[1.2.3] Sid's Ball Lightning - EB/Crit /2 Curse on hit/ 4 Auras with Herald of Ice

Hi

Note: this is a shadow tree, but it is just because i had only shadow to salvage. Witch build starts with Spell Damage nodes and then is identical to this build. Spell nodes are better than elemental when one uses Added Chaos gem that is a spell but not an element.

This is my second attempt at Ball Lightning build. Build is designed and created in standard league but in current 3m leagues there is nothing that invalidates it so it is league-agnostic.

I consider this build 'cheap' compared to some other BL builds floating around here. It uses some uniques but in fact nothing is REALLY necessary.

POE changes between 1.1.5 -> 1.2 that heavily impacted me:

Curse Changes. Crit weakness providing power charges mainly. This change invalidates PCoC and allows usage of Power Charges without Volls/PCoC/other stuff. Assasins Mark is now a mandatory curse for any crit build. Life/Mana on kill isnt bad.

Dual Curse It is cheap now. Get it. 3 passives for second curse? A STEAL.

New Tree. Dexterity and Strenght is more difficult to get by cheaply. Be prepared to 'waste' some points on it. Crit nodes are streamlined so they are cheaper to get. What got worse is the 'travel cost'. Witch area is costly to cross, no matter what path is chosen. New decision point: take/not take the 'lightning cluster'. For now i decided against it.

Mana changes. I cannot replicate math but ofc mana costs went down but somehow my mana base grew from 3300 to 4200.. and i havent changed gear. If respecing into this build - do it very carefully as the mana values/thresholds you are used to - changed. Btw i can perfectly well run this build WITHOUT clarity now..

"
The Build Principle


There are many ways of scaling BL but the wisest choice is to use all of these if possible starting from these with highest returns. BL can be scaled with:

- zap damage (includes crit and penetration + added damage)
- number of zaps per mob
- number of mobs zapped per ball
- number of balls per time unit

for a total clear speed one should scale BL with 2) 3) 1) and finally 4). In this order. Most people start with 4) and then complain that this skill sucks.

"
Tree

Lvl86


Discussion:

I decided to go auras. Discipline, Purity of Lightning, Clarity are pretty much a given. I decided to add Herald of Ice (strongly and I mean STRONGLY buffed in 1.2.3). It works great with Glacial Hammer ofc, but it also works nicely with crit spells. Going 4 auras required investment into aura nodes.

I did not want to go echo/faster casting/cast speed first and decided to avoid most cast speed nodes. These are up to anybody discretion but from my experience this is the least effective way of increasing damage output (not paper dps - this cast speed increases phenomenally).

Rest is pretty much standard stuff - 3600 life, 4200 mana. Standard life nodes and damage nodes.

Atziri flask is MANDATORY for reflect maps. Flask nodes make Atziri' Flask really really godsend for reflect/tough situations.

"
The Gear


Spoiler


Catalyst currently is empty and i have no idea what to put there..
Two jewelry pieces wait for Catarina or Elron to craft something nice on them



Gear is not great and the most important part is the Belt with Lightning Leech.

"
The Gems


Ball lightning:

Knockback (q)
AOE (q)
Lightning Penetration
Added Lightning (q)
[Faster Casting] / [Added Chaos] (Added Chaos is worse than Lightning due to little 'spell damage' scaling available)
[[Echo]] (for the lucky 6L Pledge of hands owners


Vaal Storm Call:
Echo

Arc Totem:(optional)
Spell Totem
Faster Casting
Added Lightning (q) / Lightning Penetration (depends on chance to shock from the tree)
Elemental Proliferation from Catalyst

Auras:
Purity of Lightning + Discipline + Herald of Ice + Reduced mana (in Goefrey's Crest for +1 bonus)

Clarity (no reduced mana! - i have no links for it and frankly it is not needed)


Curses:

Curse on Hit
Ball Lightning
Conductivity
Assassin Mark
(Warlords Mark for TOUGH maps)

Cast when Damage Taken (lvl 1)
Conductivity
Enduring Cry
Immortal Call

Arctic Armor


"

Curse on Hit explanation)


For people that do not like to manually cast curses (due to tedium or simply mana cost) there is an option of Curse on Hit now. We will ignore 'increased effectiveness of curses' bonuse from the gem and treat it only as a convenience method. Still - bonus is there.

