If its considered psychopathic to enjoy the suffering of others ...

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鬼殺し wrote:

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Boem wrote:

Can psychopaths enjoy the happiness of others? Maybe in a sort of calculated way?

I can only imagine life as being overly complex and boring as a result of that complexity if you don't have that capability.

It's sort of sad that society pushes this condition on people in order to take choices they wish to avoid themselves. Necessity invokes it.

Peace,

-Boem-

Absolutely they can. What they can't do, or at least struggle to comprehend, is putting others first at their own expense.

This is the really big one. They will not trade their happiness for someone else's. They might go out of their way to serve others or help loved ones but only if they derive pleasure from it.

No one in their right mind would trade their happiness for someone else's. Parental instincts don't count, (most) parents feel terrible if something bad happens to their child, so they are acting in a sort of self-interest by proxy when they act in their child's interest.

All behavior is self-interested in its roots, including altruism. Altruistic people feel good when they help others.

The only difference is that some people have a more inclusive sense of self, while others, psychopathy being probably the most extreme case, are disconnected.

@bhavv: the association between sadism and psychopathy is a common misconception. Sadism is, in fact, connected to higher levels of empathy - which puts it at the other end of the spectrum. Psychopaths may be likely and willing to hurt others, especially male psychopaths with high antisocial traits, but they typically won't do it for sadistic pleasure. AFAIK sadism is much more likely to be associated with malignant narcissism.

Also, psychopathy is statistically rare - from 0.5 to 1% of the population depending on race. There is an annoying tendency in pop culture to use it as an umbrella term for any sort of antisocial behavior. Psychopaths, psychopaths everywhere!

Nope. The real ones are pretty fucking rare, and if they are high-functioning ones (with higher intelligence and impulse control), you probably won't have any idea who they are.

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Bars wrote:

No one in their right mind would trade their happiness for someone else's. Parental instincts don't count, (most) parents feel terrible if something bad happens to their child, so they are acting in a sort of self-interest by proxy when they act in their child's interest.

I don't see a need to add "by-proxy" in that statement.

A healthy child that has a good/stable upbringing will have a higher chance of being capable of caring for the elderly when they require it.
It's self interest that simply spans over a greater time-frame then most people are aware of.


I sort of view it the same way as you describe though, people are selfish creatures in my opinion and some people are just selfish and aware of that fact while others are unconscious about it.

I don't see being selfish or ego-centered as a net-negative state though, from my own experience i can quite confidently say that your incapable of helping others if your not thinking or taking care of yourself first.

Peace,

-Boem-

edit : hmm just re-read the quote, i agree with you and just misinterpreted the proxy part entirely :D

Yeah, those parents are all a bunch of self-serving c***s

Of course it's not a net negative, we are a social species entirely built upon and relying on cooperation. Rational self-interest usually involves a healthy amount of actions which would be considered altruistic.

Speaking of which, one of the occupational fields with a higher than average percentage of psychopaths is... the clergy.

Hah!

The lower functioning ones become criminals, the smarter ones become priests, bankers and politicians.

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鬼殺し wrote:

Thanks for confirming what I've suspected for a while, Bars. :)

You're not entirely correct, but not entirely wrong either.

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Bars wrote:

we are a social species entirely built upon and relying on cooperation.

Maybe a bit off-topic, though not entirely depending on how far you push it.

But this is one of the basics that is heavily missing and undervalued by "society" as a whole, for instance i was constantly told at a young age to become a "self-sufficient person" and to "not rely on others".

Couple such sentiment with ego-inflating tools and ego-dependency like the current social media and the current state of human beings as a whole is not surprising to me. Including mental states that focus on the connection between humans enabling the possibility to mentally "disconnect" from others.

I always feel like chucking a brick in people's faces that tell me to become an independent person like themselves while thinking to myself "have you not been paying attention your entire life?".

People three times my age telling me stuff like that make me facepalm quite hard.

Peace,

-Boem-

@Boem: I remember reading somewhere that the age of social media and the current predominant values in society have resulted in a significant increase of narcissistic behavior, especially in young people who have grown up under the constant influence of social media.

The joke was like that - we have Generation Y, Generation X, and now we have the Millenials, who are generation Me.

It's all fun and games.

Here have this possibility to network all over the world and transcend issue's consisting of
"shit my neighbors tree is to high" -> proceeds to inform people when they go to the market and what they bought.

Peace,

-Boem-

Technology and money are amplifiers - they allow people to more fully express who they are. If you're an idiot, well...

And the optimist in me instantly goes, "or they are enabling one an others addiction to disappointment".

Peace,

-Boem-

No it's being a democrat.

They reward bad behavior and get more bad behavior. Just look at large democrat cities. LA alone has 50K homeless cause Cali give free shit so they flock there. Democrats live for suffering of others.

Give a man fish he'll become a deadbeat.

Teach a man to fish and he'll feed himself.

Don't teach a man to fish and he'll be CEO of a tuna factory.

Thats why immigrants kick ass. They are not in democrats schools to be corrupted yet.