General Discussion - "Never pay-to-win" Dishonest Marketing by GGG? - Forum

" GingerBeast wrote: Don't read the spoiler if you get your feelings hurt easy......in other news....how the piss do you add a title to a spoiler? like this To be perfectly honest though, I am getting kind of tired of people complaining about this (not that my level of complacency with peoples' whining and bitching means shit to anyone). It is a free to play game. Do you think that GGG just wants to foot this bill themselves and do all the work for free? I like the fact that I can't buy a shavs (legally). I also like the fact that I can have 18 stash tabs just for gems because I have a hidden hope that one day they will make a true sink for skill gems that I will be able to abuse the shit out of (this will not happen). If you don't like their policies, don't support them. There are plenty of us that are ok with what they do and that will support them Press Q under my name. Peace, -Boem- Freedom is not worth having if it does not include the freedom to make mistakes Last edited by Boem on Aug 17, 2016, 9:01:13 PM	Posted by Boem on Aug 17, 2016, 9:01:00 PM On Probation Quote this Post
" Boem wrote: Press Q under my name. Peace, -Boem- You are a scholar and a gentleman Exile "Bullshit, you get the game for free." -Qarl	Posted by GingerBeast on Aug 17, 2016, 9:17:08 PM Quote this Post
" e1337donkey wrote: I would agree that having more tabs, premium, and currency ones, are a form of gaining convenience. You have a sizeable advantage in how you can utilize your inventory for trading purposes. That being said, how do you win in PoE? Having more stash tabs in race events, don't help.. because the event is over before use them. Outside of racing, there is nothing competitive to define someone winning over another player. The act of creating a build, going though acts/maps killing monsters, finding loot to use or trade has no clear defined way of winning. The pay to win concept gets thrown around a lot of free to play games but sometimes I feel like it doesn't have much context to a game like this. Certainly you gain an advantage in the trading game. But all that means is you have more access to powerful items to push your characters further. Or make multiple strong characters. Literally there is no way to win, like you can't beat anyone in PoE... its not possible. Just listen to Old Chris Wilson for guidance. If you agree that the premium stash tabs add convenience then there is a problem. Old Chris Wilson defined "pay-to-win" as "microtransaction" that provides an "advantage" for one player over another. "Microtransactions" should "completely divorced" from any "game play boost" as this would be "pay-to-win". The reason such a "pay-to-win" system is a problem is that the positive feelings of players are "substantially reduced" if other players can "buy advantage" to have the convenience to obtain currency for "less effort" and the overall "integrity of the game" is diminished: We don’t want to sell anything that affects the game economy or provides a competitive advantage for one player over another. We try to completely divorce our microtransactions from the game balance. Selling items that affect a player’s stats, or can be traded, or provide some type of gameplay boost are examples of things that we feel would be pay-to-win. We’ve designed Path of Exile as the game that we want to play, and we don’t want to play a game where players can buy advantage. In an Action RPG, it’s very important that players can only acquire levels and items as a direct result of their hard work so that the integrity of the game is kept intact. Players play for the feeling of finding and having an amazing item, and that feeling is substantially reduced if other players can get it for less effort.	Posted by FelicityFlowers on Aug 18, 2016, 12:59:11 AM Quote this Post
Are stash tabs pay to win? Let's see. Does your character become stronger by getting more of em? No? Not p2w.	Posted by SimonMester on Aug 19, 2016, 8:46:17 AM Quote this Post
This game is pay to win. When you buy a lot of supporter packs, GGG become bias toward you and let you get away with things that a normal non-supporter wouldn't get away with. At the drop of a hat I can provide evidence of several supporters which blatantly RMT. But nothing will happen to them. I can only recall a few instances of big fish supporters being banned and those were due to botting. That's one thing GGG won't tolerate from anyone. But that's the nature of the "Free to play" business model. I don't hate GGG for it but I just disagree with their model. IGN:Vennttorr - Level 100 Witch - 1st Witch to 100. My mirror service thread: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/811499 My Crit Arc build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1090691 -- Updated Last edited by Ventor on Aug 19, 2016, 8:58:30 AM	Posted by Ventor on Aug 19, 2016, 8:56:44 AM Quote this Post