There are two options available for this build:

Ball lightning + CoH + curses

Pros: works perfectly with ball lightning, can pre-shock enemies if you crit
Cons: small coverage without huge aoe investment, ball takes some time to reach the target

Ice nova (quality!!) + CoH + curses


Pros: freezes are very nice, survivability increase
Cons: more suited for close range engagements. BL plus knockback produces little of such. Close quarters application method means a bit more risk involved

Currently i run CoH setup and there is high chance it is the final setup I'll use. Its main selling point is that it means there are ALWAYS both curses applied for one click.


"
Gameplay


This char is extremely safe. Combination of Knockback and BL makes one almost untouchable to melee - including bosses. Bosses like Oak or Vagan Master are slapped around and do not pose any threat.

Depending on mobs - curse with Assassin Mark only or both curses, spam FEW balls (up to lvl 72 mobs need 1-2 balls MAXIMUM) and move on. Clear speed initially is a linear function of player casting too many balls at dead targets. This is difficult habbit/vice to cure.

Desync. This is medium-class desync build. Be prepared to /oos when fighting a tough mob, esp one with 'proximity shield'. These are the most annoying mobs.

Corrupting blood. 'removes bleeding' flask is MANDATORY.

"
Videos


lvl70 map with irrelevant mods (was testing something not-build related)
Herald of Ice in action.
http://youtu.be/Oy6VMauUJG8

and another take with newer gear etc:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DAEY4VQ1sw

"

Future




I wanted to revive this build for 1.2 with Pledge but decided to first try it with 'old' setup and then move to much more difficult staff build.





Original post, only for archive purposes.
Spoiler
"
Note: got this build to lvl 85 and moved on. It was THE SAFEST and most cruisy experience out of all my poe chars. The only danger to this build is flicker strike and similar instant teleports. All other stuff dies quickly and/or is knocked back into oblivion. Bosses? Some take some more time due to their sick resists (piety..) but anything that can be knocked back and/or deal one-dimensional damage (just lightning - piety etc) is not a problem when prepared.

I still have fun watching people try to make this skill work using old tricks - some never learn.



Hi

This is another take at the new gem - Ball Lightning



This spell is very different compared to all (maybe except Firestorm) spells released up to date. It deals damage over time but in ticks and these ticks happen in a moving area. This knowledge is the key to successfully scaling it.

"

The Spell

Ball lightning main properties:
- 20 mana initial cost (my current cost in 5 link at gem lvl 18 == 103 mana)
- basic, unaltered damage is in the mid range. Cant compete with 'impact' spells like Fireball or (currently bit OP) Arc
- hits single targets not more than each 200ms and only in range
- no target/hit limit. it is limited only by 'being in the area'
- (almost) universally proclaimed to be 'crap'


"
My take on scaling it

Key to this skill is AOE. AOE acts as very effective multiplier of number of 'hits'. From unscientific observations unaltered Ball Lightning hits target 2-3 times depending on target size/position/targeting. It isnt that many times. Slapping it on a 'caster' build shall result in VERY mediocre performance. As doing 'error no1' - adding cast speed - only makes people cast more duds.

Standard ball hits lets say 3 times if aimed precisely at the target. Not a lot of times..

You can scale number of hits with:
Knockback (chance based but can knock people away from the ball)
Slower projectules (flat)
+AOE (flat)
Chance to flee (chance based. Least desirable due to rares being immune to fear)

Or any combination of these above.

My current setup hits a target ~8 times or if im lucky (chain knockback) up to ten times.

Increased Area of Effect is the key because it allows ball to hit much more targets (scaling 1) and more times (scaling 2). Non augmented Ball Lightning hardly is an AOE skill. Increasing AOE by 100% means 100% more hits on average if targeted right on the mob. But this also means that many more mobs are hit by the same ball. AOE increases alone have exponential 'real' dmg scaling effect.

