Evasion melee vs act 4 mobs in maps

While at first playthrough one might feel as if Evasion is in a bad place BUT you can have these issues even on a max Block build which i did in Beta! What i have been finding recently is with the Warcrys not working with CODT anymore.... they have actually opened up TONS of other options for CODT that was never even considered before! And as far as evasion goes somthing like CODT+Temp Chains+AB+GMP and then run Abbysal Cry and evasion character can effectively stop enemies from even touching you at all!

Blink Arrow is also your friend! But i would suggest you go test out some of the countless combos available now on your CODT setup! CODT is STILL going to be the go to defense for everyone its just now everyone will not be running the exact same setup any longer but there are certainly ways to deal with any of these issues with the right setup! And dont be afriad to run multiple CODT setups either one low lvl and one high lvl! If you would like to know more feel free to ask me in game!

Evasion is exactly just that... is all about evadeing incoming damage and you cant just rely on the numbers you also have to participate! Meaning you NEED 30% MS boots with ANYTHING else you can get.. Assasins Garb chest.. Phase run... Speaking of killer CODT setups have you even tried running CODT+Phase Run+Inc Duration? If you run a build with blood rage or that stacks frenzy charges and aquire them easily then this is a MUST have setup on any Frenzy charge build! But Evasion is a spec you have to move fast and always be moving so you dont even get hit! Your evasion and dodge stat are just there t protect you for what damage does make it to you!

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Caustic2 wrote:

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Ceryneian wrote:

Top HC guys were all using armor or MoM. Iron Reflexes etc. Every race season was the same result with HC ladder filled with Marauders and Templars.

There is nothing like this for evasion - there is no mechanic or concept in the game that adds a flat % to your evasion chance, like Fortify or ECs do for armor mitigation %.

These are fairly wrong.

Everybody was using MoM and evasion, as they required incredibly little passive investment to make work, allowing you to focus on damage and hp. Armor, on the other hand, requires loads of passive investment to get a respectable amount. As such, this was reflected in the meta where everybody was MoM+flameblast/incinerate/arc or acro+tornadoshot/kb.

Dodge is flat evasion.

Also, there is a fuckton more life over on the left side of the tree, so it's not a huge surprise to see people gravitating over there now. Armor happens to be the the most prominent secondary source of defense on that side.

No bro, that's wrong. Marauders and Templars filled the HC ladders every season and were definitely not using evasion.

I can try and pull up the stats for the most popular keystones for each season and you will see that no one was using evasion.

Heck even look at the current main Hardcore ladder - the first 3 pages only have 3 Rangers.

You trying to tell me that all the Marauders, Witches, and Templars I see on these pages are using evasion?

BTW - Dodge is not flat evasion. It is a separate mechanic from evasion. It does NOT stack with evasion.

If you are trying to argue that it acts as pseudo-evasion - do the math at various ev %s and you will see that it is NOT stacking.

Who cares what such and such is doing and just because they are on the ladder does not mean thier setup is perfect... atleast not for you anyway! Ive found since i stopped looking at others setups and trying to use those and i started finding my own things to use that ive been much more successful! Just because one thing works for one person does not mean it going to work for you as well! Find whats most effective for your setup and personal playstyle! You might find you know more about what your looking for than the ladder guys do! I would much rather complete the content my way with something i found to work for me than something everyone else is running! Theres ALOT more ways to work out defenses now you just have to try new things! \m/

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Peterlerock wrote:

I love how a couple months ago "armor was dead", now "evasion is dead", and ES probably as well. All dead now?

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People are starting to realize it now, but Fortify, AA, ECs, Lightning Coil etc. are NOT meant for pure evasion characters - they are meant for armor builds.

You can use this stuff for any type of defense, since they provide a flat reduction of damage.
So why is it "meant" for armor?

