Remove Lightning Thorns

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

After getting several characters to decently high levels(80-88) and finding many problems with the design of this game and being continuously ignored by the staff when I point them out, I think I'm either going to be quitting soon or taking a long vacation. Maybe in year or two this game will be playable and actually enjoyable, which seems should be the point of the game; right now it's just frustrating. I could go on for many lines but I won't. I think the most annoying thing is how easily you can get insta-killed in so many different ways combined with the fact that RNG won't drop any maps over 73 for me even though I've been running high level maps for months. So, xp goes away really fast and I can't get any maps to help get the xp back. *sigh* this game has so much potential but it falls on it's face right at the finish line. GGG staff...the game should be fun, not annoying and frustrating.

This won't change. GGG has on several occasions deflected issues as being 'good' or 'unfixable'. Desynchronization, Spike Damage that 1-shots you with maxed resistances? Both either intentional or 'unfixable'. They like and revel and extremes and think it's fun that death is a fine line inbetween 0 and 1.

The community enjoys these aspects (somehow) and also actively fights against any attempt to smooth out the rougher edges: however the hostility you've shown in this thread is not in any way likely to change that. You need to sit down and actually think of the pro's and cons of each aspect of the game. While you will find many things that are horribly wrong with the game... lightning thorns isn't one of them.

You have a funny way of choosing to read that. There is no need to attack my stance when I'm saying lightning thorns are fine as-is.

Secondly I'm simply stating damage is overtuned in this game (and everyone knows it. That's why we all stack insane amounts of defense). We also know that being able to die in a single second even with high amounts of survivability stats is by design, since the devs have told us such. We also should be aware this is the exact opposite stance most developers have, and it's one of the primary causes for the games spikey content.

I didn't say anything debatable. I didn't say anything bad either. Despite this games flaws, we all somehow find it enjoyable, and that is what matters.

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Ezhiel wrote:

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

She uses a level 1 Firestorm with Curse on Hit for curse delivery.

Because everybody having the exact same retard face-tank build is boring and defeats the purpose of having options?

Let's take a look at the current end game requirements:
* High life or ES pool. (Check.)
* Maxed resists. (Check.)
* High defenses. (Check.)
* Remove bleeding flask. (Check.)
* Fire flask for Atziri and Flameblast rogue exiles. (Check.)
* Don't do too much damage because of reflect. (Check.)

Now you're telling our bard she needs a Soul Taker and a 7-link attack.

Have you considered ice nova lvl 1 with 20% quality to deliver curses?

Self cast curses?

Anything that does not hit once per 0.08 seconds?

Just saying, this is a self inflicted wound.

Have you tried, not cursing on lightning thorns?
(i am pretty sure your team can manage to kill the casters without curse support)

Are you Ci/low-life? What is your lightning resistance? Do you use topaz potions on lightning thorns?

Basically, it will never be removed because of a post like this, when the obvious answer is "don't curse them with your set-up and just sit back while the team kills the casters, prior to starting to curse"

Peace,

-Boem-

@feyith, i am pretty sure he was pointing out the fact you can also curse with an attack that does not deliver a lightning thorns reflect hit every 0.08 seconds, instantly ripping your character.

Or self casting for that mater that delivers 0 reflect from lightning thorns.

While at the same time not reducing fps because of firestorm particles.

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Boem wrote:

Have you considered ice nova lvl 1 with 20% quality to deliver curses?

Self cast curses?

Anything that does not hit once per 0.08 seconds?

Just saying, this is a self inflicted wound.

Have you tried, not cursing on lightning thorns?
(i am pretty sure your team can manage to kill the casters without curse support)

Are you Ci/low-life? What is your lightning resistance? Do you use topaz potions on lightning thorns?

Basically, it will never be removed because of a post like this, when the obvious answer is "don't curse them with your set-up and just sit back while the team kills the casters, prior to starting to curse"

Peace,

-Boem-

@feyith, i am pretty sure he was pointing out the fact you can also curse with an attack that does not deliver a lightning thorns reflect hit every 0.08 seconds, instantly ripping your character.

Or self casting for that mater that delivers 0 reflect from lightning thorns.

While at the same time not reducing fps because of firestorm particles.

Yeah, that sort of thing would be an option but novas don't curse well when you're firing three at once. It'll typically do 1-2 but not all three which makes me have to stand near the monsters longer and decreases my survivability. I'll pull the spells back out and try again to see if I can find anything better then Firestorm. Thanks for the constructive feedback though, I prefer that to the trolling, noob responses that most people give.

Yes, low-life build, 68% to all resists (64% to chaos).