Out of remaining 3 'multipliers' Knockback i think is the best:
- immense defensive quantities (some mobs wont do anything if they cannot get close enough to the player)
- at around ~50% chance it seriously increases number of hits
Cons: vs totem bosses or very slow bosses it is kinda hilarious. Some also noted that there is (unconfirmed urban story) risk of loot going into the wall. Desync reported by some does not affect me with this build (but affects me when playing other builds so Im not immune to it)

Slower projectiles are good too as this gem:
- provides flat bonus (not chance based)
- does not infuriate party members
- does not knockback mobs out of the way

Chance to flee is good at the beginning but sadly its very random nature and rares ignoring it makes it the least effective support.


Ofc the 'hit/zap' is important. It can be scaled with spell damage and/or crit. Both ways are OK, however because Im on a budget Ive selected non-crit way. Way of scaling this 'zap' is also elemental penetration and shocks. More on that later.


"
So the gem setup

(quality denotes gems that benefit greatly from quality in this build)
this is the bare minimum for a 5Link. For 6th and 7th link


Why no 4Link? Because while one can level with this skill from 31 (i did it from ~40 - not earlier because this was the leftower race character) and be moderately successful the AOE passives one needs to get are simply impossible to get before ~50-60. When 5Link is very likely to be already available. If someone absolutely needs to go 4Link id experiment with droping Knocback or Penetration. However act3merc+ Penetration is mandatory so added lightning has to go. However i do not recommend playing this with 4Link.

Why no 'added chaos'? Because of shock stacking and also because added lightning helps to 'smooth out' lightning hit damage around the mid value. All lightning spells have a very high variance and it is unsatisfying when your arc hits 7 times for 200 damage (selected from 180-3000 range). Also - this build scales lightning not chaos so..



"
The tree



Bandits: Life/passive/End charge (can as well be passive)

This is shadow tree (i salvaged one of my old race chars) but it is clearly visible that while shadow starting nodes are great witch start saves you one point. Start as a witch. Templar is also a possibility and provides very easy early game (and good quest rewards).

Priority:
- Life
- AOE nodes
- Static Blows
- AOE nodes
- Eldrich Battery
- Aura effect nodes allowing to get at least another one +1 to lightning resist
- Elemental Adaptation

Avoid +8% lightning nodes (like Lightning Walker or that lightning cluster above witch) as there are readily available +10% elemental nodes that are bang-per-point better. These CAN be best choices but count % carefully and consider alternatives before committing.

One can go for 4th aura (Haste or Tempest Shield) and grab more aura cost reduction nodes but I'm still not decided if it is worth it. There is also an issue of spare sockets for that 4th aura as it requires 2links minimum

This is NOT a MoM character. It is possible to do so but at a cost of 20% AOE. For tough fights however it is very easy to replace Carcass with Cloak of Defiance (assuming one has spare resist). I have 850 unreserved mana - this is enough to run MoM. Basic setup is non-MoM though.

No regen maps - no go.
Half regen maps - not fun, but doable - bring mana flask.



"
The Gear

Disclaimer: this is gear scrapped from bottom of my stash. One can get a much better one (esp spell dmg on shield and cast speed/spell dmg on jewelry).

Spoiler

Do not mind the gems - most are already outdated.





possible ideas:

AA REALLY benefits from levels. as non-MoM char one can easily afford lvl22+ AA


used for leveling (healing). it cuts the DPS if not block-focused.


Culling strike has a mechanic that the faster/smaller hits the closer it is to flat ~10% MORE multiplier. also other stats are nice


Used till 75 now and then. +AOE is great. Life on kill is GREAT for sustain. Great weapon if Catalyst is unavailable.

If all other pieces are stellar one can also fiddle with Romira's Banquet for free PC generation (and bit more crits). But this is a melee ring so better not.

Avoid: projectile speed on wand!


