the jack of all trades class with the best starting positions for an odd build, unfortunately most of scion keystones are generic buffs and may miss on unique mods that make the build work.

the solution could be to replace scion keystones with "pick 1 keystone from selected ascendancy". this means that while the rest of the ascendancys can get up to 4 keystones (5 with forbiden jewels) scion will only get 2 keystones (3 with forbidden jewels) and a diferent starting point wich should be more than enought to get the odd build going.

My elementalist witch delves all the way into the ranger tree yet still has points thrown into the templar side, yet has one of the best damage outputs I've ever had.

You can travel far - but you have to have good reason to make it worthwhile (as far as node pathing goes).

An axe-wielding witch is totally possible, but whether or not you can make it worth the bother is up to the player.

The farther in content I go, the more restrictive my options have gotten. Not all skills scale up well, and that's been the case since I've started.

However, keep in mind unique builds don't necessarily mean better, or even good for that matter.

But I would say that I think the focus is spent too much on how to kill the players given that any time the player base starts to find something "fun" it generally gets nerfed into oblivion.

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Phrazz wrote:

"

DoubleU wrote:

Knowing what little I know of Charan, I am going to say that his response was somewhat tongue-in-cheek.

Yeah, going back to read the WHOLE post, kind of made it seem like tongue-in-cheek. But we never really know on these forums.

And now I have my petty revenge for the whole 'I don't get why people have jobs where they have to work weekends!' bit.

:P

(Unintentional -- I thought my tongue was all but pushing through the skin of my cheek like...well, okay, you can use your imagination there -- but I'll take it!)

...realtalk though, Exilebros: D4 is what the OP wants, and me to some extent, and I'm hoping to get it in a form that doesn't make me regret ever saying a kind word about post-Kotick Blizzard (he's still in only because it'll be cheaper to get rid of him later, mark my words). And if D4 is what is promised, then everyone wins: we more superficial ARPG players get a nice new playground with lots of shit to do, Exiles will still have PoE/2 for what they want, and Tencent...I dunno, Tencent always win anyway.

The problem right now is NetEase's woes in China may very well directly impact D4's production. May? Almost certainly will. There's no chance that Blizzard weren't banking on DI killing it in the Land of the Rising Yuan to fund D4's development. I hate that something potentially good was or is relying on the success of something absolutely not good. But then again, many a business has been built on the back of a stock speculation in less than savoury industries, soooo...

Until then, OP should do what everyone else who isn't happy with what PoE does and how PoE does it has done: play something else. Devote their gaming energy to something else. Because it doesn't matter how broken you think something is if the people making it and using it don't agree. There's only one way they'll come to see otherwise and it has nothing to do with those who've already written it off.

almost all builds path to 2 or 3 different starting zones, its very rare to find a build that stays exclusively in its own starting zone, its inefficient because there isnt enough stuff there. ive played the game for 15k hours im not sure ive ever played a build that stuck in its starting zone.

a dagger witch would go to shadow and if its life based probably carry on to ranger, if its es based move back the other way too towards templar. itll cover 1/3 to 1/2 of the passive tree like most builds do.