Exp loss due to death's - Must read (Suggestion)

Hi, I use to play POE everyday, lately i only play for an hour or so. Mainly i do maps, I use alchemy orb on the maps before i run them. I manage to stay on tier 7-8-9 maps and try to gather exp for the next level. The reason why i mentioned this is because i wanted you all to know that i am a not a "rich player". I run my own maps and level up slowly with time. In 3-4 hours i manage to cover 20% exp for the next level (i am currently level 90). Coming to the point, knowing that it takes around 2 hours to make 10% EXP (for an average player) and an average player would play POE around 2-4 hours a day, don't you think that 10% loss of exp is way too much? I'm sure nobody would like it if they put 2-4 hours on a game everyday and within a blink of an eye due to one small mistake all that effort and hard work they've put goes away. We're not here to become professional gamers, we're here to have fun, but this punishment is way too harsh. This punishment makes you feel that you've wasted all the hours and hard work put in the game which is not a good feeling trust me. Its really hard for the administrators to understand how it feels without experiencing it but i'm sure other players would understand what i'm trying to say here.

My suggestion: Rather than deducting 10% exp, it would be better to deduct all the EXP earned from that particular instance.

Example: If i am running a map and i get killed by a mob then i will lose all the exp i earned from that map.

Trust me, this will make things a lot better.

Thank you!

up

Nope, xp penalty is fine.

- don't die.
- make another character if leveling take too long

Xp penalty is fine.

Don't like the "MUST READ" part in your title.

XP Penalty is fine.

must say no

"

rushjo wrote:

must say no

Must say yes to this no.

We see threads like this created or bumped multiple times a week, and the same handful of people post extensively in each one, burying the OP with declarations that the death penalty is fine. But you can't sit there with a straight face and say it's fine when we continue to receive so many complaints about it.

To the upper echelon of players representing the greatest forum voice (top 10%, i.e. anyone consistently running mid-upper tier maps), the death penalty is probably almost universally viewed amongst this group as being fine at lower levels, where XP loss from a death might equate to 5 minutes or less of lost progression. However, only a much smaller portion of this group (top 1% or less) have actually experienced the death penalty in the extremely punishing range (level 95-100), where a death removes multiple ex worth of maps and a day or more of progression.

The scaling of the penalty is problematic. To me it's only absurd at the 95-100 range, but I suspect the progression loss can begin to feel overly punishing to the non-upper echelon of players at a lower level. In fact, I suspect it's one of the reasons why we see such a large % of the player base cease leveling goals so early.

In addition to negatively impacting the motivation to level, the severity of the death penalty when scaled at 95-100 has a strong, and arguably negative, influence on behavior and build design. If/when the penalty begins to feel too punishing, players will begin to opt out of challenging content in order to level (fundamentally hampering their own enjoyment of the game). Furthermore, players who are dead set on reaching the highest level will exclusively seek out build designs that eliminate any risk of death - this may even impact non-upper echelon players, who theory craft a 100 viable build and get bored playing it.

The oft lauded solution to the death penalty of "don't die" is exactly the problem, because of what "don't die" does to gameplay and build design. When a single death eliminates 40 consecutive maps and 8 hours of playtime, the only choice for someone aiming to reach 100 is, indeed, not to die. Ultimately this pigeon holes players into playing one out of a tiny number of very safe but incredibly boring builds. GGG is basically encouraging players aiming to reach 100 to suck the fun out of the game by selecting a build that has no risk of death (and hence, no excitement, no tense moments, no room for skill/twitch based gameplay). The only real challenge is overcoming the boredom and monotony to grind to 100 in a sleepfest build. I can't see this as being good for the game, and the fact that after a couple years we still have under 500 level 100's on standard (along with Chris's recent statement that map changes only target 10% of the player base) suggests there's a problem with retaining/engaging the player base in prolonged leveling.

I'm not sure what the best solution is, or if changes to the death penalty would even improve engagement of the non-upper echelon. But improvements to build diversity and willingness to attempt challenging content could definitely be made for the 10% by adjusting how the death penalty scales. GGG could cap the XP penalty to what a player would lose at a particular level (i.e. instead of keeping it at 10% of 99, it would cap at 10% of 90, or 85, or whatever level GGG feels is sufficiently punishing without negatively impacting behavior and design). Even so, deaths at 95-100 could still be too punishing because experience is harder to come by, due to the level difference penalty. One way around that is to cap/lower the level difference penalty and raise the XP requirements for each level (then if the XP penalty was capped to what a player would lose at a particular level, the progression lost would be more consistent).

Alternatively, GGG could look at penalties in addition to or in lieu of XP loss (such as a stacking IIR/IIQ penalty affecting the zone itself, so you can't simply wait it out). One of the issues I have with the current death penalty is that there's effectively no added penalty for players who aren't trying to level. It gives a free pass to IIR/IIQ farmers, speed runners, characters who are already level 100 who go yolo farm mode, and bots (which die a lot).

XP penalty should be removed, want to play seriously - play alt+f4 core, no point in punishing scrubcore casuals.
At bare minimum XP penatly should be removed from standart league since there is no competioion element at all.

Lost good friend cause of this (when desync was an issue), told him they fixed it, he replied - too late lost intereset already. So yeah, if GGG think XP penalty helps - its not.

I've never seen an argument for the current death penalty being "fine". It's always just an assertion.