2021 Mystery Box Research - The Truth Behind $4,386 Worth of Boxes

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Imaginaerum wrote:

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Sarciss wrote:

They will come up with some mastermind answer like "just dont buy them looool"
Probably the same type of people who tell depressed persons "just be happy loool" or alcoholics "just dont drink lool????"

The things you're listing often result in depression. Depression on its own can still be treated, and most 'depressed' people I know refuse to get any help. They like the attention.

But it is true. Don't want to risk being an alcoholic? Don't drink. Don't want to waste money on loot boxes? GGG isn't forcing you to click the Buy button. They only exist because people are buying them. It's our own fault.

i dont disagree its definitely our own fault buying them.. if we stop buying them GGG wont make them cause it will be a lost money for them and lost effort... but saying i would think better of GGG if they did even something small to make these loot boxes abit less RNG with abit less frustration isnt wrong .. some of us love the concept of some loot boxes i guess but recently these boxes are bad... and every boxing sension ends out with nothing but frustration and feeling scammed.. :D if one spend 800 usd points on a box and end up lacking couple of parts from the set and gotta spend more usd for buying these later i think its wrong.. thats why i think allowing to destroy some duplicated items into small amount of lets say shards that can be used later to craft an item from this loot box would be good thing.. to ensure after large amount of spending you could at the very least crat that stubborn body armor that never came out to reduce frustration

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Imaginaerum wrote:

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Sarciss wrote:

They will come up with some mastermind answer like "just dont buy them looool"
Probably the same type of people who tell depressed persons "just be happy loool" or alcoholics "just dont drink lool????"

The things you're listing often result in depression. Depression on its own can still be treated, and most 'depressed' people I know refuse to get any help. They like the attention.
But it is true. Don't want to risk being an alcoholic? Don't drink. Don't want to waste money on loot boxes? GGG isn't forcing you to click the Buy button. They only exist because people are buying them. It's our own fault.

Just stupid or ignorant? Whatever. You obviously have no experience with clinically depressed persons.

If life was that simple there would be no alcoholics, no addicts etc.
The human mind can be exploited quite easily. Stuff like lootboxes targets this. I dont have a problem with it, generally its still predatory business though.

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Imaginaerum wrote:

The things you're listing often result in depression. Depression on its own can still be treated, and most 'depressed' people I know refuse to get any help. They like the attention.

But it is true. Don't want to risk being an alcoholic? Don't drink. Don't want to waste money on loot boxes? GGG isn't forcing you to click the Buy button. They only exist because people are buying them. It's our own fault.

Good to know you are ignorant by your own choice then.

On topic: while Mystery Boxes are arguably not consumer-friendly, don't expect them to go away as long as they are legal in most countries.

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SkinnerSw33t wrote:

I'll pass on trusting government regulatory systems to keep companies in check.

You have way more faith in our overlords than I do. ;)

i don't have faith in government. i have faith in crooks doing all things possible to collect their money. which is exactly what they'd be doing if GGG or any other company were lying about their rates.

they didn't put these regulations in place to in order to keep companies in check - they put them in place to take advantage of collecting heavy fucking fines for breaking the regulations which people begged for due to their lack of self control and discipline

people by large beg for government to regulate so that they don't need to have personal responsibility.

i advocate for more personal responsibility

Can someone explain to me how/why this voluntary transaction between adults can be unethical?

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innervation wrote:

Can someone explain to me how/why this voluntary transaction between adults can be unethical?

It would take some time and probably a lot of effort breaking down the human condition, but I could. I won't though; it would be doing you a disservice. If you've made it this far without grasping the nuances of ethics as regards the exploitation of the weakness of others, you're a blessed individual and should be left in such a blissful state. :) :) :) :) :) :) :)


Nah, fuck that. Here you go:



Someone explaining to you how/why voluntary transactions between adults can be unethical.

Learn, if you want to. I suspect you don't, but hey, feel free to surprise me.

edit: damn, I just can't help but help you. So here's the money shot from that article, which is rather short but also a click away and, let's face it, that's a click too far for most.

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Predatory monetization schemes typically involve in-game purchasing systems that disguise or withhold the true long-term cost of the activity until players are already financially and psychologically committed.

Curiously I feel this applies more to PoE's merciless storage system investment loop (which is absolutely the 'true long-term cost of the activity') than its loot boxes but eh, we're still talking about 'voluntary transactions between adults' here. That you'd be so reductive as to assume that 'adults' are fully in control at all times and unsusceptible to the deception of others is...well, yeah. Like I said, that's a blessed life right there.

And just in case it seems like I'm coming across as holier-than-thou or too quick to defend the victims, try to remember how much I've put into this game, voluntarily. I knew what I was doing and I don't regret it, but I knew it was dead money the moment I did it. It was within my budget. This may not be true for others, and it is they to whom loot boxes and the stash system are unethical. Anyway, off to buy some costumes in Guild Wars 2. $20 for 5 of them, and the worst still looks a HECK of a lot better to me than pretty much anything in PoE's bloated, overcooked cash shop. Added bonus: GW2 isn't owned by Tencent. ^_^

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Predatory monetization schemes (e.g., 'loot boxes') in video games are purchasing systems that disguise or withhold the long-term cost of the activity until players are already financially and psychologically committed. Such schemes contribute to the increasing similarity of gaming and gambling and the potential for financial harm for those with Internet gaming disorder.

-the abstract

What is disguised or withheld in PoE's loot box construction?

What is the 'long-term' cost? You pay the coin you get a box. That's as short term as it gets with no commitment to buy more. Or any in the first place.

Some people will spend far more than they should on these things.

Some people will never understand why.

Glad I'm in the later group.

Out of the goodness of Chris Wilson's heart, GGG allows us to gamble on MTX rather than purchase them.

Nothing unethical to see here. GGG definitely isn't attacking the psychology of a certain segment of its consumer base.

The free loot box is also completely benign and not at all an attempt to net fresh whales.

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SkinnerSw33t wrote:

Out of the goodness of Chris Wilson's heart, GGG allows us to gamble on MTX rather than purchase them.

Nothing unethical to see here. GGG definitely isn't attacking the psychology of a certain segment of its consumer base.

The free loot box is also completely benign and not at all an attempt to net fresh whales.

The main argument against this is that you can't initially buy the items from the boxes. You have to wait. People don't like to wait.