Unfair to standard players

OK so I rage quit at the start of the last league when I found that GGG had culled most of my favourite maps. Played a few other games most of which were in many respects much better than POE for what I want out of a game. Unfortunately they lacked any meaningful end game content so I have returned,

Thus not had a lot of experience with the new atlas.

Playing in standard I’ve paid the price and done the time to get all the watchstones required, at that time, so that I could run tier 16 maps.

Ran a corrupted rare T16 legacy map in the new atlas and got about 114 of 117 completion but nearly all were low level maps.
Have done the 2 new bosses which has helped a bit but it seems totally wrong that as a standard player I have a try to find and then kill uber elder and maven just to get back to where I was.

Surely that was not the original philosophy behind standard,

Sadly even if I do find them the chances of my being able to kill them is slime to none so I will be forced to rage quit again.
Of you got this far thank you for reading.

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AnyNick wrote:

just to get back to where I was.

might be easy to define your point of progression with everything done.

but it's certainly more difficult to do that for players with half finished atlas progressions and half of their old finished maps not existing anymore.

i used to have full map completion (minus 1) and all watchstones (16 iirc)

as someone who always tried to get full completion i remember how it was with players buying maps and carries.

it really sucks that standard players have to keep "refreshing" their atlas.

ggg really needs to remember that one of temp leagues original intent is to test out new mechanics to IMPROVE poe as a baseline, the baseline being STD.

i hope they really figure out how to make atlas nodes/clear more flexible that players no longer have to go thru "re unlocking" the atlas.

it is satisfying to see 100 map unlocks but its even more satisfying to NOT need to do that.

I've played Standard for years, and killing one boss to re-unlock nearly everything on the Atlas once per 3 months is not a big deal at all. I'm thankful that's all that's needed, rather than having to actually redo the whole thing. The one or two minutes it takes to kill a Guardian or other boss and be done with it is a total non-issue. There are certainly far more worthwhile things to gripe about IMO.

Edit: And I think needing to do the endgame bosses to get the Voidstones is reasonable enough. It's not like we were simply handed all the Watchstones when they were introduced. We had to play through the system and acquire them all, and now we have to do the same for the new system. It's more challenging, but it's not unfair.

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aggromagnet wrote:

I've played Standard for years, and killing one boss to re-unlock nearly everything on the Atlas once per 3 months is not a big deal at all. I'm thankful that's all that's needed, rather than having to actually redo the whole thing. The one or two minutes it takes to kill a Guardian or other boss and be done with it is a total non-issue. There are certainly far more worthwhile things to gripe about IMO.

Edit: And I think needing to do the endgame bosses to get the Voidstones is reasonable enough. It's not like we were simply handed all the Watchstones when they were introduced. We had to play through the system and acquire them all, and now we have to do the same for the new system. It's more challenging, but it's not unfair.

it s not unfair but it is boring.

If you're in std just ask someone...it not too hard to beat all these invitations...you don't even have to do the feared. And yeah it sucks there is no permeance. GGG's business model is constant changes, hype and donations based on them.

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cronus wrote:

might be easy to define your point of progression with everything done.

Not sure what point of progress you are asking for. I used to have a full atlas bare vaal temple and HOGP and all the watchstones so the atlas was all T14 - T16

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Aim_Deep wrote:

If you're in std just ask someone...it not too hard to beat all these invitations...you don't even have to do the feared. And yeah it sucks there is no permeance. GGG's business model is constant changes, hype and donations based on them.

I don’t know if you have visited std recently there seems to be hardly anyone there. None in my friends list that I used to ask for help are ever on line and there is only 2-4 public groups so asking for help is not going to work I think. And of course I have to get the required “maps” to run those bosses

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aggromagnet wrote:

I've played Standard for years, and killing one boss to re-unlock nearly everything on the Atlas once per 3 months is not a big deal at all…...

Edit: And I think needing to do the endgame bosses to get the Voidstones is reasonable enough. It's not like we were simply handed all the Watchstones when they were introduced. We had to play through the system and acquire them all, and now we have to do the same for the new system. It's more challenging, but it's not unfair.

