Auto trade. Price fixing solution?

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Nidal wrote:

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Marinxar wrote:

So after being accused again of not giving accurate information, I decided to run some polls on the popular platforms. Getting a feel for what the players outside these forums actually feel about this. Since I am always critical on myself, and want to be sure I am not fending on a false assumption.

Only around 300 votes and counting over the different platforms so far, but already very clear.

16-17 % Happy with the current trade system
30-32 % Use the system, but wish for QoL improvements
50-52 % Don't like the system at all, and want complete rework and something in the lines of Auction House.

Something that really matters when people take that 0.5 sec effort to vote in your poll, did they take the time to consider the consequenses and would they still like it if they did.

The main reason this topic pops up over and over is because people think its possible to have the cake and eat it too, and it isnt, any QoL changes will affect the economy. The hassle of trading is there INSTEAD of other measures. the question they need to answer isnt AH - YES/NO, the question is do you prefer the current system or would you prefer greatly reduced droprates or a BoE/BoP kind of solution.

PoE came from nowhere and is still growing, that is proof of concept.
If you want to change something as major as the trade then at the very least, explain how the increase of supply of whatever you allow easy trading on is not going to cause inflation and loss of value

Maybe give an example of how a free market where you can buy, use, and resell freely with easy trading and still avoid inflation of anything not extremely rare have been done successfully before and then argue that PoE can do it too.

If it havent been done before, ask yourself why

And to answer the person who used the "new player" argument. Maybe consider that there are new players who do enjoy the complexity of PoE and are happy to find at least one game like this. supported by the increasing player numbers over the years.

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Marinxar wrote:

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Nidal wrote:

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Marinxar wrote:

So after being accused again of not giving accurate information, I decided to run some polls on the popular platforms. Getting a feel for what the players outside these forums actually feel about this. Since I am always critical on myself, and want to be sure I am not fending on a false assumption.

Only around 300 votes and counting over the different platforms so far, but already very clear.

16-17 % Happy with the current trade system
30-32 % Use the system, but wish for QoL improvements
50-52 % Don't like the system at all, and want complete rework and something in the lines of Auction House.

Something that really matters when people take that 0.5 sec effort to vote in your poll, did they take the time to consider the consequenses and would they still like it if they did.

The main reason this topic pops up over and over is because people think its possible to have the cake and eat it too, and it isnt, any QoL changes will affect the economy. The hassle of trading is there INSTEAD of other measures. the question they need to answer isnt AH - YES/NO, the question is do you prefer the current system or would you prefer greatly reduced droprates or a BoE/BoP kind of solution.

PoE came from nowhere and is still growing, that is proof of concept.
If you want to change something as major as the trade then at the very least, explain how the increase of supply of whatever you allow easy trading on is not going to cause inflation and loss of value

Maybe give an example of how a free market where you can buy, use, and resell freely with easy trading and still avoid inflation of anything not extremely rare have been done successfully before and then argue that PoE can do it too.

If it havent been done before, ask yourself why

And to answer the person who used the "new player" argument. Maybe consider that there are new players who do enjoy the complexity of PoE and are happy to find at least one game like this. supported by the increasing player numbers over the years.

People that agree with you, are down to 15% already.

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Nidal wrote:

Might as well make a poll asking if they want to go skydiving for free but dont mention the lack of parachutes :)

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Clownkrieger wrote:

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Nidal wrote:

Might as well make a poll asking if they want to go skydiving for free but dont mention the lack of parachutes :)

bro just stop arguing, cant belive you can still take this serious after how he presented his "poll"... oh wait, you dont xD

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Nidal wrote:

And to answer the person who used the "new player" argument. Maybe consider that there are new players who do enjoy the complexity of PoE and are happy to find at least one game like this. supported by the increasing player numbers over the years.

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dW2005 wrote:

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Nidal wrote:

And to answer the person who used the "new player" argument. Maybe consider that there are new players who do enjoy the complexity of PoE and are happy to find at least one game like this. supported by the increasing player numbers over the years.

