The -15% exp penalty is obnoxiously bad outdated design.

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deteego wrote:

Making things for difficulties sake = stupid

Making things difficult so they provide depth and challenging enough (so they are rewarding) but not so challenging as to be kicked in the balls = good game design

PoE does have a lot of the latter, but the exp death is the former. Because of the stupid design, it only makes the game challenging if you don't do the OP builds that are famously shown on streams.

I agree with the above.

Death penalties like this do NOT make the game any harder. They just make progress slower.

IMO, no game needs, or is improved by, a death penalty. I HATE dying as it is. HATE HATE HATE it. Even on normal. I don't need a further incentive not to die. Instead, I will just play more cautiously, more slowly, and the game is more boring for it.

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iamstryker wrote:

If the people in this thread were correct about what they are saying then Dark Souls would have been a major failure. It definitely only catered to a hardcore audience.

And this next game they're making in the series? They have been quoted as trying to make it more 'accessible'. Which means they want MORE people to PLAY THEIR game series, Dark Souls.

Which means trying to get the less 'Hardcore' into it. You're argument fails because you have not actually done any research into Dark Souls 2.

The Hardcore set are a minority. You cannot make money off them for too long. Now FROM Software makes console/box games, not free to play ones. GGG is a free to play company, so they likely have budgeted that into their dev cycle. However, not wanting to expand their potential market is financial suicide. I don't want GGG shut down because they've decided to cater to a 1% of the actual market of people who actually play ARPGs.

Do you guys really want players to leave PoE for Diablo 3 because it doesn't go out of it's way to piss the players off?

This penalty is a 'Eff YOU!' to anyone who might want to go past Normal.

Actually, this penalty is for zerg rushers.

Also for people to realize that MAYBE, they should rethink what they're doing. Either your build/gear/playstyle is wrong.

Figure out which one it is, and fix it.

DO IT NOW

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Nagisawa wrote:

Which means trying to get the less 'Hardcore' into it. You're argument fails because you have not actually done any research into Dark Souls 2.

My quote honestly has nothing to do with Dark Souls 2. I was talking specifically about Dark Souls 1.

Anyhow. I hate to bring up D3 but I think I need to. It tried to appeal to the most possible and that really didn't pan out for them.

The game should be changed based on the purpose of the change. Death penalties kind of suck but they are there for very good reasons. Honestly I don't find them that bad. Even when your around levels 60-70 if you die you can regain that exp pretty fast. So whats the problem? Are people dieing repeatedly and then getting mad about the death penalty??

If your build isn't ready for where you at then stop playing there.....

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SL4Y3R wrote:

Actually, this penalty is for zerg rushers.

Also for people to realize that MAYBE, they should rethink what they're doing. Either your build/gear/playstyle is wrong.

Figure out which one it is, and fix it.

DO IT NOW

You are wrong.

I'm pretty sure lvl70+ would know pretty well limitation of a build. You are bound to have 90+ passive points at your disposal. There was plenty of time to test and re-check validity of your choices. It is not like every Joe and Betty from a neighborhood get to 70+ range.

It can be gear but that is down to RNG. You might have luck or be out of it. You can resort to farming "safer" areas or park your character at current level without trying to level up more.

Playstyle, very subjective area. It is probably true that solo play might be more dangerous than partying.

Now, I'm not afraid to say that I do not suffer from any of the three factors you named to any significant extent. Yet I die once or twice over the very long time that is needed to level up past lvl75--due to huge exp reduction in static areas and limited access to maps.

I have died to Kole desync yesterday. I have killed him 6 times during my session but the 7th time did not work. Usual stuff, separate the crowd around him and kill them first. Lay traps and dot Kole from far away, slowly whittle away his health, loot his belongings. Unfortunately, Kole desynced at 40% HP, blinked to me and 1-shot me by his point-blank AOE. No sane gear could save ranged character from dieing to it. I could not play better because I did all I need to. My build had no impact on the death.

The result was loss of 15% experience, which was more than I got in the last nearly 2 hours that my session lasted.

Edit:
I believe that experience penalty is issue only at level 70+ and current state of game. Static areas where you can grind experience are limited and very ineffective--either by map lay out or simply by map level range where experience penalty heavily reduce any gains.
End-game system is working but the randomness do not allow reliable grind in maps.

Once the game has a content appropriate for 70+ characters, the issues will be diminished. I agree that it might just move to lvl8+ range though.

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Nagisawa wrote:

Do you guys really want players to leave PoE for Diablo 3 because it doesn't go out of it's way to piss the players off?

Honestly if people want to leave because they want no death penalty whatsoever then ya they should probably leave.

No death penalties makes the game feel really dumb, and the problem is that changing it affects EVERYONE. If GGG wants to segregate people to a league with no death penalty then that is there call. If they can get enough players interested then maybe they will do it. However Default really does need some form of death penalty that makes sense.

"

SL4Y3R wrote:

Actually, this penalty is for zerg rushers.

Also for people to realize that MAYBE, they should rethink what they're doing. Either your build/gear/playstyle is wrong.

Figure out which one it is, and fix it.

DO IT NOW

Playstyle is wrong? You sir fail to realize that health of ARPGS is in build diversity, restricting build diversity is always a no-no. Having fotm builds is one thing, telling people "your playstyle is wrong so you must die and be penalized for it" is backwards. Anyone can play the fotm builds and succeed. Why do you think the cost of certain gems are ridiculously high?

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iamstryker wrote:

Honestly if people want to leave because they want no death penalty whatsoever then ya they should probably leave.

No death penalties makes the game feel really dumb, and the problem is that changing it affects EVERYONE. If GGG wants to segregate people to a league with no death penalty then that is there call. If they can get enough players interested then maybe they will do it. However Default really does need some form of death penalty that makes sense.

bla blub blob

....see, I can make a post of same quality just shorter :D

"

Antigegner wrote:

"

iamstryker wrote:

Honestly if people want to leave because they want no death penalty whatsoever then ya they should probably leave.

No death penalties makes the game feel really dumb, and the problem is that changing it affects EVERYONE. If GGG wants to segregate people to a league with no death penalty then that is there call. If they can get enough players interested then maybe they will do it. However Default really does need some form of death penalty that makes sense.

bla blub blob

....see, I can make a post of same quality just shorter :D

If you want to argue that my point has no quality then do so. I give everyone the respect of telling them why I disagree. Just because you don't agree with me is no reason to respond like that.

Something else that I just thought of.....

Without the death penalty I would immediately deck out my summoenr in full magic find gear and NEVER take it off. I would then run maps and reap the rewards. I would get a ton of loot and I would STILL level up just as fast. THAT is a big problem with what you guys are proposing. It just hurts the game in the long run.

Build diversity is important but I don't see how you can argue cutting out the death penalty. Maybe argue that the game difficulty itself should be adjusted but don't take out death penalties.

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Nagisawa wrote:

"

iamstryker wrote:

If the people in this thread were correct about what they are saying then Dark Souls would have been a major failure. It definitely only catered to a hardcore audience.

And this next game they're making in the series? They have been quoted as trying to make it more 'accessible'. Which means they want MORE people to PLAY THEIR game series, Dark Souls.

Which means trying to get the less 'Hardcore' into it. You're argument fails because you have not actually done any research into Dark Souls 2.

Dark Souls was intentionally made for the Hardcore crowd, much like PoE is. Dark Souls 2 however is going mainstream, which is what a lot of people are against with regards to PoE.