[2.6] The Curse Whisperer - Tri-Curse CI Whispering Ice Elementalist - Viable for Everything

I was playing around with the gear and realized that I may switch the two rings with opal rings.

Here are what I got:


The int I got from these two rings are slighly smaller than what I got from the Perandus signet, but I got a boost on spell damage. The downside is reduced mana regeneration. But this is not too bad since WM can leech mana.

btw, if my calculation is right, 10 int is somehow equal to 4-5% increased spell damage, if accounted for the general gear boost.

Any thought on this?

"

MarvinMars wrote:

I was playing around with the gear and realized that I may switch the two rings with opal rings.

Here are what I got:

Spoiler

The int I got from these two rings are slighly smaller than what I got from the Perandus signet, but I got a boost on spell damage. The downside is reduced mana regeneration. But this is not too bad since WM can leech mana.

btw, if my calculation is right, 10 int is somehow equal to 4-5% increased spell damage, if accounted for the general gear boost.

Any thought on this?

An Opal ring can be slightly better or slightly worse than Perandus Signet, but it has to be MASSIVELY more expensive to be anywhere near. IMO that's really not worth the currency. And another downside: unlike Perandus, it won't scale with your level and gear. At lv 88 with decent gear you may get a little more DPS with it, and after getting a few levels and gear upgrades it falls behind Perandus.

10 Int gives roughly the same +DPS as 8-9% Inc Damage, at least at lv 90+ with decent items (not sure how much Int, probably about 1600). The math is complicated because Icestorm damage scales from Int in two ways, and there are 10 and 100 Int thresholds. But you can easily test it with a couple of blue jewels: roll one with an Int mod and one with a damage mod and compare what you get by inserting them.

This looks like a fun and interesting build, except for one tiny item: Astramentis.
That one goes for ~80c and is therefore a wee bit expensive.

How bad is replacing it with Carnage Heart at least in the beginning?
>40 Int, prisma res, leech are all very good and useful stats.

"

HHLupus wrote:

This looks like a fun and interesting build, except for one tiny item: Astramentis.
That one goes for ~80c and is therefore a wee bit expensive.

How bad is replacing it with Carnage Heart at least in the beginning?
>40 Int, prisma res, leech are all very good and useful stats.

leech is completely useless since its phys attack leech.

the increased spell damage per int is kinda negligible. with 1.8k int, thats 180% inc spell damage. the difference between 1.8k and 1.6k int is 20% inc spell damage. on a build that sits at a total of something like 800% inc damage, this is nothing to worry about or to consider in calculations which are already complicated enough.

no, the true source of power for WI builds is that the damage dealt per icestorm, i.e. "avg damage x duration", scales quadratically with int even if we (for the reason outlined above) ignore the spell damage bonus per int. this metric, total damage per icestorm, is the quantity that determines if one icestorm per pack is enough and thus has a massive impact on the map clear speed. and total damage per icestorm is proportional to the dps of the build against bosses as long as they are facetanked. damage mostly falls off against bosses that tend to move out of the icestorms a lot, for example hydra.

if it weren't for the duration buffs gained by stacking int, there would be various other ascendancies and skill trees which stay at something like 1-1.2k int but yield similar damage and ES levels. but those would run around with a 4 secoond icestorm while "our" int stacking version has 5.8-6.2 seconds.

hi there! thanks again for the guide! you are lifesaver for newbie like me!

"

Kelvynn wrote:

"

MarvinMars wrote:

I was playing around with the gear and realized that I may switch the two rings with opal rings.

Here are what I got:

Spoiler

The int I got from these two rings are slighly smaller than what I got from the Perandus signet, but I got a boost on spell damage. The downside is reduced mana regeneration. But this is not too bad since WM can leech mana.

btw, if my calculation is right, 10 int is somehow equal to 4-5% increased spell damage, if accounted for the general gear boost.

Any thought on this?

An Opal ring can be slightly better or slightly worse than Perandus Signet, but it has to be MASSIVELY more expensive to be anywhere near. IMO that's really not worth the currency. And another downside: unlike Perandus, it won't scale with your level and gear. At lv 88 with decent gear you may get a little more DPS with it, and after getting a few levels and gear upgrades it falls behind Perandus.

10 Int gives roughly the same +DPS as 8-9% Inc Damage, at least at lv 90+ with decent items (not sure how much Int, probably about 1600). The math is complicated because Icestorm damage scales from Int in two ways, and there are 10 and 100 Int thresholds. But you can easily test it with a couple of blue jewels: roll one with an Int mod and one with a damage mod and compare what you get by inserting them.

Thanks for the reply! I just can't wait for the test, so here it is ...

Here is the Jewels I got for the test:



This is all the possibilities, right? So either 10 int, or 10% increased of certain damage.

So what I did is to empty one jewel socket, and put one of them in and wrote down the int and basic Ice storm damage I got. I also tried different rings, so one set is with the opal rings:



The other is with Astra and Doedre's dream:



Here is what I got:



So it is 5% damage per 10 int, at least at 1500 int. I'm just not sure if I used the right number for Ice storm, I used Damage per Use.

But one thing for sure is that Opal rings do not boost damage too much, so Perandus is indeed the best for beginners.

Have a nice weekend!

"

MarvinMars wrote:

Spoiler

"

Kelvynn wrote:

"

MarvinMars wrote:

I was playing around with the gear and realized that I may switch the two rings with opal rings.

