Over 430 threads discussing labyrinth problems with over 1040 posters in support DONE!!!!!

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goetzjam wrote:

In terms of it being more prevalent, I have a challenge. How about the people that post about the lab on a daily bases stop doing so and see how many new people post. For 1 week or whatever.

That would not settle any issues sadly.

The main points of this topic have been covered already. The threads where conversation should be taking place have been "ruined" in my opinion. The Original Post in the main thread on this subject is almost always ignored or disregarded, and points on both sides are simply regurgitated because some people simply cannot or are not willing to READ (and it doesn't take reading the whole thread... just the original post, and tons of those posts wouldn't have to exist). Add to this people throwing around false claims about what people want and hyperbole, and things just got messy.

Occasionally, someone will try to get things back on track, but there just has to be that one person (different people, but usually one at a time) to go throwing a wrench in the works (sometimes I have to think it's on purpose, but I try to give people the benefit of the doubt).

But because the forum format only allows so many posts to appear on the front page, and people rarely look past page one, to keep a topic in the public eye, where the discussion has been discussed "to death", but hasn't been sufficiently addressed, it has to be "bumped." If there were some way to sticky it, like other forums, I'd just suggest that. There isn't even a list of topics that have been presented to the devs and that are under consideration. Truly, such a list would be difficult to maintain, and I doubt they'd have a community manager try to make a list of all the suggestions in this forum to be discussed by the devs, even for simple replies (though I'd want a manifesto reply in the case of the Labyrinth).


Due to the controversial nature of the labyrinth, and the hostile environment found in the threads, some people may not want to voice their opinion one way or another. Some people may feel that others have already sufficiently voiced the same opinion they hold, and they don't need to say anything. Sadly, that puts the burden of fighting for this change on the shoulders of those who will weather the storms of the forum until their voice is heard by those who matter.

Some people don't want to "beat a dead horse." SO, even if they would have added their opinion, they don't want to add to an already well-established discussion, where they'd simply be voicing agreement or disagreement with a topic.


Then there's the whole deal of "don't start a new thread on a topic, post in an existing one instead" mentality that is supposed to keep forums free of "clutter", but then this is used as an argument against a topic's validity, that not enough people care (sound familiar)... there aren't enough posts about it... yeah... ok.

So, rather than starting new topics, people try to do the appropriate thing, and keep one thread in the public eye. And yet, they get yelled at for that too.


I like how this thread is compiling some of the single posts about the labyrinth found scattered about the feedback and suggestions forum, (there would be even more if this counted those who posted in general discussion... I haven't even bothered trying to keep track of them all, since many are not voiced in "labyrinth threads" per say, and may be part of a person's larger opinion on the state of the game.)



(I do say sadly a lot in reference to what's going on surrounding this topic, and that's really how I feel about it, because if GGG were to properly respond to this, it wouldn't have to go on this long, and the topic wouldn't have to be so ambiguous. If we KNEW for a FACT (not assumptions, not wishful thinking, not extrapolated from silence or from a few words from one person in an interview that was far from conclusive), that GGG had no intentions of changing the Labyrinth, people could go on with their lives. If this is a deal breaker for some people who are holding out hope, they can just move on. If there is hope, and it's just a matter of time before they make changes and haven't decided how to do it, we could just wait and see what that solution is. Though I know there would still be posts asking when will we get details!)

The lab.. like many of the concepts floating around this game are half finished ideas. Because GGG push onward every 3 months, there is no reason for them to look back and work up on older content. We can all go back and forth over the lab being garbage or great. Over vocal minorities or sizable part of the playerbase. We can offer new suggestions and what not. But the sad truth is, it isn't going to happen.

The lab is the lab. Personal I think it's pretty garbage, and I spent quite awhile making a forum post on what should have been done instead. While I had few people post in it, it didn't really pick up steam. More people flock to negative posts and attack each other, rather then discuss possible solutions.

Just look at the recent path/league history. Time and time again, they just release new shiny toys to dangle in front of players but don't address core issues with the game. Keep band aiding the problem and move on to a new toy. Labyrinth is done.. it came out and it's in the game. They will probably divide the 8 points within 3 labs, prolly 3,3,2. That's it, there not going to change it.

It's nice to see the effort to compile all this info. But I'm afraid it's for nothing. It's not that were wrong about the lab, it's just that GGG don't really care. I bet you though, if there was another ARPG out there that was really successful, the Lab wouldn't fly in this game as it is now. You don't need to address issues when your king.

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Just look at the recent path/league history. Time and time again, they just release new shiny toys to dangle in front of players but don't address core issues with the game.

Those leagues exist for a rather long time now, they were shorter or longer before. Thing is they changed the game a lot, made it more accessible, which is something that some people might dislike because you can get pretty much anything quickly if you invest enough time, so you "finish" a league rather quickly.

They did address a shitton of technical issues. I would suggest that GGG just puts on 1.0 Path of Exile just for a week so that people see how much better it runs now. The amount of instance crashes is so incredible low now, they still happen and it is annoying if it does, because it closes a map instantly, but they improved it. Client Crashes though are mostly happening due to stuff out of their control, I didn't have an actual client crash since start of prophecy (difference between client and instance crash is that in the later case the instance you were in is still open and they only happen to you).

