for everyone who wants a challange

"

Fruz wrote:

"

robmafia wrote:

also, it's as if i started this by saying that some builds are completely unaffected by reflect - trappers, totems, summoners, etc. i guess those are all gladiators, too.

One word : READ
R E A D

"

Fruz wrote:

I'm sorry, but mentioning mitigation as a way to handle reflect is BS, plain and simple.
If you build is affected by reflect, even if tanky, if you have x00 k dps, you are going to fuck yourself on the first pack you find.

Please read all the words, especially the underlined ones as they are key elements to understand the whole sentence.

"

Fruz wrote:

For the set of abilities/setup affected by reflect, should we consider that the mechanics ( and the numbers ) is fine because 3 ascendancies ( including one relying on "immune to reflect" /rofl ) can handle it ?
Is that it ?

Reflect in 3.4 is an aberration, period.

wow.

i'm supposed to "READ" the part i not only read before but REFUTED?

the part that was btfo by armor/increased max res and block? wow. MUCH HARD.

right. i forgot that no one else can use the above except gladiators. nothing says gladiator like rearguard and xirgil's crank.

"

Fruz wrote:

"

Robmafia wrote:

as for casters - it's as if occultist cws builds weren't some of the biggest tanks in pvp for about 1-2 years. it's as if xirgil's exists, or something.

also,

So, in a discussion about %based reflect (inexistant in PvP), you are trying to back up your claim bringing in ... PvP scaling ??
And right after that .... legacy items ?


*sigh*
Now that your trolling is very blatant, let's move on.

lolwut?

pvp scaling? please show me where i said ANYTHING about pvp scaling? hint: never.

it's as if occultists can use xirgil's or something.

it's as if all 3 of those items are in delve, or something.

oh, right. those are just facts. my bad. facts somehow don't mean anything in this thread.

"

Fruz wrote:

"

SisterBlister wrote:

Surely you must have come to the conclusion "nope" by now? I've been told this, have learned to heed it (at least in this thread) and pass it on: Don't feed the troll, save yourself the trouble.

Many in those forum are genuinely wrong though, now that It has been made blatant that there is actually quite some trolling involved, indeed ...

argument get destroyed? fear not, you can just resort to ad-hominem and accuse someone of trolling!

/rofl

-> casters have to be either elementalist, or using a Niche setup based on Xirgil+occultist that will not even save them if they have huge on hit dmg ( like flameblast ) ?

Yeah, nop, you have not refuted anything, you've been wearing blinkers from the start and missing part of the context, ignoring important parts of some posts.

Did you miss the underlined 'if you have x00k dps' ?

Of course you did.

"

robmafia wrote:

pvp scaling? please show me where i said ANYTHING about pvp scaling? hint: never.

"

robmafia wrote:

as for casters - it's as if occultist cws builds weren't some of the biggest tanks in pvp for about 1-2 years

I'm going to start not answering you for now because the probability of you being drunk or high is legit quite high at the moment (if you are not trolling, obviously).

"

robmafia wrote:

argument get destroyed? fear not, you can just resort to ad-hominem and accuse someone of trolling!

Do you even know what ad-hominem mean lol ?
I could not give a crap who you are, but the nonsense you've been saying here ?
Yeah, that is easy to point out.

"

Fruz wrote:

/rofl

-> casters have to be either elementalist, or using a Niche setup based on Xirgil+occultist that will not even save them if they have huge on hit dmg ( like flameblast ) ?

Yeah, nop, you have not refuted anything, you've been wearing blinkers from the start and missing part of the context, ignoring important parts of some posts.

Did you miss the underlined 'if you have x00k dps' ?

Of course you did.

"

robmafia wrote:

pvp scaling? please show me where i said ANYTHING about pvp scaling? hint: never.

"

robmafia wrote:

as for casters - it's as if occultist cws builds weren't some of the biggest tanks in pvp for about 1-2 years

I'm going to start not answering you for now because the probability of you being drunk or high is legit quite high at the moment (if you are not trolling, obviously).

"

robmafia wrote:

argument get destroyed? fear not, you can just resort to ad-hominem and accuse someone of trolling!

Do you even know what ad-hominem mean lol ?
I could not give a crap who you are, but the nonsense you've been saying here ?
Yeah, that is easy to point out.

let me get this straight:

you think facts aren't facts because of some hypothetical flameblast? WAT. i forgot that every caster is a flameblast build.

you jumped to a conclusion about pvp scaling (huh?) and then just accuse me of being drunk/high?

wow.

who's the troll?

