WTF is going on with map sustain this league?

I'm not sure what's going on either, I was running red maps (t11-12) and ran out of my reds, then I ran out of yellows trying to get back to reds, now I'm running out of T5, and I assume T4 will be next. I have played multiple leagues thoroughly, numerous awakener kills, too many simulacrums to count, quad tabs filled with metamorph parts, my ears have bled from the number of times I've heard cassia panicking over mycelium - I know how to invest in my maps and juice and none of it is working. I'm sliding down tiers at a rapid pace while losing every bit of currency, fragment, and scarab I have left

something is broken, even if not for everyone, and it feels really, really bad. I don't know how anyone could say it's a good idea to invest all of this currency and get 0 map drops. We need maps to spawn conquerors to get watchstones to get maps but maps don't drop.

One statement from a player on another game has really stuck with me:
If it's rewarding and not fun, it's ok
if it's fun and not rewarding, it's ok
if it's not fun and not rewarding, it's not ok and it should be looked at. My experience is here.

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

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RitualMurder wrote:

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

Your anecdotal evidence doesn't really disprove what he's saying. There just aren't a significant number of extra league mechanic mobs this league, so map sustain is much worse. On average, you still net positive numbers of maps, but it is not even that unlikely to get huge setbacks in map sustain because the margin is much lower this league, no matter how perfectly you do your atlas (and there's really not that much that you can do wrong with the atlas rn.)

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cpurdy777 wrote:

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RitualMurder wrote:

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

Your anecdotal evidence doesn't really disprove what he's saying. There just aren't a significant number of extra league mechanic mobs this league, so map sustain is much worse. On average, you still net positive numbers of maps, but it is not even that unlikely to get huge setbacks in map sustain because the margin is much lower this league, no matter how perfectly you do your atlas (and there's really not that much that you can do wrong with the atlas rn.)

drops in general are worse yes but map sustain should not be an issue unless you are doing something wrong
from time to time you might need to farm a couple maps lower 1-2 tier to build a map base at the start
but ive never before this change been in t14+ so quickly with such good sustain
you just have to do it right
if you are not hopscotching stones around to take advantage of the atlas mechanics you will have issues with moving up in tiers i dont want to type out all the strategy cus its in like 2 dozen videos and posts and im lazy
but its pretty easy and it works

You need vaal orbs, as simple as that. They are too great when it comes to quantity increase.

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RitualMurder wrote:

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

I've been playing since before the start of conquerors and I've followed a watchstone management guide.

It doesn't do much do downplay an issue numerous people are reporting because you think they are doing something wrong and there's no issues. I haven't ever had an issue in past leagues. There's clearly something wrong. Going from red maps to white and not getting even white map drops means GGG did something wrong. To think otherwise is ignoring a glaring issue.

Every post I've seen brushing off map sustain this league always says "you're not juicing" "you're not doing watchstones right" none of this should matter, maps existing are required for the fundamental, basic portion of this game to work. If they're not dropping for a portion of the playerbase, there's an issue. You shouldn't have to do every tiny little bit of content bloat GGG has added to the game to be able to play the game. Even Blizzard changed this with keys for greater rifts in Diablo 3. I seriously doubt GGG intends to have people slide down map tiers - especially since 3.9 was meant to help fix sustain issues.

With no outside trading I've managed to get myself to T13 maps reliably (I just took a break from my zerker to level another character, I still have plenty of maps at that tier). Sometimes I have a drought of maps (I had to drop down to T9 from T12 when I first moved into red maps because of lack of drops in those early maps) but I've since recovered.

What helped me were to do the following:

1: Before doing a Zana mission, clear her inventory of maps that I haven't done yet, and run them for completion bonus. Her inventory is based on map completion so this improves her selections of maps. Her inventory reset is based on running her missions, which is why I clear out her inventory first

2: Abuse Harvest for rolling maps without spending alchs/Chaos/scours. This means more currency is left over to get maps from Zana without having to trade for them. Even if you hate the mechanic, all you need to is periodically put down like 2-3 of each collector with nothing fancy, chaos spam until you like the result, then repeat. I usually crafted like 5-8 maps at a time this way.

3: Following a guide with pictures because I am dumb as hell about the new atlas. I used this one: https://www.reddit.com/r/pathofexile/comments/hbmims/guide_stepbystep_visual_guide_on_atlas/

4: Saving Einhar/Zana missions for when I'm trying to push up a tier, so that the extra rares boost the likelihood of upgrading my tier in einhar's case, or Zana's higher tiered map drops more maps of equal level to itself.

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RitualMurder wrote:

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

thats not so good :D
so players that dont know (or dont care)
how to manage new atlas are just doomed

players that just wanna go and slay monsters in maps should just got stucked
on white maps
im sure there is alot of them


they just play like my friend who is new to poe :D
i gave him 20 maps white tier 1 yesterday. today he tell me he dont get any higher map and ask for more

these 20white maps used to CARRY your entire progression back in the day



poe now is about having 20 3rd party programs and 20 info sites open :D
its not anymore about mindlessly killing monsters :D

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RitualMurder wrote:

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cpurdy777 wrote:

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RitualMurder wrote:

this is a case of watchstone mismanagement

watch some atlas guides i cbf explaining all the details here but if you are moving ur stones around properly map sustain and moving up in tiers should never be an issue

i was in red tier maps by 85
im now running all t14-16
havent run out yet

Your anecdotal evidence doesn't really disprove what he's saying. There just aren't a significant number of extra league mechanic mobs this league, so map sustain is much worse. On average, you still net positive numbers of maps, but it is not even that unlikely to get huge setbacks in map sustain because the margin is much lower this league, no matter how perfectly you do your atlas (and there's really not that much that you can do wrong with the atlas rn.)

drops in general are worse yes but map sustain should not be an issue unless you are doing something wrong
from time to time you might need to farm a couple maps lower 1-2 tier to build a map base at the start
but ive never before this change been in t14+ so quickly with such good sustain
you just have to do it right
if you are not hopscotching stones around to take advantage of the atlas mechanics you will have issues with moving up in tiers i dont want to type out all the strategy cus its in like 2 dozen videos and posts and im lazy
but its pretty easy and it works

I can assure you I am doing my atlas correctly, and have been doing so since the atlas was released. No amount of player knowledge will get rid of the rng gating that can currently slow some people, only mitigate it a bit. The atlas "strategy" this league is pretty much the most simplistic it's ever been, with just rushing corners to get the first 4 stones, then rotating the core 4 zones for the next sets of stones. Even doing that correctly, and using master missions and sextants appropriately, it is very much possible to get stuck below t14 due to the rewarding-ness only kicking in fully once you actually get past the hump anyways.

More likely due to Harvest giving almost free zana, the map drops are nerfed.