Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

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Drahken wrote:

horrible analogy.. why is this so confusing? turning FFA off doesn't grant you some instant benefit.. in fact it takes away all the chance you had prior of getting more then the measly amount of loot allotted to you.

cmon people this isn't rocket science.. you can't compare the benefit of not having to play HC, IN HC. to the choice between secure loot and FFA and possibly less or more loot..

one part of the analogy has no benefit to not do, where as FFA has a benefit. pull your heads out of the sand this is obnoxious.

The analogy was to show that if you can arbitrarily opt out of difficulty setting it’s useless.

What you don’t seem understand is that 'loot tension' only works as a game mechanic when its unavoidable. It’s more difficult and if you are a nice player who is really not out to take other peoples items it’s only a losing proposition... At least you can see that much.

Right?

So all I'm saying, is I loved the loot system in d2, but I have no use for a FFA setting in this game if a 'no tension' setting is available. Maybe fun from time to time for shits and giggles, but that’s it. So who are the devs catering to by adding options for FFA? I have talked to several long time FFA supporters already and its not any of them.

Once options go in FFA is dead, it’s already nearly useless in its present state with the long timers anyhow. So, I am suggesting that they kill it now and put in a real system that fixes more than one problem instead of half measures that just cost development time.

uh no one is argueing that opting out of a difficulty setting at no punishment makes it useless. FFA is a playstyle not a difficulty setting. as someone already pointed it out to you.. you have no problem playing it if theirs plenty of unwilling participants that you can ninja their loot.. but you dont want to play it if you know everyone in the party has the same intentions and you might not stand to purely profit from it?

its a risk/reward option. give it a rest.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

FFA loot is dead; please remove its rotting useless corpse.

I personally do not understand what is with the angry responses like the one above. I read a couple pages back something about loot tension doesn't work if its optional, which I somewhat agree with. However, what do you call the people who choose to play:

A. solo (no loot tension)
B. with close friends (set rules)
C. with friends you met in PoE. (sure, you can't exactly "trust" them, but they are typically less "ninja" than the pub groups are.)

A hypothetical question, if I may:

If full respec was ever added to the game, would you use it because it is available? How is it any different than cheat codes in a video game? The ones where you got infinite ammo or all guns unlocked, etc?

I would just advise you to do what I've done for all my years of gaming and just stick to playing the game in the way that is fun for you.

Worst case scenario: Get some friends for that loot tension feel.

908 pages.... oh damn!

I'm not gna get stuck into this discussion for the 12000th time but what i will keep saying is people need to stop saying the word "ninja".

I wish people would refer to and discuss the loot-allocation mechanic as it should be... ie, to help with lag, ranged-toons, ms-discrepancies. not a mechanic which makes and item 'someones'.
Its to help allow equal access to gather FFA drops.

Everything is anyones. Ignore the name on the drops!

Some people need to realise and accept that its OK for some games to have an aggressive loot system.
plenty of other options out there.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

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Drahken wrote:

uh no one is argueing that opting out of a difficulty setting at no punishment makes it useless. FFA is a playstyle not a difficulty setting. as someone already pointed it out to you.. you have no problem playing it if theirs plenty of unwilling participants that you can ninja their loot.. but you dont want to play it if you know everyone in the party has the same intentions and you might not stand to purely profit from it?

its a risk/reward option. give it a rest.

How can you not understand this? I'm using the most plain language possible, and yet you keep accusing me of ninjaing peoples loot. WHAT THE FUCK?

From what i've seen its all the same type of people with the same mentality that have ruined the loot system since day one. Loot timers where a result of these kinds of whiners.



One of the biggest reasons I even started to post in the thread was because of people like him.


To them, FFA loot systems caters to thieves/ninjas and to people who don't 'DO' anything.


Reality is, i spend the majoirty of my time in public games and rarely see this 'crap' people like him talk about. And the funny thing is they rarely play public games.