FACT: reflect can be mitigated in the manner i already explained.

3 Ascendancies and maybe a handful of build capable of handling reflect (in the context of builds affected by reflect, and not only for 10% of their dps or such) does not make reflect a fine mechanism.



I don't honestly know how to make it more simple to understand here.

YES, YOU took a PvP example as a Fact to try to back you what you said about PvE balance, this was utterly stupid or dishonest, and you did that.
It was almost as bad as bringing legacy items in the discussion.

Regarding those two things you did : TROLLING.
clearly.

By the way, since I clearly stated that I was speaking of builds with x00k in my first post, how much dps do you have ?
Just curious ...

FACT : not all archetypes/builds can mitigate reflect (unless they limit themselves to significantly low dps)


Back to the topic :
Reflect being a pretty-much binary map mod, it does not encourage people to run harder content, which seems to be correlated to the current topic being the xp penalty on death.

"

Fruz wrote:

3 Ascendancies and maybe a handful of build capable of handling reflect (in the context of builds affected by reflect, and not only for 10% of their dps or such) does not make reflect a fine mechanism.



I don't honestly know how to make it more simple to understand here.

YES, YOU took a PvP example as a Fact to try to back you what you said about PvE balance, this was utterly stupid or dishonest, and you did that.

...i referred to an EA/blast rain build that was the scourge of pvp for a while.

because it was kinda well known.

my mention had nothing to do with scaling - it had to do with it being max block (rearguard, rumi's, jewels, tree), high hp, high res, armor. i wasn't talking about abusing holes in pvp at the time (which would have been overlap dmg, secondary dmg - not scaling)

you know, MY point. the one i kept talking about?

also, i never called reflect "a fine mechanism," this is yet another goalpost shift you made. it's also strawman, so congrats.

"

Fruz wrote:

It was almost as bad as bringing legacy items in the discussion.

you're the one going on about legacy items.

AGAIN - every item i posted is in delve. nowhere did i say legacy items are needed. ever.

talk about "dishonest."

"

Fruz wrote:

Regarding those two things you did : TROLLING.
clearly.

ad-hom to the rescue!

"

Fruz wrote:

By the way, since I clearly stated that I was speaking of builds with x00k in my first post, how much dps do you have ?
Just curious ...

hard to say since i use a combination of skills, some of which are passive/autoattacks, but my main skill's tooltip is 103k

you also seemed to conveniently evade the part about turning off auras/etc when applicable (ie: ele reflect)

"

Fruz wrote:

FACT : not all archetypes/builds can mitigate reflect (unless they limit themselves to significantly low dps)

1. that's not a fact, they can actually mitigate it...
2. lowering damage is another way to mitigate, anyway

"

Fruz wrote:

Back to the topic :
Reflect being a pretty-much binary map mod, it does not encourage people to run harder content, which seems to be correlated to the current topic being the xp penalty on death.

and yet, plenty of builds can run it with no problem.

and plenty of other mods (ie: 0 life/mana regen) are just as constricting, if not moreso. hell, i think temp chains might be the most avoided mod...




edit: just to be clear, you're aware of / for phys, right? andd yugul for both? i thought those went without saying, but i may have given this forum too much credit. same with dodge/evasion, which aren't my preference, but still helpful.

And now you are going to pretend that you never linked legacy items ? LOL

I'll address that whole nonsense tomorrow, no time today, not that I will spend much time on it lol.

"

Fruz wrote:

And now you are going to pretend that you never linked legacy items ? LOL

I'll address that whole nonsense tomorrow, no time today, not that I will spend much time on it lol.

should i type "read" in caps and bold, like someone else?

one problem... this time, it actually applies:

"

robmafia wrote:

it's as if all 3 of those items are in delve, or something.

oh, right. those are just facts. my bad. facts somehow don't mean anything in this thread.

"

robmafia wrote:

you're the one going on about legacy items.

AGAIN - every item i posted is in delve. nowhere did i say legacy items are needed. ever.

talk about "dishonest."

You're right, I'll put it into spoiler then :

"

MrTremere wrote:

Back to the topic:
Maybe the solution would be to have a mix of flat and variable penalty?
Like 1 or 2% flat, and the rest being based on your XP/hour?

1 or 2% would not be enouhg imo.
For this to work, put 4 or 5% flat, then the rest scaling on the couple of last couple of hours were xp was gained on the character ?

no poe char's evasion rating is as high as the above post's.