The real reason why end game is NOT fun and everyone is leaving
" Hire more. And more. And yes. I stick to what I said 100%. Why? Because this iteration of the "endgame" will last months, already 4 of them. If I were to go with your arguments, the game will not be finished ever. When you release stuff that lasts so long, then you make sure it's fine. placeholder for creative sig
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" If current "endgame" maps are really just a stop-gap, then what's the harm in making map drop rates less randomized so that players can actually maintain at higher level maps if they so chose? |
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" Probably no real harm in it, but if you've run out of maps, surely there must be some other interesting aspects of the game you can Beta test in the meantime? |
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" Hi Mike, first of all, thank you for providing a staff response to a new and short thread. it shows a strong degree of seriousness. a feeling our feedback as beta testers is worth something, which has been somewhat missing in the past few weeks. personally, I don't care the game is unfinished. I understand that completely. I don't expect to be able to go up the Sceptre Of God tower and fight Dominus, or be running "Uber Bosses" before the release of the game. the content as is, is quite enough for me for now. but what brought me to the brink of leaving this game again and again, is the lack of reward. the lingering feeling that no matter what you do, how long you play, how skilled you are, and where you are in the content - the quality of your gear, the skills you can use and their effectiveness, are all down to just dumb luck. and I don't have that luck. in an extreme case, as a matter of fact. running the same high-risk areas for hours and days on end, getting the lowest possible currency and loot barely worth to even vendor? that's wrong. it shows a design flaw. and if that flaw is intentional to "buy time" until new content is released - that's not how you do it. I would seriously prefer to have my character decked-out in godly gear for all my troubles - as a high level hero who beat Merciless and is running maps solo should - and then wiped back to level 1 at the game's release. anything but the current situation. and the same goes for crafting, and especially socketing and linking. if you somehow got to a point where you have 300 Orbs Of Fusing (I don't, and never will) and are high-level enough - you "deserve" at least one 6-linked item. and no wipe-outs. Torchlight 1 had wipe-outs in enchanting, but it was gold-based - so if you were at a certain stage of the game and a certain level, you had plenty of gold to waste trying to craft an item. the absolute worst wipe-out in that game, meant a few more hours of "farming" high-risk areas, and maybe a dozen battles with the hardest boss. in contrast, when unlucky level 70+ players take the very few Orbs they have, and end-up with a 1-socket, a 0-link, or an item with worthless modifiers at the end of the process, and absolutely no guarantee they would ever get those Orbs back - it is neither fair nor logical. and since it seems to be by design too, I would really like that design to be changed. besides fixing bugs and providing greater stability - which is essential in Beta - I think you guys should really take a look at the current state of the game, and see that it simply isn't fun. it's a grind without the rewards for the grind. it's so random, a 1-week player can be much better rewarded than a 1-month player. and again, it has nothing to do with content or the lack thereof. make the game fun. make it fair. make it as stable as possible, with the current content. you have plenty of time. make it live up to it's enormous potential. Warmest Regards, John Keys Alva: I'm sweating like a hog in heat Shadow: That was fun Last edited by johnKeys#6083 on May 3, 2013, 4:04:45 AM
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" Chris himself has stated before that maps are considered "THE ENDGAME" content. Even if you add new acts, you are simply increasing the content towards endgame, not changing endgame itself. The current concept of endgame is so broken beyond believe, simply stating "this is beta, and maps are the stop-gap" is really not cutting it. Even the Beta Manifesto states stuff that implies maps aren't going to change that drastically, which basically makes it a total fail to the majority of the playerbase. |
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" I'm sure all the players of endgame characters that have stopped playing or cut back on their playing time wanted to spend all their effort building a character to level 85+ only so they can't actually play them because map RNG sucks. Even more than the destructive crafting (which isn't terrible because you can still trade for decent gear at reasonable rates, at least until endgame) is that endgame in this game is downright masochistic (there's plenty of players in maps right now whose gear isn't 'great' or anything, but any piece of upgrade would cost them at least 5+ exalted). The price of any appreciable upgrade in endgame basically goes up some orders of magnitude, the cost of running a character through endgame goes up orders of magnitude. The success of your build becomes difficult to measure because of map mods and randomly-generated packs. Basically the only people who can enjoy endgame are those that have gotten dually lucky, once to get the equipment or the currency to buy it, and again on acquiring the maps that you actually need to level a character past the mid to high 80s and into the 90s. Last edited by UnderOmerta#1203 on May 3, 2013, 5:48:50 AM
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" ARe you kidding me real wolf? I gave feedback on 3 big issues: 1) Maps 2) Fusings/crafting 3) Endgame having no reward. Currently, THIS IS the end game. Deny it or not, more and more people are going to leave unless GGG takes action NOW. 1) Give us something to do OTHER than maps. I suggest something akin to boss farming (key hunting in Diablo 3) or endless dungeon. 2) Fix fusings 3) Make it at least a -10% penalty, or even better -5% penalty. Having a -15% penalty is ridiculous given the game has desync issues. Maybe you should learn to read. The rest of the 'end-game' content will be available along with a heap of new stuff when the game launches in a few months time. From what I've seen it's going to be awesome. - Michael_GGG
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yeah, i agree i stopped playing because of that said.
i spent all my currency to 6link my marohi dont get a 5link(i would have stopped) - no luck i spent all my maps - with no luck no i´m down to farm docks and sell trash to the vendor to buy some 66maps with no luck? so in the end its my fault to manage to come down to nice equipment, but no currency no maps i think we´re in need of a rewarding endgame, time to resurrect mäelstrom? dont know but i´m in need of something rewarding to play and get really a reward, dont know daily quest givven a map with 25 levels(just lvl.66 but with a little chance to drop everything ingame) perhaps i´m just a pussy-player and should go farm the shit out of the docks, but dont think thats the kind of game i want to play, so in every game-rpg-mmo-whatever after 1000hours of play you would go back and farm lvl 32 area just to get back for an hour in endgame? just my 50cent PS: sry for bad english PPS: trading is a pain in the ass in PoE^^ PPPS: PoE is really a bit masochistic, in trading or fusing or playing maps^^ Last edited by hoggl#3181 on May 3, 2013, 7:31:42 AM
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typed a huge post about the many anti-fun unrewarding game mechanics.
realised that most of this has already been written countless times on the feedback forums. hope it gets fixed, but my hope is constantly dwindling away. |
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" So please address the whole idea behind so called crafting/gambling system. The mechanics of it are punishing. The amount of unpredictability in it is unrewarding. And the ability of it to mostly break your gear than to upgrade it is really pissing people off. At least please discuss our positive feedback about the system: " There are two main things dropping people out of the game: The one-armed bandit "crafting" system. Punishing as hell. And the survivability on melee builds which causes player to be at least 10 levels above the map to be able to survive in most cases. Last edited by Martinezz123#5213 on May 3, 2013, 8:54:55 AM
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