Upcoming League: Pathfinder vs. Deadeye for a Piscator's Wander

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Alienbutter wrote:

Deadeye is good to start.
Parhfinder is better lv95+ with right gear.
But Raider is great, and you get the Ele Ailment Immunity. Plus Frenzy charges on Bosses are huge!

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Barn3y_Gumble wrote:

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Alienbutter wrote:

Deadeye is good to start.
Parhfinder is better lv95+ with right gear.
But Raider is great, and you get the Ele Ailment Immunity. Plus Frenzy charges on Bosses are huge!

No doubt, raider is a great class! Ele Ailment + Charges is huge, as you said.

But I didn't want to focus on Frenzy charges. It costs me some points to move to them which I could invest into jewel sockets (better imo).

My biggest issues is the movement speed: From a Deadeye, you get more... I tried alot with PoE pastebin, even with darkray's and maximum frenzy charges I still got to the result that 1-3 tailwind stacks (which is more or less always the case) "out-run" Raider in terms of movementspeed.

From the damage itself, I think they are pretty equal. Maybe Deadeye has a little bit more (taking into account maximum frenzy charges).

Anyhow: Which ascendancies would you choose for a raider? And what do you think? Seems like it is valueable to discuss with you, therefore, I ask more :D

Edit: Take also QotF into account. And there must be a reason why there are really no Raider KB's out there... (Okay most are pathfinders, but in endgame I guess pathfinder outscales them both)

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Alienbutter wrote:

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Barn3y_Gumble wrote:

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Alienbutter wrote:

Deadeye is good to start.
Parhfinder is better lv95+ with right gear.
But Raider is great, and you get the Ele Ailment Immunity. Plus Frenzy charges on Bosses are huge!

No doubt, raider is a great class! Ele Ailment + Charges is huge, as you said.

But I didn't want to focus on Frenzy charges. It costs me some points to move to them which I could invest into jewel sockets (better imo).

My biggest issues is the movement speed: From a Deadeye, you get more... I tried alot with PoE pastebin, even with darkray's and maximum frenzy charges I still got to the result that 1-3 tailwind stacks (which is more or less always the case) "out-run" Raider in terms of movementspeed.

From the damage itself, I think they are pretty equal. Maybe Deadeye has a little bit more (taking into account maximum frenzy charges).

Anyhow: Which ascendancies would you choose for a raider? And what do you think? Seems like it is valueable to discuss with you, therefore, I ask more :D

Edit: Take also QotF into account. And there must be a reason why there are really no Raider KB's out there... (Okay most are pathfinders, but in endgame I guess pathfinder outscales them both)

I would pick Avatar of Slaughter and Veil. This will give you Dmg, perma Phasing, Immunity vs chill, shock, ignite and a lot of movement speed.
I played this league Windripper and Hopeshredder MF and switched 2 times Deadeye vs Raider.
Deadeye is great for Dmg and free pierce, tailwind and it should be faster,... but Raider is safer and you always run through the mobs/doors. You will not get blocked in indoor Layouts.
I think if you have a support Deadeye is better, Solo Raider and late game go for Pathfinder when you have the gear.
Bosses are a problem and Raider with Frenzy can handle them better than Deadeye.

What skills do you plan to use?
Kinetic Blast 4L
Barrage 6L?

QotF is good,... but I think a Daressos Defiance with 100% onslaught effect and Avatar of Onslaught 100% should even be faster with Fenzy charges. QotF forces you to use Grace Aura,.. this leaves only HoI.
With Daresso’s you can pick Wrath or Hatred,.. whatever you like.
The nerfs hit Queen hard, you can check my profile I got a Deadeye and one Raider with similar builds.
Just import the builds in PoB (Alienbutter Accountname) and play around with it.

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Barn3y_Gumble wrote:

Okay, I see the point. Now I am quite unsure :D (Guess I have to play around with the skills to see the difference).

There is still a difference in KB and Bows (which you use): A KB needs to go all the way up to which area to get those juicy nodes like "Fusillade", "Arcing Blows", "Throatseeker" (and so on).

This locks some passives of course to get the, which would be free'd up without picking the maximum frenzy charges.

But still, I get your point.

On the other hand: Avatar of Chase also looks great. Do you have perma onslaught with HoI setup? I planned to use the same.

Still, I see alot of players not using grace when having Qotf - maybe you have your Evasion Rating in mind with your chars (if not I just import them like you said when I am home).

Plan is: 4l KB (For league start in thunderfists): KB > Ele Damage with Attacks > GMP > Damage on Full life

and a 6L barrage: Barrage > Ele Damage with Attacks > Ele Focus > GMP > Added Lightning > Crit Multi

I have read so many threads so far, that things tend to get really unclear xD.

What definetly is a fact: Pathfinder is superior in endgame (dying sun, vintkar's etc.).

But for a starter, I still can't decide. Maybe without Qotf the gear opens up more slots for other stuffs, and than, I guess a Raider is faster than a pathfinder. Maybe I can twerk the tree a bit. With full ascendency I could get up to 7 frenzy charges, which are perma up more or less. This would result in
14% inc. movement speed, 49% attackspeed, 21% inc. damage, 28% more damage - quite huge.


So the bottom line (so far) if I got you right: You would say a raider is faster and stronger than a deadeye?


Edit: I think I found the reason why people don't play Raider KB that much: As a raider, you get super fast (concerning attacks). This make your KB very manahungry (which is quite bad...)

Also found this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7kUfwmRcqE

I guess the decision is made: I go for a deadeye. I thank you ALOT for all your comments, still looking forward to your reply, but I think for a wander (maybe not for a bow) deadeye is better.