So on the technical side the game improved a lot. From a balance point... well it didn't get worse at least, we had overpowered meta skills since CB. The magnitude at some times was worse or not as worse. The Chaosstorm Traps that oneshot every boss might have been worse or not as worse than unkillable BV Pathfinders, but that is up in the air. Again there also was the Voltaxic Spark Ascendant or back in CB we had Ground Slam marauders using it through a frostwall (with a lot less enemies able to jump over them).

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It's not that were wrong about the lab, it's just that GGG don't really care.

People should be a lot more careful when to use the word "we" and when I is the more appropriate. Because it would be odd if we are both right about the lab, because we do have a different oppinion about it. Actually not even everyone in the threads that are accumulated in there have the same oppinion about the lab. If I would make a thread complaining about trials, which I do find unnecessary, I would end up in this list, but I am not disliking the lab, actually I start using it as a leveling area before starting maps because it has so easy enemies and I can easily restart before the first Izaro or just do him, because even if I have yet to cap my resistances Izaro doesn't punish that.

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Due to the controversial nature of the labyrinth, and the hostile environment found in the threads, some people may not want to voice their opinion one way or another. Some people may feel that others have already sufficiently voiced the same opinion they hold, and they don't need to say anything. Sadly, that puts the burden of fighting for this change on the shoulders of those who will weather the storms of the forum until their voice is heard by those who matter.

That though again is similarly true for the other side. If you just like something GGG does you are easily labeled as a fanboy or whiteknight which does have the same affect in reducing the amount of reaction.

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There isn't even a list of topics that have been presented to the devs and that are under consideration.

They cannot do that. Because that would mean basically a promise. What they said is that they might make changes to the lab in the future. If that is not enough, sorry more is not going to happen. If they promise specific changes, they have to deliver, if they promise to never change it they again limiting their options for the future. So they gave the obvious response, they are basically open to change, but obviously don't see a need for immidiate reaction, considering this statement is 2 leagues old and we didn't see a change. And this is true for most things, if they say something it is because they have a specific plan they are about to implement. They made bad experiences with promises and you can look up many of them on the forums (it reachs back quite far :P).

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goetzjam wrote:

In terms of it being more prevalent, I have a challenge. How about the people that post about the lab on a daily bases stop doing so and see how many new people post. For 1 week or whatever.

I will if you will. A week from the time you confirm that you will post nothing about the lab or in lab threads. Do you think you can handle that?

I know I can, but I kind of doubt you can. I think you're (ironically) MORE invested in this than those you accuse. Prove me wrong and accept your own challenge.

I really do not know how can anyone think that one portal for game changing points is a good idea.
DC and desync are good enough reasons why this is a no go... combine desync with traps its even better idea ... not even gonna bother discussing
Even the all mighty Uber Atziri that is less influenced by desync has 6 portals ....

The NR.1 reason why I die in uber lab are traps combined with desync lost several offerings due to DC and its really experience ruin.
I ran like 10 offerings in few days and 3 of them ended with DC and 4 ended with trap desync deaths ...

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JohnIrenicus wrote:

I really do not know how can anyone think that one portal for game changing points is a good idea.
DC and desync are good enough reasons why this is a no go... combine desync with traps its even better idea ... not even gonna bother discussing
Even the all mighty Uber Atziri that is less influenced by desync has 6 portals ....

The NR.1 reason why I die in uber lab are traps combined with desync lost several offerings due to DC and its really experience ruin.
I ran like 10 offerings in few days and 3 of them ended with DC and 4 ended with trap desync deaths ...

John, thank you for voicing your valuable feedback and suggestions. I've added you to the list at number 705. As the list grows longer our voices grow stronger.

Here's the JohnIrenicus profile summary.

Joined:
Jan 25, 2014

Last Visited:
Jan 22, 2017

Total Forum Posts:
60 (0.05 posts per day)

His account was created prior and the vast majority of his posts were made prior to the introduction of Labyrinth. I assert that JohnIrenicus is not an alt-account.

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JohnIrenicus wrote:

I really do not know how can anyone think that one portal for game changing points is a good idea.
DC and desync are good enough reasons why this is a no go... combine desync with traps its even better idea ... not even gonna bother discussing
Even the all mighty Uber Atziri that is less influenced by desync has 6 portals ....

The NR.1 reason why I die in uber lab are traps combined with desync lost several offerings due to DC and its really experience ruin.
I ran like 10 offerings in few days and 3 of them ended with DC and 4 ended with trap desync deaths ...

Thousands of people do the lab every day with 1 portal.

The lab was designed with the 1 portal balance in mind, the rest of the game, not so much.

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gibbousmoon wrote:

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goetzjam wrote:

In terms of it being more prevalent, I have a challenge. How about the people that post about the lab on a daily bases stop doing so and see how many new people post. For 1 week or whatever.

I will if you will. A week from the time you confirm that you will post nothing about the lab or in lab threads. Do you think you can handle that?

I know I can, but I kind of doubt you can. I think you're (ironically) MORE invested in this than those you accuse. Prove me wrong and accept your own challenge.

We need "bigger" players onboard, such as OP and everyone else we know that post about the lab.