Remove IR add new keystone, ideas welcome

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ScrotieMcB wrote:

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tmaciak wrote:

I trying to find such armor for half a year.

Just like with dating, the higher you set your standards, the more disappointment you'll find.

I mean, I'm just rerolling a Cleave Duelist and I self-found this one (then tossed some Scraps on it):

Not super amazing or anything, and definitely could use a higher-armour upgrade later, but it's not hard for me to imagine stuff like this dropping at higher levels.

My guess is that it's not that you haven't had decent full-armour gear drop for you, it's that you've had better full-evasion gear drop for you, which realistically would mean you're in the half of the population that happens to. Trade it off or just keep on farmin'.

1.
just like with dating...
Sorry man, I want to run maps lvl 74+. If you want to pwn mobs on Cruel witch mediocre gear or farm Lunaris 2-3 all day, then ok. But 95% of people want to get to end-game.

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I self-found this one...
Please imagine I found hundres of far worse armor from farming LT2-3 up to farming maps 70+ or 74+. RNG is RNG.

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in the half of population...
WRONG. It 1/3. You forget eva/armour. Also, there are es/eva, es/armour and pure es gear. It's not easy to find decent pure armour.

With IR you get 3x more chance to do it, because you can use eva, arm/eva and arm gear.

Also, remember you need 4-5 pieces of equipment. Go find 5 map-grade pieces of pure armor gear. I dare you. I double dare you.

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Scrotie, please download: http://webcdn.pathofexile.com/downloads/PathOfExileInstaller.msi
Because from each of your posts I ever read (and you have 16 post/day, which is astonishi, while I have 0.7 and its 90% '2GCP on that armor") it seems we're playing two different games and it's kinda stupid to discuss mechanics of two different games.

EDIT: Lol found a forum bug somehow since I can't copy paste my message trying it in spoiler tags.


Not quite sure what you are getting at, just noting that IF was missing from the formula?
There is also a global evasion rating unique? Dunno if it is more or adds to increased enfin with IF:

-------------------------------------------------------

Total Armour =

[ [ ARMOUR{500*(1+0.52+0.6+0.3+0.4)} +

ER{(530+Grace*IF)*(1+0.6+0.3+0.4)} ] ] *

(Determination*IF)

-------------------------------------------------------

Anyways that 1.18 * 1,18 is not completely true since the formula I propose separates AR and ER, but also because:

lvl 19 values:
Determination 50% more to 59% more.
Grace 1293 to ~1526.

G + D: ~1940 AR
Grace + determination + IF: ~2426 AR

1.18*1.18 ~ 1.39

1 + (2426-1940)/2426 = 1.2

1.2 != 1.39 (not equal)

The reason why is DETERMINATION * IF is calculated as follows:
Determination = 50% = 0.5
IF bonus: 18% = 0.18
Determination after IF bonus = 0.5*(1+ 0.18) = 0.59
Determination multiplier = 1 + 0.59 = 1.59 This values is taken into the armour formula.

The way I wrote it makes it look like it is 1.5*1.18 = 1.77 which is more than 1.59, but corresponds with your idea that it would be: 1.18 * 1.18.

Also innerforce lies to left side not right side and if you take into lets say 4k armour from gear:

1 + (6426-5940)/ 6426 = 1.08

So you can go down from your 39% to 8% the more your amour comes from other source beyond grace. Grace can also be taken by armour builds not just dex builds. In fact it easier to obtain evasion alongside armour than it is to obtain armour alongside evasion if not looking at gear (grace and blind biggest example).

Bug or feature? found if you do [ [ next to one another at start of sentence rest of your text is lost I will try to type [[ HA HA HA on the next line:

[

Just wanted to remind about taking IF into consideration. The final number of armour/eva is higher with it, so if someone takes a look at final numbers it would be closer to reality for any further discussion.

Iron Reflexes
Evading an attack grants 50% damage mitigation for two attacks rather than 100% damage avoidance for one attack.
Dexterity bonus no longer applies to evasion.
Evade is rolled before all other defenses. (Just in case it isn't already. This is very important as it's what keeps it in check, as well as makes it interesting when stacking it with block or dodge.)

Evade rolling first prevents you from blocking and dodging 99% of shit and then gettnig a chance to get the rest reduced by half.

It also means that it has some more ways to use it: Do you want overall damage mitigation, or do you want protection against oneshots at the expense of block. Too much evasion with reflexes, and it's going to eat into your block rate by giving you a whole slew of 50% hits, when you could be blocking most of them entirely. It provides safety against giant bursts, but lowers your theoretical overall survivability in exchange.

IMPORTANT NOTE: The second hit also counts as being rolled as an evade, so you don't have a chance to roll a double evade and cut the damage down to 25%, and you don't have a chance to block the second mitigated hit.