Here are what I got:

Spoiler

The int I got from these two rings are slighly smaller than what I got from the Perandus signet, but I got a boost on spell damage. The downside is reduced mana regeneration. But this is not too bad since WM can leech mana.

btw, if my calculation is right, 10 int is somehow equal to 4-5% increased spell damage, if accounted for the general gear boost.

Any thought on this?

An Opal ring can be slightly better or slightly worse than Perandus Signet, but it has to be MASSIVELY more expensive to be anywhere near. IMO that's really not worth the currency. And another downside: unlike Perandus, it won't scale with your level and gear. At lv 88 with decent gear you may get a little more DPS with it, and after getting a few levels and gear upgrades it falls behind Perandus.

10 Int gives roughly the same +DPS as 8-9% Inc Damage, at least at lv 90+ with decent items (not sure how much Int, probably about 1600). The math is complicated because Icestorm damage scales from Int in two ways, and there are 10 and 100 Int thresholds. But you can easily test it with a couple of blue jewels: roll one with an Int mod and one with a damage mod and compare what you get by inserting them.

Thanks for the reply! I just can't wait for the test, so here it is ...

Here is the Jewels I got for the test:

Spoiler

This is all the possibilities, right? So either 10 int, or 10% increased of certain damage.

So what I did is to empty one jewel socket, and put one of them in and wrote down the int and basic Ice storm damage I got. I also tried different rings, so one set is with the opal rings:

Spoiler

The other is with Astra and Doedre's dream:

Spoiler

Here is what I got:

Spoiler

So it is 5% damage per 10 int, at least at 1500 int. I'm just not sure if I used the right number for Ice storm, I used Damage per Use.

But one thing for sure is that Opal rings do not boost damage too much, so Perandus is indeed the best for beginners.

Have a nice weekend!

the jewels used in your test are a joke. they are missing 15-30% inc damage or int. when you get so little %inc damage from your jewels, the ele damage on the opal rings logically gains value relative to int.

a trivial example: assume a build that has 1000 base int and 0% inc damage of any type. taking a 10% inc fire damage node on that build would boost the avg damage by 10%. taking a 10 int node on this build would boost the avg damage by 1%. now take a build that has 100 base int and 500% inc damage of the corresponding types. taking a 10% fire node would boost the build's avg damage by 2%. taking a 10 int node would boost it by 10%.

what those two educational examples show is that the tradeoff ratio between int and inc damage depends on how many of each your build already has. on a setup that is low on inc damage, inc damage is worth more int. this is exactly the case in your test since you are missing tons of inc damage on your jewels.

"

Black_Gun wrote:

"

MarvinMars wrote:

Spoiler

"

Kelvynn wrote:

An Opal ring can be slightly better or slightly worse than Perandus Signet, but it has to be MASSIVELY more expensive to be anywhere near. IMO that's really not worth the currency. And another downside: unlike Perandus, it won't scale with your level and gear. At lv 88 with decent gear you may get a little more DPS with it, and after getting a few levels and gear upgrades it falls behind Perandus.

10 Int gives roughly the same +DPS as 8-9% Inc Damage, at least at lv 90+ with decent items (not sure how much Int, probably about 1600). The math is complicated because Icestorm damage scales from Int in two ways, and there are 10 and 100 Int thresholds. But you can easily test it with a couple of blue jewels: roll one with an Int mod and one with a damage mod and compare what you get by inserting them.

Thanks for the reply! I just can't wait for the test, so here it is ...

Here is the Jewels I got for the test:

Spoiler

This is all the possibilities, right? So either 10 int, or 10% increased of certain damage.

So what I did is to empty one jewel socket, and put one of them in and wrote down the int and basic Ice storm damage I got. I also tried different rings, so one set is with the opal rings:

Spoiler

The other is with Astra and Doedre's dream:

Spoiler

Here is what I got:

Spoiler

So it is 5% damage per 10 int, at least at 1500 int. I'm just not sure if I used the right number for Ice storm, I used Damage per Use.

But one thing for sure is that Opal rings do not boost damage too much, so Perandus is indeed the best for beginners.

Have a nice weekend!

the jewels used in your test are a joke. they are missing 15-30% inc damage or int. when you get so little %inc damage from your jewels, the ele damage on the opal rings logically gains value relative to int.

a trivial example: assume a build that has 1000 base int and 0% inc damage of any type. taking a 10% inc fire damage node on that build would boost the avg damage by 10%. taking a 10 int node on this build would boost the avg damage by 1%. now take a build that has 100 base int and 500% inc damage of the corresponding types. taking a 10% fire node would boost the build's avg damage by 2%. taking a 10 int node would boost it by 10%.

what those two educational examples show is that the tradeoff ratio between int and inc damage depends on how many of each your build already has. on a setup that is low on inc damage, inc damage is worth more int. this is exactly the case in your test since you are missing tons of inc damage on your jewels.

Thanks for you joke, oops ... educational examples.

If you read carefully, what I said is that "to empty one jewel socket, and put one of them in ...". So this means that the test is done using an endgame witch. If this is not clear, here is my gear for this test:



The passive tree is just what Kelvynn suggested.

All the jewels are similar to what Kelvynn has (and of course, one of the socket is empty for this test).

So what do this mean? The boost of 10 int or 10% damage is based on like 1500 int and already high increased damage (from the build and passive). This also taken into account the unique gear for this build.

What I want from this test is not for a beginner, but for endgamers that want to estimate which is better, 10 int for 10% damage.

You are right about the trade off, and I actually have the equation for this, but maybe too complex as an "educational example" :D

what's the easiest way to get the whispering ice,other than buying it from someone else in poe.trade?