"
Gameplay and gems

Curse First
Shock Second
Kill

Curse - Conductivity. Quality highly recommended.
Conductivity + Faster Casting + AOE (covers entire screen)

Auras - Discipline/Clarity/Purity of Lightning. Pretty much obvious.
With Aura passives (or Alphas) possible 4th selections: Tempest Shield or Haste for that sweet faster casting/movement speed
Discipline + Clarity + Purity of Lightning + reduced mana

Shocking - Arc. Typical 'shock-totem' for that free 90% More damage. I also can kill something from time to time but do not count on that.
Spell Totem + Arc (quality) + Ele Prolif (+ Faster Casting).

Special move - Vaal Storm Call. Skill many people ignore and dont even know it exists. Very solid damage. Very low soul count compared to other vaal skills of similar performance.
V.Storm Call + Conc Effect + Echo/Lightning Pen.

Alternatively (and using it now): Storm Call for single target. My tree fits PERFECTLY to support Storm Call and with Echo it is simply amazing (i wonder if ggg shall nerf this interaction or not..)


CWDT setup Edited after too many close calls with on death spikes from Porcupine runners. Standard stuff:
CWDT + Conductivity + Enduring Cry + Immortal Call


"
Non Measurable Benefits and playstyle tips

This is a very safe build. I have 3200 HP and dying with that is difficult. 24% block. No armor (787 currently) little evasion (1305). Safety comes from two sources:
- knockback. This practically makes one immune to melee damage as mobs are hit back each time they try to do a swing.
- leech. 2% leech my atziri (absolutely not BiS uniques! not at all.. :/) items provide is enough. it is also enough to do reflect maps without Topaz flask. For tight spots (like double reflect) pop atziri flask for that extra non-reflectable damage and extra leech (another not-BiS atziri item! go great design!)

Shock Stacks. One CAN go without ARC totem. i have checked corpses several times after encounters - and mobs ARE getting shocked by Ball Lightning alone. But why take chances. Also ARC is good as a warning so cast it ahead of you.

And the last one. Ball Lightning is a 'movement' skill. You release one, run, release another one, run, run. Consider this an indestructible totem that moves. While BL does its damage you can curse, set Arc Totem, unleash Storm Call. This is VERY mobile gameplay. Take advantage of it.


"
Videos
I'm not great with videos - tried to make several but for unknown reasons 1080 and 720 versions i did got all converted by YT to potato-quality 420 that are hard to watch. The only one viewable I've made was a test run of 71 'curse immune' map with bit worse gems and few levels less (75 or 76 i think). That was still a new playstyle for me and several bloopers are clearly visible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72AtCccntYI

My biggest playstyle change since that video - do not cast TOO MANY balls. most of my engagements end up with 2-3 balls released when everything is already dead. This really helps with clear speed.


Have fun and enjoy this gem. It is really very very fun to play with. But beware of it scaling and behaving very different to all (almost) previous spell gems. Old tricks wont work.
Last edited by sidtherat on Sep 30, 2014, 3:04:10 PM
It's really too bad that chain and multiple projectiles don't really do anything for this spell. If chain made each of the shocks that came off the lightning ball bounce around, this might be the most fun spell ever.
"Can't talk now, bro, I'm three-totemin'!"
Nice guide !

I'm using a templar with Slow Proj instead of Knockback, at least for now until I can change my sockets, and a combinaison of uniques that allows me to double curse with Temporal Chains and Conductivity. Got a ton of mana that allows me to run with the three auras, and Arctic Armor for a bit of extra phys and fire res.

I don't use Lightning Pen for now, just arrived Act III Merciless and it is still not needed, my clearing speed is great, and I don't had any trouble with bosses so far. Maybe Cage/Brutus is a bit long to kill, but the Arc Totem is helping a lot. I can't wait to get some quality on my gems man, only got 5% on added lightning damage. I should go for quality Conductivity but it's already level 16, maybe I can wait for level 20.

Also, instead of Vaal Storm Call I'm using Vaal Arc and Vaal Ice Nova combined with Life Leech for added freeze and shock.

