The Balance Team needs a shake-up

The thing is there isn't a real solution to this. If you would reign in the damage with such insane mods, the damage without them would be entirely meaningless. If you reduce the impact of individual mods, again they would be meaingless alone.

This is actually a layer of player skill that many people simply ignore. Knowing how hard different mobs hit and how much punishment you can take is important.

I agree that sadly this issue is mostly one characters fighting in melee range encounter. However the solution can't be to allow them to ignore anything as well, there should be some things that force a reaction from ranged players as well.

And yeah some skills are oddly placed and require a lot of knowledge, but volatiles are simply unavoidable, they shouldn't exist. Bearers are a good design, they allow you to react, but Volatiles mean you need to cull them from afar, which is not too hard, but once you have to do that, you might as well just move past them and ignore them.

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Emphasy wrote:

Well the thing in PoE is that with how map mods work you can pretty much get oneshot by every mob in the game.

Roll Crit Chance + Multiplier, Roll Vulnerability, Roll Extra Damage and encounter a specific enemy near a diamond shrine and let it have extra damage or powerful crits. The damage such a mob in such a situation deals is a lot higher than a regular hit. However as a player you should expect such a situation and actually see it coming.

None of it will be literally "one shot" in a yellow map ( but as said before .... except volatile potentially ).
But yeah, situations can get dangerous very very quickly, leading to an almost instant kill.
( Of course, good builds have some layers on top of life, not just pure plain life ).

Maybe many still don't understand that the whole game isn't supposed to be facetank ?

A bit more mechanics life far shot would do the game good imho, instead of volatile.

Goetzjam, are you still here?

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Emphasy wrote:

The thing is there isn't a real solution to this. If you would reign in the damage with such insane mods, the damage without them would be entirely meaningless. If you reduce the impact of individual mods, again they would be meaingless alone.

Exactly, it's the same problem we have with rare weapons, unless all the mods align it's useless. They might do what they did with caster damage rolls, you can have only one, so in map terms you may have only one added ele damage mod, you can't have a more damage or increased aoe mod for both monsters and the boss at the same time, only one curse...

That would make it easier to balance the whole thing, an insane map would still be pretty insane but we wouldn't have an order of magnitude between an easy and hard map.

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Emphasy wrote:

The thing is there isn't a real solution to this. If you would reign in the damage with such insane mods, the damage without them would be entirely meaningless. If you reduce the impact of individual mods, again they would be meaingless alone.

The real solution will be increasing base damage, but removing multiplicative scaling of many monster+map mods (and maybe limiting a number of DMG mods mob/map can have). So, the damage without mods will be higher, but several damage mod wont make it insane.

Solution is super easy... Hire Mathil and let him go over all the skills and mobs. Should take him less than a month. As an example. Took him 5 min to balance check the 3 new skills and he was spot on.

90% of the playerbase is looking to him anyway:P


There.. fixed it

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

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Emphasy wrote:

The thing is there isn't a real solution to this. If you would reign in the damage with such insane mods, the damage without them would be entirely meaningless. If you reduce the impact of individual mods, again they would be meaingless alone.

The real solution will be increasing base damage, but removing multiplicative scaling of many monster+map mods (and maybe limiting a number of DMG mods mob/map can have). So, the damage without mods will be higher, but several damage mod wont make it insane.

This would severely reduce the amount of potential mods a map could have and again make rolling them meaningless, because regardless of what you roll the map won't be much harder. Because how should you make the Crit and Vulnerability mod not multiplicative? There isn't a solution that would allow them to stack additive. Basically all damage mods you can add stack multiplicative, except for multiples of the same (like %added damage as X).

And I'm not sure if the player should expect a 120% quantity map to be harmless. Heavy hitting enemies will destroy you if you roll 3 damage mods. What they could and propably should do to maps is seperate Suffixes and Prefixes better. Because many mods that enhance damage are suffix, while two are prefix. This means you can roll a map that has Vulnerability, Increased Crit-Chance/Mult, Increased Damage, Increased Boss Damage, Onslaught and Unlocky Dodge or reduced Block chance.

So what they could do is seperate mods that enhances the damage the player takes (on both ends, like higher mob damage or cursing the player) and put those in the suffix and put all the mods that make mobs harder to kill into the prefix part. That way at most 3 mods could align that increase mob damage, which is still a lot but not as much as the current system allows.

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Emphasy wrote:

This would severely reduce the amount of potential mods a map could have and again make rolling them meaningless, because regardless of what you roll the map won't be much harder.

Ok, another solution - make quantity/rarity/packsize bonuses for damage mods much higher, than for others. Rolled a map with crazy damage? You'll get crazy drops and exp as well.
ATM, hard damage mods often arent even rewarded properly...

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Emphasy wrote:

So what they could do is seperate mods that enhances the damage the player takes (on both ends, like higher mob damage or cursing the player) and put those in the suffix and put all the mods that make mobs harder to kill into the prefix part. That way at most 3 mods could align that increase mob damage, which is still a lot but not as much as the current system allows.

That's exactly what i suggested some time ago, too.
3 damage mods at most (4 for corrupted map) are manageable, 6+ arent...

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

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Emphasy wrote:

This would severely reduce the amount of potential mods a map could have and again make rolling them meaningless, because regardless of what you roll the map won't be much harder.

Ok, another solution - make quantity/rarity/packsize bonuses for damage mods much higher, than for others. Rolled a map with crazy damage? You'll get crazy drops and exp as well.
ATM, hard damage mods often arent even rewarded properly...

It would be really cool if they could come up with a dynamic reward system. Because right now you can get incredible IIQ for mods that don't even affect you. If your char has no elemental equilibrium or deals purely physical damage having EE on a map doesn't really matter. And while Hexproof on a triple curse char might actually make him reconsider doing the map a char not using curses won't care.

Damage mods in general are pretty risky, because every build has to care about damage, it would be cool if they get their own tag and would give additional rewards if you stack more of them.

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MortalKombat3 wrote:

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Emphasy wrote:

So what they could do is seperate mods that enhances the damage the player takes (on both ends, like higher mob damage or cursing the player) and put those in the suffix and put all the mods that make mobs harder to kill into the prefix part. That way at most 3 mods could align that increase mob damage, which is still a lot but not as much as the current system allows.

That's exactly what i suggested some time ago, too.
3 damage mods at most (4 for corrupted map) are manageable, 6+ arent...

Soemthing like this would be nice .... maybe 4 mods at most then, or at most 3 damage mods without curses.