I'm SURE everyone's already used to him but

"

MedicMortal wrote:

Actually I'm offering healthy criticism of certain game design choices that may lead to a better overall experience for what should be the main player-base, Hardcore.

Your ad hominem/strawman mixup doesn't address any of points I've made about this specific encounter.

Sorry I read merc lab 3 times but was thinking about uber lab in my response.

Regardless you may have just been hit with a perfect storm of stuff. Crit, shocked, etc. Does he oneshot you every time or did it just happen once?

If it just happened once than it is designed that way intentionally to make sure you are focused on that miniboss fight. He can hit extemely hard in perfect storm situations even in merc lab.

This sounds more like a "omg i can't believe i died once" type of rage thread to me.

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Wazz72 wrote:

"

Snorkle_uk wrote:

I think 16k armour will mitigate more physical damage than a lightning coil + taste of hate against merciless argus.

Well, assuming capped light+cold res, LC and ToH are better, even the non-legacy ones.

he does about 2k physical damage?

So off the top of my head its armour + 10x damage, and then you divide armour by that? (correct me if im wrong anywhere along these calcs as Im just going off cuff)

so its 16,000 / 36,000 = 44.4% physical damage reduction from armour.


Coil, 30% of phys to light, 75% light resist = 22.5% phys resist

ToH, 20% to cold with +6% max cold, 81% cold resist = 16.2% phys resist

22.5 + 16.2 = 38.7% physical damage reduction from coil + toh.


what did I miss?

Conversion applies before anything else, so that is 50% of physdmg not taken as phys dmg,which means you take 1000 phys dmg, now if you have only 1000 armor, that means you DM from that 1000 armor is 1/11

38.7%+1/11=47.8%

Obviously if you have more armor it is better, phys dmg taken as elemental mods turn armor from absolutely shit to regular shit.

Obviously the bigger the hit, the better ele conversion becomes.

For example coil +10k armor is better, than 50k armor alone against a 10k hit on high tier maps.

22.5% dm from coil, then 10 000/(10 000+ 70 000) = 12.5% total of 35%
While 50k armor is 50 000/(50 000+ 100 000) = 33.33%

im standing in front of him in merc lab atm on a ci char with 0 phys damage reduction. I got a lot of evasion so theres big gaps between him hitting me and Im always at full es again before he can land another one. I have 14,007 es.

over 70% of his hits have done less than 2k damage. Hes probably landed about 40 hits so far and only 1 of them has taken me below 11k es.

Majority of his hits are doing about 1,500 damage, quite a few doing about 2,500.


Im still stood here as Im typing this, Hes probably hit me 100 times by now. He seems to go enranged all by himself, if thats what the bloodrage type effect he gets is. When hes not enraged he does about 1500 damage, when he is enraged hes doing maybe 2200 to 3200 damage, with 3200 being extremely rare.

I thought he enraged on low life, I didnt realise he actually enrages all by himself even when ur basically doing nothing to him.


Hes still hitting me, probably 150+ hits so far and Ive noticed maybe 3 do 3k+ damage. Vast Vast majority are about 1500.

I got no phys pantheons, took out my cwdt enfeeble, I have 0 armour, absolutely no physical mitigation going on. I wish I had some sort of on crit taken glove enchant to get an idea of when a crit is landing. Im presuming these ones where it edges just over 3k are an enraged crit? Or do monsters just have this sort of variable damage range?

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krenderke wrote:

Conversion applies before anything else, so that is 50% of physdmg not taken as phys dmg,which means you take 1000 phys dmg, now if you have only 1000 armor, that means you DM from that 1000 armor is 1/11

38.7%+1/11=47.8%

Obviously if you have more armor it is better, phys dmg taken as elemental mods turn armor from absolutely shit to regular shit.

Obviously the bigger the hit, the better ele conversion becomes.

For example coil +10k armor is better, than 50k armor alone against a 10k hit on high tier maps.

22.5% dm from coil, then 10 000/(10 000+ 70 000) = 12.5% total of 35%
While 50k armor is 50 000/(50 000+ 100 000) = 33.33%

Im more than aware of how it works.

Nothing hits you for 10k in higher tier maps outside of something like a vaal slam with damage mods, theres literally no point talking about what does what against 10k phys hits in high maps, they essentially dont exist.

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MedicMortal wrote:

I love how people are taking this time to give me advice on the boss instead of discussing this point at hand.

How are people supposed to take your tantrum thread seriously?

Argus is a bonus reward, Izaro is a necessary quest for progression.

Your argument for an "expectation" that you can kill argus just because you can kill izaro is thus completely pointless.

If you get some data saying that argus is mathematically harder than izaro with all 3 gargoyle buffs plus max charges up, then I might be interested in listening (he's not, lol).

Until then, I can facetank Argus in the uber lab and you are just bad at the game.

"

Vipermagi wrote:

Hmm. Curious. He seemed to hit harder against my 8k/6 ECharges than that. Maybe I'm a moron. *shrug*
Monster crit mult is 130, so the 3k's are Crits more likely than not.

well the enraged hits are def well over 2k, about 2500 on average spiking up over 3k occasionally, presumably crits, I think we can presume the guy got gibbed while he was enraged so its half way between my guess and yours.

Given it was an evasion ci, and the creature was landing maybe 1 in every 4 shots, that would also mean only 1 in every 4 crits would actually score a proper crit? If so I think that would make sense for how rare those 3k+ hits were seeming.

If we look at 2500 as his hits we get about a 39% damage reduction from the 16k armour, which is virtually the same as a coil + a taste of hate, so its actually about equal it would seem give or take.


The thing with a coil and a taste of hate, theyre not really better than having solid endgame armour + endurance + basalt when it comes to reducing physical damage, but what you do with those items is then go full on evasion which along with a cwdt enfeeble is going to give you a good 66% - 75% less damage taken from attacks along with some breathing room between hits, and then you go acrobatics for another 40% removed from what gets through, and then the rare times you get hit you have a layer of damage reduction against phys from the coil and toh that, while not really giving you the same level of reduction, in the context of the full package does end up putting an armour and endurance stacker to shame really.

I use coils all the time, I have about 4 legacy ones linked up on standard and its probably my most popular choice of chest armour. Im certainly not hating on the chest for all the coil enthusiasts yearning for a dislike button when I suggest the 16k armour was probably more effective. But ppl dont give armour enough credit, 16k when flasked is not really a decent amount of armour in the endgame picture as we know, youre looking at about 25k passive, no flasks, for a decent total. 25k armour is not crap, its not useless, when you look at armour, coil, toh, basalt, endurance, fortify, arctic armour, the whole range of them, forget the investment required, just look at the damage reduction they give, armour is by far the best direct hit physical damage reduction of the bunch in 99.9% of cases, in a lot of cases it will beat 2 or 3 of those things combined, with a 6 endurance charge type setup being the strongest second option and also one that every decent armour build also has and it made better by having armour because theyre additive, and unlike damage in defense most of the time additive mitigation types are preferable to stuff that is calculated successively in layers. Some notable exceptions obviously.

@Snorkle: thx for the math and your effort to evaluate Argus' hits, I thought he was hitting for about 3k (and 4k crits), hence my reply to you. Good to know :-)