Mainly because when going evasion one tends to pickup Acro/Phase. Which means losing out on significant chuck of armor effectiveness, which can negate the worth of bothering with armor at all.

lol @ your first point though, completely right. People whined about armor being crap, and then evasion, and probably have or soon will whine about ES being dead (I recall it being said about Malachai fight bad for CI/ES char lol).

Since my char is on left side of tree, I plan on picking up some End charges and just rolling with them for defense in addition to my AA and Enfeeble/dual CoH setup. Wish I had a Coil but you know how expensive that thing's gonna be in HC.

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Peripherally wrote:

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Peterlerock wrote:

I love how a couple months ago "armor was dead", now "evasion is dead", and ES probably as well. All dead now?

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People are starting to realize it now, but Fortify, AA, ECs, Lightning Coil etc. are NOT meant for pure evasion characters - they are meant for armor builds.

You can use this stuff for any type of defense, since they provide a flat reduction of damage.
So why is it "meant" for armor?

Mainly because when going evasion one tends to pickup Acro/Phase. Which means losing out on significant chuck of armor effectiveness, which can negate the worth of bothering with armor at all.

lol @ your first point though, completely right. People whined about armor being crap, and then evasion, and probably have or soon will whine about ES being dead (I recall it being said about Malachai fight bad for CI/ES char lol).

Since my char is on left side of tree, I plan on picking up some End charges and just rolling with them for defense in addition to my AA and Enfeeble/dual CoH setup. Wish I had a Coil but you know how expensive that thing's gonna be in HC.

Armor absolutely was crap given the alternatives in 1.3 and before. The new patch they buffed it while nerfing those alternatives into the fucking ground. I don't understand why you guys keep speaking like everything is in a vacuum where things don't change.

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Demonoz wrote:

Who cares what such and such is doing and just because they are on the ladder does not mean thier setup is perfect... atleast not for you anyway! Ive found since i stopped looking at others setups and trying to use those and i started finding my own things to use that ive been much more successful! Just because one thing works for one person does not mean it going to work for you as well! Find whats most effective for your setup and personal playstyle! You might find you know more about what your looking for than the ladder guys do! I would much rather complete the content my way with something i found to work for me than something everyone else is running! Theres ALOT more ways to work out defenses now you just have to try new things! \m/

Oh really? Please post what all these new "ALOT more ways to work out defenses now" are.

I am curious because last I checked GGG has only introduced Fortify. While nerfing Ondars, CWDT, and IC.

Are you guys using stuff like

Cwdt - temp chain - arctic breath - phase run

etc?

Peace,

-Boem-

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Boem wrote:

Are you guys using stuff like

Cwdt - temp chain - arctic breath - phase run

etc?

Peace,

-Boem-

None of that works if you instantly die which happens alot to melee evasion characters currently. Evasion used to be HC viable; recent changes means it us worthless in HC now

We're still barely past the first week, hopefully all of the feedback is making them think a bit about the excesses. It's a pity though as I bet many new players have already quit due to the increased difficulty of act 4 (I remember when I was a newbie and I'd have been horrified by the difficulty jump!)

Intelligence casters are still viable.

If you actually think of the defenses like CI and Acrobatics as actually being glass cannon trade-off styles, then the defenses start to make sense in 2.0.

ES+life is actually very very strong now because it's easier to stack more total hp than CI with mediocre to decent gear. 4k/4k is fairly easy to achieve by level 80. With good gearing you can push that higher.

As a defense, it looks more cost-effective than CI, to the point that I think CI should have a 20-25% more ES instead of the 15% that it gets now.

Combined with Alchemist nodes and the EV/ES (templar) or AR/ES (shadow), you can layer other defenses over that large hp pool using granites or jades and still life flask.

Evasion would be stronger if the entropy for critical strikes reset to zero instead of some random number, effectively meaning that stacking enough evasion makes you briefly immune to crits in a "first pass" scenario with Deadly mobs and so on.

AA could be retooled to always give you the buff while moving, since green has few methods of flat mitigation available to it.