I have never had a problem running the ONE map to get back to status quo. But now that is not the case.
Yes we had to kill the Conquerors but they were relatively easy to get to and to kill. Maven and Uber Elder are 10X a least more difficult to kill. And then there is getting to them. Rather than the, was it 10 maps, to get to a Conqueror you now have to do 10 maven maps to get to “mini” maven kill him to get 1 or 2 Crescent Splinters which you need 10 of to get a Maven's Writ. So thats 50 – 100 maps per TRY to kill maven. Fail and your back to needing to run another 50 – 100 maps.
As to getting to Uber Elder thats a logistical nightmare.

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AnyNick wrote:

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aggromagnet wrote:

I've played Standard for years, and killing one boss to re-unlock nearly everything on the Atlas once per 3 months is not a big deal at all…...

Edit: And I think needing to do the endgame bosses to get the Voidstones is reasonable enough. It's not like we were simply handed all the Watchstones when they were introduced. We had to play through the system and acquire them all, and now we have to do the same for the new system. It's more challenging, but it's not unfair.

I have never had a problem running the ONE map to get back to status quo. But now that is not the case.
Yes we had to kill the Conquerors but they were relatively easy to get to and to kill. Maven and Uber Elder are 10X a least more difficult to kill. And then there is getting to them. Rather than the, was it 10 maps, to get to a Conqueror you now have to do 10 maven maps to get to “mini” maven kill him to get 1 or 2 Crescent Splinters which you need 10 of to get a Maven's Writ. So thats 50 – 100 maps per TRY to kill maven. Fail and your back to needing to run another 50 – 100 maps.
As to getting to Uber Elder thats a logistical nightmare.

"

aggromagnet wrote:

It's more challenging, but it's not unfair.

Complaining that it's too involved or complicated or even too hard would have some amount of validity. Complaining that it's unfair to Standard players doesn't though. It's a new system that everyone has to work their way through if they want to max out their Atlas.

And next month when a new league starts, Standard players won't have to go through it all again. At least not those who've done what they needed to do anyway. Same for the next league, and the next. We'll be back to running just 1 map to open everything up until GGG decides to change the whole thing again.

What would be unfair is if Standard players never had to work their way through it, unlike everyone else.

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aggromagnet wrote:

What would be unfair is if Standard players never had to work their way through it, unlike everyone else.

voidstones aside. i would summarize 1 point of contention.

why do std players even need to "re unlock" their atlas. its been going that way EVERY new league. GGG needs to index their maps and tie completions based on that index. atlas bonuses/clears should be tied to the indexes instead of map name. that std players dont need to reunlock nor reclear a few maps that was just introduced into the current rotation.

as for voidstones, my main point of contention is the last 2 require very dps oriented builds in order to clear. the first 2 stones are gated behind bosses which are mechanically balanced where knowledge and skill can be used to chip away at the bosses health.

mavey / shapey+eldy? take ur time bro while dot vomits on the ground pile up.

I think the main reason the Atlas unlocking has remained the way it has for so long is because it works well enough.

If they really wanted to, they could rework it and change it to being automatically unlocked up to your previous point of progress. That would be putting some time/effort into QoL for only Standard players though. Their pacing in implementing QoL that applies to everyone and not just Standard already leans toward downright glacial to put it kindly.

The way of unlocking may not ever change, but I don't feel like it's a real problem. It's a minor inconvenience at worst.

My only complaint about Voidstones is that they effectively gated half of the T16 maps behind much more challenging post-T16 endgame boss encounters. There are plenty of people who can reach the point of being able to just grind through T16's but will never reach the point of being able to do Uber without being carried.

The challenge/tedium/whatever of that content is fine, and there are enough T16's available to skip out on Elder or Maven for those who really want or need to. But requiring completion of that content to fully access the easier and more straightforward map system just seems like an oddly backwards design choice to me.

It's still a one and done situation for Standard though. It's more than fair that we need to do it at least once and then we can be finished with it.