Vis Mortis Nerf - Hurts casuals and feeds pay to win

level 21 will be easy at little cost, level a 6slot full of raise spectre gems

max spectre is now 7 with body armour.. if its possible to get it up to 31 which i doubt with 2 midnight bargains then 8 would be the new max.

level 21/20 gem +
+5 from corrupted body armour with +1 to socketed gems and empower lv 4
+2 from necromancer ascendancy
+1 from new boot replacement
=29
Not sure how to get the extra +2 from 29 there to get to 31

If not using a spectre body armour with +1 to spectres then
+1 from Delve prefix with either +1 to STR or INT gems
=30

Lvl 4 empower, Spectre +1 max armour, double corrupt and delve prefix are probably not things a casual will likely obtain, empower being the easiest i think.

Overall casuals will still be able to play spectre builds just fine but anyone above that who wants to min max is going to have a nightmarish journey getting to for example where i want to be, 7-8 Spectres

So Causal = 4 spectre max, with midnight bargain 5-6

Non Casual players could go up to 5-6 and with midnight 7-8<- pretty sure the 8th is not possible but feel free to knowledge drop on me if you know a way to get those final +2 levels.

"

SilentSymphony wrote:

level 21 will be easy at little cost, level a 6slot full of raise spectre gems

max spectre is now 7 with body armour.. if its possible to get it up to 31 which i doubt with 2 midnight bargains then 8 would be the new max.

level 21/20 gem +
+5 from corrupted body armour with +1 to socketed gems and empower lv 4
+2 from necromancer ascendancy
+1 from new boot replacement
=29
Not sure how to get the extra +2 from 29 there to get to 31

If not using a spectre body armour with +1 to spectres then
+1 from Delve prefix with either +1 to STR or INT gems
=30

Lvl 4 empower, Spectre +1 max armour, double corrupt and delve prefix are probably not things a casual will likely obtain, empower being the easiest i think.

Overall casuals will still be able to play spectre builds just fine but anyone above that who wants to min max is going to have a nightmarish journey getting to for example where i want to be, 7-8 Spectres

So Causal = 4 spectre max, with midnight bargain 5-6

Non Casual players could go up to 5-6 and with midnight 7-8<- pretty sure the 8th is not possible but feel free to knowledge drop on me if you know a way to get those final +2 levels.

it could be possible to socket spectres in helmet and get +3 to minion gems from there. and i expect some levels on tree.

spectre chests update;
5 biomes 7+ boxes : 2 +1 spectre chests dropped.

"

MrsDeath_ wrote:

it could be possible to socket spectres in helmet and get +3 to minion gems from there. and i expect some levels on tree.

spectre chests update;
5 biomes 7+ boxes : 2 +1 spectre chests dropped.

so lets see..

1 from level 21 gem
3 from lvl 4 empower=24
2 from ascendancy=26
1 from boots=27
3 from helmet +3 to minions=30
and +1 to socketed STR or INT gems
Should be 31!

by god 8 just might be possible as long as you could roll the delve +STR/INT gem mod + the +3 to minion gems without having to risk blowing up a good +1 max spectre armour.

That's still a pretty big sacrifice just to have 8 of them and ceartainly not something a casual is ever going to have lol.

"

SilentSymphony wrote:

"

MrsDeath_ wrote:

it could be possible to socket spectres in helmet and get +3 to minion gems from there. and i expect some levels on tree.

spectre chests update;
5 biomes 7+ boxes : 2 +1 spectre chests dropped.

so lets see..

1 from level 21 gem
3 from lvl 4 empower=24
2 from ascendancy=26
1 from boots=27
3 from helmet +3 to minions=30
and +1 to socketed STR or INT gems
Should be 31!

by god 8 just might be possible as long as you could roll the delve +STR/INT gem mod + the +3 to minion gems without having to risk blowing up a good +1 max spectre armour.

That's still a pretty big sacrifice just to have 8 of them and ceartainly not something a casual is ever going to have lol.

minions being spells .... you can add least +1*2 while dual wielding, knowing GGG there might even be +2 level of gems on wands, which would give another +4 levels.

Hello spectre level 95.

Folks keep forgetting they got nerfed... LOL

Take the ascendancy... The 100% increased was replaced by +2 gem levels. This is a reduction in dps.

Dual wielding will result in loosing victario's. About a 25% dps loss. Your only gaining 16% dps for the extra spec.

Your wand choices will be to go for increased damage or plus gem levels. whats better? close to 100% increased spec damage or an extra level or 2 on a wand?

Last league I was at 502% increased damage. Soon as the league starts im going to be down to 162% ( cannot count on legion jewels ). Thats a 68% loss... how many gem levels will make up for that?

Biggest bone this league will be extra spec off the delve chest. followed by an increase in gem levels. spec alone is a 20% increase in DPS.

Delve chest and +2/+3 items will be super expensive. Eyes used for scaling are going up in price.

Casual players got kicked in the nuts and the pay to win crowd gets the win...