Once you evade, the two incoming attacks can have no other damage avoidance applied to it, only damage mitigation (armor, etc).

That would make IR good for 2H builds, while killing it for blocking and to a lesser extent dual wield builds.

EV is already calculated before all other damage mitigation effects.

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Autocthon wrote:

That would make IR good for 2H builds, while killing it for blocking and to a lesser extent dual wield builds.

Only if your evasion is too high.
Also, why is this a problem? You're aware that this node is right near a whole whack of bow stuff, right? Not everything has to be useful for everybody. You also ignored the whole thing where i noted an interesting interaction where you can trade off overall survivability for OHKO protection. Shields and DW offer benefits other than just block, and they can be worth it.

I'm just saying that the forum backlash would be ridiculous.

Personally I'd change IR to a stacking damage mitigation based on number of evaded in a row (before dodge or block). DR = to chance to be hit per evade. At the cost of your dex bonus to evade. This makes EV more capable for dealing with heavy hitters, protecting form OHKO without making IR the best way to get armour. Something along those lines anyway.

Edit: alternatively the DR is equalk to your average (listed) chance to evade and doesn't stack)

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I'm just saying that the forum backlash would be ridiculous.

This is never a valid excuse for anything ever.
Mitigating chance to hit per evade by your chance to be hit is absolutely nuts at high evade numbers. At 75% evasion it would be


0% 0% 0% 25%

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alternatively the DR is equalk to your average (listed) chance to evade and doesn't stack)

At 75% this still poses the 0% 0% 0% 25% situation seen above, and gets flat out ridiculous if you go even higher. ESPECIALLY since yours can be stacked with shields and dodge to no end.


EDIT: Updated

Iron Reflexes
Evading an attack grants 50% damage mitigation for two attacks rather than 100% damage avoidance for one attack.
Damage mitigations from evasion will stack multiplicatively with each other.
Entropy no longer applies to evade.

For a 50% dodge chance your DR would look like (assuming you just get your listed chance to be hit as DR and assuming you have 50% EV)

Dodged : 50% Damage : Dodged : 50% Damage : Dodged :50% Damage

Etc.

By making it listed chance as DR this means you'll be sacrificing a higher EV chance to get some reliable damage reduction. It could be scaled to your chance to be hit instead, or use a secondary scalar (50% of your chance to evade for instance). If the primary purpose is to avoid being one shot.

Your recommendation is basically the same thing you understand, because after 50% EV every other hit will be an evade so one of the following will happen.

You dodge, then you get hit for 50% damage then you dodge (refreshing the buff)
You dodge, then you get hit for 50% damage, then you get hit again for 50% damage, then you dodge again
You dodge, get hit, get hit, then roll a new EV and pray you aren't one shot
You dodge, then the game assumes your next incoming attack is dodged (gaining 50% reduced dmamage as the effect instead of 100%) which refreshes the buff. You now have permanent 50% damage reduction.

You're welcome to tell me which you intend it to be, but I don't see any other possible sequence of events for that. The only real difference is yours basically invalidates all other defensive mechanics except armour.

Edit: Basically no matter how you slice it you're giving the Ev character some amount of DR effectively permanent, and being basically useless for characters that don't have significant EV. The trick is finding the point where it makes most sense, perhaps it could instead be "Dexterity bonus no longer applies to EV, and instead provides an equal amount of armour to the evasion you would have gained" That gives EV characters an armour fallback that is effective against small to middling hits. They already have excellent mechanics to mitigate large hits.

I think you're misunderstanding. There is no dodging with mine. You can never mitigate 100% damage with evasion with my IR.

EDIT: A mod is missing in my IR, just a sec. There was a stat between dex and entropy

Attack 1: If evade, take 50% Damage, otherwise take 100% Damage
Attack 2: If attack 1 was evade, take 50% damage, otherwise reroll evade. If evade, take 50% damage otherwise take 100% damage.
Attack 3: If attack 2 was evade, take 50% damage, otherwise reroll evade. If evade, take 50% damage otherwise take 100% damage

etc.

Mine is the player taking 50% 50% 50% 50% damage. Yours has them taking 0% 50% 0% 50%.
Mine also removes entropy, because things get fucked up when counting two hits as two different evades, while halving their effect. Entropy staying in on it would actually nerf it into the ground.

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because after 50% EV every other hit will be an evade so one of the following will happen.

An example of how entropy would actually nerf this really hard: You'd get 50% 50% in a row, so your next hit would be a guaranteed 100% and then two more 50% 50%, every time.

50 50 100 50 50 100 (400 damage taken with IR)
vs
0 100 0 100 0 100 (300 damage taken without IR)

Fewer hits of spike damage, however. Entropy also fucks with shields a but too much. Removing it keeps you at