It's really fun, level 66 and going up :)

My tree is pretty similar to yours, that quite reassuring ^^
Thanks for all the tips, and good luck, we'll see how it works endgame !
https://www.youtube.com/user/PeipeMasta
OP, no offense but while i think you have a good idea of what to support ball lightning with, you also are completely missing an opportunity: spell echo. It has been confirmed that when you use spell echo the 2nd ball lightning casted is treated as though it was casted from a 2nd person. That is to say that ball can hit the same target as the first ball in between that 200ms timer. If you really think about it, with increased AoE and slower projectile this almost doubles your damage because you have 2 balls hitting the target 8-10 times each at the same time rather than just one.
"
draakisback wrote:
OP, no offense but while i think you have a good idea of what to support ball lightning with, you also are completely missing an opportunity: spell echo. It has been confirmed that when you use spell echo the 2nd ball lightning casted is treated as though it was casted from a 2nd person. That is to say that ball can hit the same target as the first ball in between that 200ms timer. If you really think about it, with increased AoE and slower projectile this almost doubles your damage because you have 2 balls hitting the target 8-10 times each at the same time rather than just one.


tried it few times. im saving to get Pledge of Hands. in current setup replacing lightning pen makes fighting rare mobs PITA, replacing added lightning also cuts down 'real' effectiveness

and finally - i absolutely hate that immobility period spell echo forces on me.

but - i shall try it again anyway, have leveled spell echo somewhere

slower projectiles has another issue - dex requirements. im really 2 points above my dex requirements and without great pieces with dex on it there is little hope for more. witch area has notoriously bad dex supply
Last edited by sidtherat on Jul 15, 2014, 2:18:09 PM
tried spell echo - replacing added lightning (non quality). replacing lightning pen is out of the question. just dont.

and clear speed is.. exactly the same. tried it on a low lvl map and a mid lvl map and i cannot see the difference

what goes for echo:
- easier shock stacks (but shorter)
- a bit better single target performance
- better knockback interaction. way better

what goes against it:
- immobility (it gets on my nerves as i already play this char 'cast/run/cast/run/lightning warp/cast' etc. this is the main reason i find this build SO FUN to play
- overkill. that second ball for most white mobs is completely wasted and one CANNOT aim it. it goes the same way as the first one

i shall stick to my setup for now but shall periodically check echo while doing tough maps (+75% resist/no curse..). this is definitely a 6th link tho.

little update: there are only few sources of damage that are dangerous while playing with Knockback:
- porcupine mobs (These that send spikes on death)
- flicker strike mobs (esp black widow class of bosses)

all other mobs can and are pushed away - pretty often mid jump - and never deal any damage. i created a short video of me toying with fracture mod that also included two exiles - fighting them (and probably invasion bosses if/when added) is so easy with BL+Knockback
I understand the issue, the staff would do away with most of the immobility though, and the slower projectiles makes the distance traveled shorter than with out so it makes it easier for you to be hit. Personally, id just take all the AoE nodes on the tree and drop increased aoe in return for a item like a carcass jack or something. My current setup in the one month league uses spell echo, Q added lightning and lightning pen, at a certain point you dont notice the immobility of spell echo and it definitely makes up for it in damage if you have enough aoe and cast speed to put out balls quickly enough. im also saving for a pledge of hands my self, since it seems like it just is made for this skill.

Also it might be worth it to consider empower as a 5l because the levels on this gem really do make a huge difference.
Last edited by draakisback on Jul 15, 2014, 4:50:33 PM
after considerable testing the 5Link setup i use - for my build - is optimal

Slow Proj deal more damage but provide zero added defense. after playing a map when my cwdt triggered ZERO times one start to appreciate safety knockback+BL provide (ofc that was an extreme situation but it really works)

light pen is mandatory

i consider AOE mandatory too - and i use Carcass and most AOE passives. there is significant difference this gem provides that im not keen on not using

that leaves us with added lightning - and this might be the weakest gem. but spell echo is at most en par with it. and i do not have lvl3 empower (not mentioning lvl4..)