O well, now we wait for these stupid loot options to happen and see what kind of damage it really does to the game. GGG selling out doesn't sit well for me. Now im wondering what else GGG will ruin just because'.

Lesser dead penalty and free respecs please, people otherwise might leave this game GGG. Please listen!!!!

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

This is a critical point, and I am glad you can see it.

Of course I see it. I also see that the intention of this game was deliver a cutthroat feel as described by GGG themselves, but sadly I only see loot tension and cutthroat-ness as optional. I sort of have the view that 'loot tension' & 'cutthroat' seem contradictory. Loot tension exists for the added feel that you EARNED that loot, but all it feels to me is that I used whatever means necessary to obtain it faster than everyone else; ie. I feel like a genuine prick. Instead of working as team like I would prefer, I'm out there avoiding combat so I can go loot chests and what not as fast as possible. If someone wishes to stop me from taking something, they cannot kill/harm me and it would have to come down to party leader kicking me, which is why fucking NINJA=KICK groups exist. Some people also consider frost wall and such methods as cheating/being unfair because it's sort of the same as blocking loot with your player model.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

I play all of the above, and I do not need a setting other than ‘no tension’ for any of them. I guess I dont know what you mean by 'what would I call thoes people?' why would that matter?

I meant that those people can play by their own rules; ie. opt out of FFA or timer-based FFA. With the addition of choice between looting preferences, groups are able to be a bit more organized, for those that want it at least. Maybe now you'll start seeing pub games where people don't wander and collect loot all the time like me?

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

Besides, I only play HC and it is much safer to not worry about loot until after the fight, I will not take unnecessary risks.

One of the reasons why I think loot tension is pretty crappy. I prefer my difficulty in the game itself.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

I’m fine with the change, I’m ready for instanced loot, bring it on!

Apprently, not everyone is though... trying to understand.

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Ten_of_Swords wrote:

What you don’t seem understand is that 'loot tension' only works as a game mechanic when its unavoidable.

It never really worked because people didn't like it and GGG wasn't ok with that many people not liking it.

Also I still don't see why it can't work as a choice. It will work then the same as it works now. GGG is planning on at least 3 different setting. Do you really think that the setting closest to the one that we have currently won't be used by a lot of players??? The pure FFA one will be the least used but it will STILL be used and enjoyed by a portion of the playerbase. There is nothing wrong with that. There is no reason at all to only have one looting mode.

The biggest difference is FFA will then be completely devoid of the slow players who hated playing it. The players who lost the most loot in any given game. They now have somewhere else to go. I think there are some FFAers out there shedding a tear over the loot that they now cannot ninja from easy prey.

p.s. I only said some, I am not stereotyping people who like FFA.

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iamstryker wrote:

There is no reason at all to only have one looting mode.

Funny. The greatest ARPG of all time has ONE looting system. Wether you like the looting, its not hard to make a choice and stick with it.

Personally i think there is NO reason to have more than one looting mode. Its easy to tell everyone to 'shaaad up and deal with it'. I've been doing it ever since i started posting in this thread. :D


At this point I just hope its instanced loot. I no longer want to see what other people 'get'. Give me a bubble and let me stay there. As if i need to constantly see things i need drop without any chance of picking it up.


I had this happen last night while building a new character. Rare claws kept droping for everyone except the person who is actually using claws, which was me. Watching players come running across the screen to pick up stuff they don't even need, even tho i was camping the drop the moment it landed on the ground is not fair... At all.


Anyways, the biggest reason to have ONE loot mode is because its straight up lame as hell to have loot options. No one has ever, ever given a real reason why loot options is need. Just because somone doesn't like it is not a good enough reason to change and divide the game up.


Its funny because i could go on a rant about giving us more options in POE that span across every aspect of the game. Which would probably make me look like a total idiot to everyone including anti FFA loot players. Which is funny considering its the same freakin idea, mainly changing the game to suit my tastes.


Might as well just sell the game for 20 bucks to own and give players full access to modding. Why stop at looting? I want options that never, ever stop.