Well, could you estimate a percentile value of those "new players who enjoy" - how big is it, 10%, 1%, 0.1%? Oh, and well, regarding trade it's not complex in any way - it's just consist of crutches dipped in boredom and disgust, hehe. Oh, and aren't there bots, pricefixers, scammers, finally flippers like yours truly was in the past? Of course no, they are all an imagination of these nasty hooman-interaction haters, who secretly dream of the game and Holy Text Document being overwhelmed by the army of bots from the outer space, mmkay.

Speaking of these "interested in complexity" players - you may not believe it, but i was one of them, first coming into poe around talisman league or so (not sure, judging mainly by outrageous amounts of crappy talismans in my initial character's stash).
I didn't wanted to spoil the fun, so my lame ground slam build was like 90% homebrew and 10% basics from different guides, but somehow it managed to get to merciless malachai (which was the last boss before maps back then IIRC) only to be sodomized by him over and over.
So well, i left due to having some butthurt over it and came back at the last month of abyss league. Briefly looked at trade this time, saw it being the same crap as it was years ago, but thought "mmkay, this is a small indie game made by small indie company, i'll find all the crap myself". Then my second attempt on some SSF archer failed miserably, hehe, so next league (bestiary) i went full trade, cause that "fun and interactive" golem summoner i picked required specific not so cheap uniques i had about zero chance farming myself.
Then there comes the first taste of that supposedly fun and complex trade egg-sperience - buy a couple tabs of burial chambers so i can farm a couple doctors to finish that build; and honestly, it tasted like shit.
Anyway somehow i adapted to that clunky crap and over a year or so turned into your regular flipper aka "hideout warrior", like back in diablo. Did some builds via buying all the gear, doing some bosses, and selling it back in a few days which would hardly qualify as "playing the game", most of the time being spent looking at some lame webpage and "helping" newbies to get rid of their crap quickly for some 100-1000% pixel profit.

Well, okay, to be somewhat back on topic - new players are kinda important as they will potentially bring quite a bit of money unless they are masochistic enough to play using default 4 tabs, and the majority of seasoned players tend to bring less and less money over time cause they have enough tabs and shit already. And as that interaction with tencent proved, the old meme "i have my principles, but $20 is $20" is still as valid as ever, unlike some ancient manifestos.

Finally, i'm quite sure nothing will ever happen to that archaic [Removed by Support] trade and quite happy i dumped it long ago [Removed by Support]. It's just somewhat funny participating in the discussions like this one, hehe.

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Clownkrieger wrote:

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Marinxar wrote:

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Clownkrieger wrote:

exactly. now tell me, who is MORE inclined to visit the forum of a company and voice an opinion: the one who has a gripe or the one without?

Clearly you are the know-it-all, so you tell me ?

I suggest we use known factors, not implied factors.

I worked both in marketing and customer support, so yea, i know pretty well what im talking about. :D

you wouldnt believe me anyways or resort to some ad-hominems like you already did or whatever, discussions with you folks are pointless.

so... i rest my case :)

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Turtledove wrote:

While what you say is true, it does not really address the forum population though. If what you said was true for this forum population then if you looked at posters profile then most posters would only have a handful of posts. That is not the case. The forum is closer to a community. Most posters in the forum have far more than just a handful of posts.

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Nidal wrote:

No i cant, as much as you dont know a percentile value how how many gets turned off. But since the game is still growing and hitting peaks at the "better" leagues we can assume some stick around. Im also not going to argue that alot of people try it and get turned off by it since you simply cant please everyone. but looking at numbers and considering how long PoE have been around, id say it is doing very good both getting new players and retaining old ones.

By complexity i did refer to the game as a whole. there is alot to learn for a new player of the game and knowledge make a big difference. Lots of content, what to prioritize, how to be efficient on the atlas, the trading, the crafting and so on. I agree that the trading isnt that complex on it own but i just dont find it as bad as you do. Cheap items i pay a bit more for and look for recently posted ones. bigger upgrades i usually just have on notification with the stats i want and limited to the currency i can pay for it. rarely any issues. Not flipping any items or currency. not grinding doctor cards. just playing the game trying to do end game bosses and challenges