anyhow - shall try to buy that staff. it is going down in price already so there is hope
my witch at 70 in the 4 week sc league is doing quite well with these links, Spell Echo/Added lightning/Lightning penn/faster casting. Believe it or not faster casting is a decent combo with the SE because it allows the balls to simultaneously hit the target at the same time. And with a divinarious + carcass jack and all the AoE nodes i don't need added aoe. As is, the ball hits almost half the screen with its tendrils. What makes it extremely strong in maps is its ability to instantly shock stack entire packs of mobs with out having elemental prolif (this includes most bosses ive encountered.) due to the rapid fire nature of the ability and static blows. I considered picking up the 5% chance to shock from the shadow tree but its more than enough as is with just the static blows cluster. Also i cant stress enough how much cast speed helps with this skill, it seems useless at first because the balls cant simultaneously hit the same target with out spell echo but once you have spell echo the added cast speed makes the balls come out closer together than with out which lets you "shotgun" mobs with it. I was using slower projectiles but i really didnt feel safe with the shorter cast range and knock back while a good choice just didnt make enough of a difference compared to the set up i have. I could see its use in a HC situation but in SC it is unnecessary because the balls hit for 8-12 shots per target as it is right now. Just to note, my 6th link when I get it will be empower, Levels on this spell are too strong to ignore such an opportunity and if i can get a pledge of hands, ill drop spell echo and maybe add added aoe back in or try something else like added chaos for more impact damage. The obvious downside to Pledge of Hands is the lack of a shield slot but with all the aura nodes taken (aside from the ones on the bottom of the tree) I should be able to make up for the lack of shield with any number of the purity auras. As is I can already run 2 40%s, clarity and discipline (Of course spell echo helps quite a lot in that respect since the 2nd cast is free.)

I'm not saying the choices you are making in supports are wrong because they certainly make sense and work well. It seems there are certainly more than 1-2 viable ways to build this skill. Also just to note, Ive been leveling arc for an arc totem to add some damage in my build, a few times i decided to swap Ball lightning out and self cast arc with the proper support gems but it seems to taper off a lot more then Ball Lightning does at this level, i cant imagine how it will look in the even higher levels by comparison. I love how the general consensus is that ball lightning is bad but in reality its much stronger then the fotm spell atm.

Also another thing to consider. I found a thief's torment. The thing does wonders for survivability with ball lightning because of how fast you hit targets. At first i intended to get a cloak of defiance for MoM but because i wanted to use a carcass jack for the added AoE, that obviously wasnt possible. the thief's torment completely makes up for it and then some also making it possible to get rid of EB in favor for something else, though I like running a high level AA.

One more concept I thought about was using an incinerate/flame totem or maybe a nova totem to proc Elemental Equalibrium for more penn on targets though im not sure how effective that would be. Ill let you know if it bears any fruit.
Last edited by draakisback on Jul 16, 2014, 3:58:02 AM


but Thiefs Tormet gets mana/life just from 'attacks' not spells. or is there a new version?

as for the cast speed - i know about it. this is a linear multiplier to damage that is always good.

however i decided to first turn wet blanket into a solid hammer and only after that work on increasing frequency of hits.

previous attempts at BL were 'it is weak! lets cast MORE of it'. and while cast speed is a linear damage increase it is just linear. AOE/Slow Proj/Knockback is an exponential damage increase so i started there (much easier to reach 200% base damage with them than with cast speed)

im 82 now - in 4-5 levels before i shelve this char i can get ~20% cast speed from the tree (and hopefuly that staff..)

as for AOE - i have (iirc) 101% increased AOE atm. with Carcass Jack and witch and templar passives. and 19/20 AOE gem. i do not know what level your AOE gem is but this is an explosive synergy - it starts to really (and i mean really) multiply itself after certain +AOE% level and knockback% level.

best way to count how many times a mob is hit with your setup is to go merciless ledge and find that totem (normal, not kuduku). kill all mobs around and equip lvl1 BL gem (without added lightning) and experiment. 8 hits with your ~65% AOE and no SProjectiles/Knocback seems unrealistic to me. i manage to get 8 hits with knockback and 101% aoe and even then it is not guaranteed (mind that some 'zaps' hit the ground - it is just cosmetic gfx, not damage). btw - completely ignore paper dps. it means NOTHING for this skill whatsoever

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