PoE should look at D2 Median XL as an example for reasons to kill bosses

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Shagsbeard wrote:

The problem with PoE is that there's too great a difference between "good enough" and "really good" in terms of character power. If you make bosses hard for the "really good" characters, you lose the interest of those that simply want to play "good enough" characters. On the flip side, you make things based on "good enough" and the people who play "really good" characters complain that they don't have a challenge.

The problem needs to be solved at that level. The gap between the haves and the have-nots needs to shrink before you start talking about how content should be balanced.

This.

The "average" player already noticed the recent hp increase in rare mobs - especially in Incursions.

GGG gets the final say, and if the top 1% of millions of DPS players provide 80% of their revenue, we will probably see more and more increases in hps. I do not believe this to be so, but I could be wrong.

Look at other games that have designed extension of play around the "bullet sponge" mob concept. It is stupid, short cutting, lame design and instantly recognizable as such. Destiny, anyone?

The game needs a balance overhaul first. The difference between a meta and an average build is absolutely abysmal, and the power creep is out of hand (both for players and monsters).

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Raudram wrote:

The game needs a balance overhaul first. The difference between a meta and an average build is absolutely abysmal, and the power creep is out of hand (both for players and monsters).

+1

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Well, D2 became a hit despite of it... or rather because of it. Bosses meant something, they were hard, you needed to think a little bit how to kill them (at least until finding out how to cheese them) and they offered the best loot in the game, so being extremely rewarding as well.

On the contrary in PoE a boss is a bother, a stop-gap you want to go by as quickly as possible since they don't drop anything important with a few exceptions (Delve-bosses, Shaper, Elder for example). They are counter to what a boss usually stands for. Bosses in PoE are an utter atrocity sadly.

Yeah, but D2 times were different times where gamers still played because they can and were up to the challenge.

Nowadays when I see decreasing number of players playing HC in PoE, it's not so.

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Shagsbeard wrote:

The problem with PoE is that there's too great a difference between "good enough" and "really good" in terms of character power. If you make bosses hard for the "really good" characters, you lose the interest of those that simply want to play "good enough" characters. On the flip side, you make things based on "good enough" and the people who play "really good" characters complain that they don't have a challenge.

The problem needs to be solved at that level. The gap between the haves and the have-nots needs to shrink before you start talking about how content should be balanced.

Adding to this, none of it's going to happen unless the community comes to the realization that something needs to give. We can't just keep buffing everything and contributing to the powercreep that is causing this discussion to happen in the first place. We need nerfs, the "really good" builds need to be knocked down in order to shorten the gap between them and the "good enough" builds.

If the builds aren't strong enough to trivialize the game to the point of turning it into a walking simulator, there wouldn't be any need to talk about buffing mobs and narrowing down build diversity.

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Filousov wrote:

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Well, D2 became a hit despite of it... or rather because of it. Bosses meant something, they were hard, you needed to think a little bit how to kill them (at least until finding out how to cheese them) and they offered the best loot in the game, so being extremely rewarding as well.

On the contrary in PoE a boss is a bother, a stop-gap you want to go by as quickly as possible since they don't drop anything important with a few exceptions (Delve-bosses, Shaper, Elder for example). They are counter to what a boss usually stands for. Bosses in PoE are an utter atrocity sadly.

Yeah, but D2 times were different times where gamers still played because they can and were up to the challenge.

Nowadays when I see decreasing number of players playing HC in PoE, it's not so.

I think you have cause and effect reversed there. You also need to look more closely at the word "challenge." We can all make the game more challenging: Just set a timer to randomly crash your client mid-map. (Oh wait; GGG already implemented this.) Or put tape all over your screen so it's hard to see. Or use your cat as a mousepad. Turn your keyboard upside down and play that way. Why doesn't anyone do that? Because these are meaningless challenges.

It is because of the powercreep in both players and monsters, and the consequential split-second deaths which are just about the only way anyone dies anymore, that HC is no longer a satisfying way to play for so many people. Increasing client instability amplifies that problem even further.

Rolling the dice to see if you'll die today, and then building a new character if you do, is as meaningless a challenge as the ridiculous examples I presented above.

Here nothing are and will be like diablo and etc don't joke :)...

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Reinhart wrote:

Edit:
Also, Kitava is a badly designed boss that doesn't belong into PoE. The design clearly came from Diablo 3 and is a typical boss you engage in a console game. Absolutely hate that fight.

Kitava = Belial. Nuff said.

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neonive wrote:

And while we're at it - Secret Rhoa level :)

Oh hells no. Secret Toucan Level OTOH...

how to balance the game.

step 1.
set a max damage per second cap per tier of enemy.
This will narrow the gap between good enough and meta builds for their to be an engaging fight with rares/uniques/bosses.

step 2.
set cap to movement speed

step 3. with the above two done , you can improve drop rates to be more relavent to their respective item level.

step 4.
stop balancing game for the people who think 40 ex is a budget build.