" Ventor wrote: This game is pay to win. When you buy a lot of supporter packs, GGG become bias toward you and let you get away with things that a normal non-supporter wouldn't get away with. At the drop of a hat I can provide evidence of several supporters which blatantly RMT. But nothing will happen to them. I can only recall a few instances of big fish supporters being banned and those were due to botting. That's one thing GGG won't tolerate from anyone. But that's the nature of the "Free to play" business model. I don't hate GGG for it but I just disagree with their model. If you have evidence of someone breaking the terms of service, whether that is botting, RMT or anything else, please email support@grindinggear.com so that the information can be forwarded to the accounts investigation team. Please contact support@grindinggear.com if you need any assistance.	Posted by Gary_GGG on Aug 19, 2016, 9:02:27 AM Grinding Gear Games Quote this Post
Talking about Dishonest marketing... Ivs been buying single packs to upgrade them into supporter packs when it come out for years and all of a sudden i see that GGG doesn't want to do it anymore... way to treat your longterm loyal supporters whats so different between supporting from A to get B than buying a credit plan to get B that last till C... GGG is literally spitting on $$ doing this, im not willing to buy a 110$ pack when i know i got 75$ sleeping in my account transaction that would make it 35$ ZiggyD is the Labyrinth of streamers, some like it, some dont, but GGG will make sure to push it down ur throat to make you like it Last edited by Sexcalibure on Aug 19, 2016, 9:12:14 AM	Posted by Sexcalibure on Aug 19, 2016, 9:10:55 AM On Probation Quote this Post
" Gary_GGG wrote: " Ventor wrote: This game is pay to win. When you buy a lot of supporter packs, GGG become bias toward you and let you get away with things that a normal non-supporter wouldn't get away with. At the drop of a hat I can provide evidence of several supporters which blatantly RMT. But nothing will happen to them. I can only recall a few instances of big fish supporters being banned and those were due to botting. That's one thing GGG won't tolerate from anyone. But that's the nature of the "Free to play" business model. I don't hate GGG for it but I just disagree with their model. If you have evidence of someone breaking the terms of service, whether that is botting, RMT or anything else, please email support@grindinggear.com so that the information can be forwarded to the accounts investigation team. I've done this before but it doesn't seem effective. It's very easy to cross reference items being sold on poe.trade and a CERTAIN website which allows trade for a certain type of 'forum' gold. I spot it all the time but mostly toward the beginning of leagues. That's why I don't play the leagues personally. People get unfair advantages at the start. So it feels pointless to compete. IGN:Vennttorr - Level 100 Witch - 1st Witch to 100. My mirror service thread: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/811499 My Crit Arc build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1090691 -- Updated	Posted by Ventor on Aug 19, 2016, 9:43:53 AM Quote this Post
" Ventor wrote: " Gary_GGG wrote: " Ventor wrote: This game is pay to win. When you buy a lot of supporter packs, GGG become bias toward you and let you get away with things that a normal non-supporter wouldn't get away with. At the drop of a hat I can provide evidence of several supporters which blatantly RMT. But nothing will happen to them. I can only recall a few instances of big fish supporters being banned and those were due to botting. That's one thing GGG won't tolerate from anyone. But that's the nature of the "Free to play" business model. I don't hate GGG for it but I just disagree with their model. If you have evidence of someone breaking the terms of service, whether that is botting, RMT or anything else, please email support@grindinggear.com so that the information can be forwarded to the accounts investigation team. I've done this before but it doesn't seem effective. It's very easy to cross reference items being sold on poe.trade and a CERTAIN website which allows trade for a certain type of 'forum' gold. I spot it all the time but mostly toward the beginning of leagues. That's why I don't play the leagues personally. People get unfair advantages at the start. So it feels pointless to compete. I could use poe.trade to find items you are listing, and then write up a fake sale thread.... Boom you're insta banned...	Posted by Gaza on Aug 19, 2016, 9:46:56 AM Alpha Member Quote this Post
" Gaza wrote: I could use poe.trade to find items you are listing, and then write up a fake sale thread.... Boom you're insta banned... Yeah, sure. Those 1000 pages of trade within the first week of a league are totally all fakes. Also, it's kind of hard to fake a screenshot from someone else's stash tab. Which most people are stupid enough to do. Fact of the matter is that not enough measures are being taken to crack down on this. I know this very well. There are sooooo manay RMTers running around POE, it has become a joke. I can't tell you how many times someone has PM'd me to mirror something, asked for the mirror fee and said "can you wait 30 mins, my friend has to get on and give me the exalts". IGN:Vennttorr - Level 100 Witch - 1st Witch to 100. My mirror service thread: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/811499 My Crit Arc build: http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/1090691 -- Updated	Posted by Ventor on Aug 19, 2016, 9:53:06 AM Quote this Post