NS

"

Fruz wrote:

"

SilentSymphony wrote:

"

MrsDeath_ wrote:

it could be possible to socket spectres in helmet and get +3 to minion gems from there. and i expect some levels on tree.

spectre chests update;
5 biomes 7+ boxes : 2 +1 spectre chests dropped.

so lets see..

1 from level 21 gem
3 from lvl 4 empower=24
2 from ascendancy=26
1 from boots=27
3 from helmet +3 to minions=30
and +1 to socketed STR or INT gems
Should be 31!

by god 8 just might be possible as long as you could roll the delve +STR/INT gem mod + the +3 to minion gems without having to risk blowing up a good +1 max spectre armour.

That's still a pretty big sacrifice just to have 8 of them and ceartainly not something a casual is ever going to have lol.

minions being spells .... you can add least +1*2 while dual wielding, knowing GGG there might even be +2 level of gems on wands, which would give another +4 levels.

Hello spectre level 95.

In the midst of all this blah blab blah I just want to highlight that this is the EXACT same thing that GGG did to totems. In that case they gave you the 2 for 1 cast (which imo was terrible) and then dropped tree-based totem number caps and made the affixes on gear rarer.

This is a somewhat warped mirror image of that change. I used to play a totem character every league, and the above changes eliminated that. I expect some people liked it though. However, I expect that a lot of old regular summoners may be moving on from this build as well.

But let's see how it pans out. I am not a summoner guy, so I leave the minutiae discussion to others.

"

Slaanesh69 wrote:

In the midst of all this blah blab blah I just want to highlight that this is the EXACT same thing that GGG did to totems. In that case they gave you the 2 for 1 cast (which imo was terrible) and then dropped tree-based totem number caps and made the affixes on gear rarer.

This is a somewhat warped mirror image of that change. I used to play a totem character every league, and the above changes eliminated that. I expect some people liked it though. However, I expect that a lot of old regular summoners may be moving on from this build as well.

But let's see how it pans out. I am not a summoner guy, so I leave the minutiae discussion to others.

I've almost always played at least one totem and one summoner build every league since closed beta. At first I didn't like the totem changes but once I learned how to adapt and build for them I loved it. I think the biggest issue people are having is change. It's tough, I get it. But I think that once people accept that they can't build their summoner the exact same way as before they'll find that summoners did get buffed significantly. I gave up being attached to any specific build many many leagues ago for this exact reason.

I give Tencent as much shit as probably anyone but I think this is a really good change. I was very suspect until they revealed the gem levels for specs but now I'm pretty excited. I think specs are going to kick as with 4 (which you can get without even going necro) and now you can get 5 pretty trivially as a necro, 6 with some effort, and even potentially 7 (I read that max is 9 maybe?). That's just nuts to me. So I'm willing to surmise at this point that specs are still perfectly viable even on a budget and if you get some currency, well, you'll probably get bored watching stuff melt. Of course, if it turns out differently I'll be as disappointed as anyone.

spectre summoners was perhaps way too easy and cheap to get into the late game.

loosing 1 spectre (and 25% of the potential maximum deeeeps" is fair.

throw in some currency and get that back, easy.

or do like 95% of the other necro's are doing, try add some other minions too :P

or even a fucking 4L bane, which with all the miniondps increases will melt white monsters

"

PyleWarlord wrote:

spectre summoners was perhaps way too easy and cheap to get into the late game.

loosing 1 spectre (and 25% of the potential maximum deeeeps" is fair.

throw in some currency and get that back, easy.

or do like 95% of the other necro's are doing, try add some other minions too :P

or even a fucking 4L bane, which with all the miniondps increases will melt white monsters

What do you mean when you say that we lose one spectre? How do we lose one?

"

Dharall wrote:

Yepp in short for casuals (no items needed)

gem lvl19 +2 lvl from ascendancy = 3
skill tree = 1

total = 4

For those with credits at least 2 or 3 more from items.
And at gem 31 another one (gotta have to work for that one).

total = 7-8


Im totaly fine with that.

Isn't this the same as before or better PyleWarlord? Can you explain?

Specs got DPS nerfed through the ascendancy... Takes 6 ascendancy nodes now to get close to where you were before. You need the +2 node and the 20% more health.

This is still less DPS than we had in 4 nodes currently. +2 gem levels is less that 100% increased damage.

Delve chest retains its +1. Direct nerf towards casual players. Price and availability for this item are going to be high. This will be a high end player item or pay to win.

6th spec can be gotten through item levels. Most builds rely on victarios for 25% damage. That kills one item slot for + gear. Getting rare +2/+3 gear will be highly expensive. This again hurts casuals and helps high end players and pay to win.

Current rich and pay to win standard players with delve chests get a big win and a free extra spectre. Casuals get screwed and lose spectre from vis mortis...

Summary - Casual players got kicked in the nuts. Big win for rich players and pay to win.

Thread is full of folks making posts on how things are better or making excuses. better yet are the folks saying casual players deserve the nerf. Ignore them. Do your own math.

NS

With this blatant of a nerf against casuals you have to wonder about GGG's future plans with other classes. Casuals are players that are obviously less than at this point.

[[/quote]

Isn't this the same as before or better PyleWarlord? Can you explain?[/quote]