SET FREE THE ASCENDANCY POINTS (or rework the lab) [New ascension methods/lab rework ideas]

Great posts by zaludoz, regulator, turtle, shred, and the many others. Keep up the good fight. Incoming to 350 pages.

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gibbousmoon wrote:

So which do we clean first?

Your example is nicely described and made me smile :)
But it does not cover the situation we have here:
The laby is the second most annoying issue in PoE imho (right after the lack of offline trading).
In an RL (big) company there are usually a few big problems and *hundreds* of small problems.

In managment courses they are trained to focus on the top three problems of a company. Well, those that know more than managers sometimes say that solving a hundred of the small problems can be better for the customers than solving one of the biggies. So do I btw ;)

In either case, the laby prob is among the things that should be granted top priority ...

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aDuke wrote:

In either case, the laby prob is among the things that should be granted top priority ...

That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
What you call "prob" might not really be one to them.

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Fruz wrote:

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aDuke wrote:

In either case, the laby prob is among the things that should be granted top priority ...

That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
What you call "prob" might not really be one to them.

The sentence you quote is an opinion.

Unless you mean to say that aDuke has no idea about his own opinions?

"What they should do" kinda implies what they should to for the better of the game.
He would have used "What I would like them to do", sure.
But "what they should do" means something that they would better do, and that is something that we cannot know.
What is better for the sake of the game, and what GGG wants to do with it is eomthing that we do not actually know.

You seem to be confused.

"Justin Bieber should stop singing."

It is an opinion. I make no claims to know anything about his plans to continue singing or to stop, and more importantly *I don't have to* to have this opinion. You can disagree with my opinion, and insist that Mr. Bieber should continue blessing us with his beautiful voice, and then that would be your opinion.

And we'd have differing opinions. As we do about the Labyrinth. It's... not a difficult concept.

I too think fixing the Labyrinth should be a priority, so I share aDuke's OPINION. It is not necessary for me to know GGG's plans (any more than it was for me to know Justin Bieber's) to have an opinion about what they should do.

And so we are discussing semantics now.


https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/should

"

Used to indicate obligation, duty, or correctness, typically when criticizing someone's actions
[...]
Used to indicate what is probable

Just the two definitions of this website ( xofrod dictionnary ) that fit the context.

In either of those cases, we have here no idea about its correctness or actually probability ( even though the events seem to show that it isn't probable ), and they have definitely no obligation or duty.


But anyway, you can justify anything by saying that everything we ever say are opinions, I'm waiting for this one ...

"

Fruz wrote:

And so we are discussing semantics now.


https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/should

"

Used to indicate obligation, duty, or correctness, typically when criticizing someone's actions
[...]
Used to indicate what is probable

Just the two definitions of this website ( xofrod dictionnary ) that fit the context.

In either of those cases, we have here no idea about its correctness or actually probability ( even though the events seem to show that it isn't probable ), and they have definitely no obligation or duty.


But anyway, you can justify anything by saying that everything we ever say are opinions, I'm waiting for this one ...

My view is that it was obviously an opinion. There is no reason for me to be concerned about your opinion of labyrinth or about Justin Beiber's singing career and vice versa. It is obvious to almost everyone that it is a GGG decision not something that is going to be settled here on the forums. Regards,

We are all giving feedback and suggestions based on our opinion.

It is not our decision to make if the game changes to what each individual thinks is the best.
We can just hope that our arguments and suggestions somehow reach GGG so they maybe have an impact on them.

Lab Haters try to argument in the most logical way to convince them for what they think is for the better, just as Lab Lovers are.

The difference is, Lab Haters try to suggest other ways, alternatives, solutions, Lab Lovers are down to one argument "don´t let them water down the content" , even if the solution would be to keep the Lab as it is right now and provide a different, equally hard/easy way to get Ascendancy Points, Lab Lovers don´t want to move a single bit in Lab Haters direction.

I´m curious if more people would play / come back to the game if a different method to obtain AC-points is integrated or if nothing happens.
I highly doubt that more people would leave if an alternative way would exist.
I highly doubt that there would be close to 350 pages in a thread with 640 people screaming " I hate that people now have a choice on how to get AC-Points "

All that somewhat questions the intention of Lab Lovers for me, it seems that the intention of them is a bit more self-centered ( profit ? ), then what is better for more people.

But that is just.... my opinion.

"

Fruz wrote:

And so we are discussing semantics now.


https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/should

"

Used to indicate obligation, duty, or correctness, typically when criticizing someone's actions
[...]
Used to indicate what is probable

Just the two definitions of this website ( xofrod dictionnary ) that fit the context.

In either of those cases, we have here no idea about its correctness or actually probability ( even though the events seem to show that it isn't probable ), and they have definitely no obligation or duty.


But anyway, you can justify anything by saying that everything we ever say are opinions, I'm waiting for this one ...

Every opinion we ever say is an opinion, yes. Um... duh?

This is one of the more retarded topics we could be arguing about. If you are unable to acknowledge the difference between a fact and an opinion, all coherent discussion will be impossible.

Your statement, "That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about" makes no sense in response to ANY opinion. It is prima facie nonsense.

Here, I'll demonstrate for you:

George: GGG should tweak melee so that it is more competitive with ranged builds.
Frank: That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
George: ...

George: Purple is the best color. GGG should put more purple in this game.
Frank: That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
George: ...

George: Baggy jeans look terrible. You should stop wearing them.
Frank: That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
George: ...

George: Fixing the Labyrinth is something GGG should give top priority to.
Frank: That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
George: ...

George: Oh, FFS, you should learn the difference between a fact and an opinion.
Frank: That for sure is one thing that you have no idea about.
George: ...

See? You can plug in anything you want after "should" (in the first sense of the word, べき and not はず--if that helps you understand--which is quite obviously the sense in which it was used) and it still remains an opinion. Responding to it by saying "You can't know that" will always be a ridiculous rebuttal.