You're also correct about waiting to curse and normally I do that but sometimes you just can't see the thorns caster in the group and hit her by accident...that's the really annoying part. Also, as I said before, it wouldn't be so bad if maps would drop at a rate that would allow some means by which to get one's experience back.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

Wow, so your solution is it alter my build to be more like a melee build huh, or maybe a CoC. Lol, so if every build needs to have high damage and Life Leech, why not just eliminate the tree and classes and gems and have us all play the same character.

Don't know who's telling you to play melee or CoC, but it's given that you have to have high DPS and life leech. Life Leech is basically the only way to recover life without having insane defenses of avoiding damage altogether.

...and since when did high life leech limit build skill trees?

I have a pure aura character just like you, Hoist_the_Auras, and I have less than 1,500 hit points. When I run Discipline and reserve my life, I have a solid 2,000.

My DPS, without ANY damage investment is just over 9,000 with my Haste aura. I use Cybil's Paw, Incinerate + GMP + Life Leech + Added Lightning Damage. I suggest you try it but switch ALD for Faster Projectiles and get quality on Incinerate. That way you cover a much wider area and also deal damage.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

I run a level 1 Firestorm because I have no mana and also because I'm Party Support, I don't need to do DPS, I add to everyone else's (nearly double most of the time).

You do need to do DPS. This type of game doesn't have the option of having DPS or not having it.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

The notion that I MUST have a specific build to survive is stupid.

It would be stupid. Good thing this game doesn't require a specific build.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

To the poster who says "Play smart", running a level 1 Firestorm as a curse delivery system since I have very little mana is playing smart.

Not sure how that's "smart". That means you have no leech capability, which means you are restricted to avoiding damage (besides running, since you must be within a certain range of allies to provide what you claim), regenerate a huge amount, or rely on flasks.

None of those are good options except dodge/block/evasion together.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

This is the problem with the game, it punishes players for being creative and innovative and tries to force them into specific builds.

No. This game has requirements that limit how creative builds can be.

Trapper? Gotta basically have max block, Acrobatics, and a ton of evasion since you cannot leech.

Discharger? Gotta have a way to deal with reflect.

Summoner? Gotta have a LGOH setup or Incinerate for easy DPS to leech.

This game requires a build that is survivable.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

Also, rather that admitting that a certain mechanic might need altering, people just jump to the defensive stance and start waging war against any opinion that makes such a suggestion as if their religion were under attack.

So why aren't we complaining about Lightning Thorns if it is a problem as big as you claim it to be?

Oh, wait, we found ways for multiple builds to avoid the damage. Like block, spell dodge, lightning resistance, high leech, and more.

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CentauriSoldier wrote:

It's so sad that people can't think before they jump to defensive responses, think before they even consider the mechanic in the light of the build in the topic. They go straight to the "do my build, then you won't die" and "nuh uh, the game is perfect, there's nothing wrong with it, you're just stupid" fanboy arguments.

Stopping at this.

It's you who doesn't want to listen, and if I didn't know any better I'd say you made this thread as a troll thread.

If so, 10/10. Had me going.

If not, you need to man up and realize the world doesn't revolve around you.

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Epicly_Curious wrote:

This won't change. GGG has on several occasions deflected issues as being 'good' or 'unfixable'. Desynchronization, Spike Damage that 1-shots you with maxed resistances? Both either intentional or 'unfixable'. They like and revel and extremes and think it's fun that death is a fine line inbetween 0 and 1.

That is because the vast majority of players that are willing to listen to advice realize that there are ways to deal with it, without making a build around it as Centari likes to think.

GGG does listen to what they need to but doesn't listen to the few that would have the game ruined just because they don't want to listen to how to overcome something.

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Epicly_Curious wrote:

The community enjoys these aspects (somehow) and also actively fights against any attempt to smooth out the rougher edges:

We like these aspects because it's a check for your build. We also know how to overcome it. Furthermore, we also don't want "noobs" to have the check removed.

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Epicly_Curious wrote:

however the hostility you've shown in this thread is not in any way likely to change that. You need to sit down and actually think of the pro's and cons of each aspect of the game. While you will find many things that are horribly wrong with the game... lightning thorns isn't one of them.

Hostility like he has shown makes us less happy to give advice and end up calling him a troll (which is likely, given the way he's acting and the fact he has a level 88.

To add, there are going to be aspects of every game that you will like and some you won't like. Deal with it.

GGG does not listen to 'what they need to' or several issues such as desynch would be corrected, and other adjustments would have been handled (or will be in certain cases like the strongboxes) far better.

I enjoy this game: I enjoy it with it's flaws, and it's ups and downs and I'm not even about to complain or attempt to make GGG or the playerbase bend over backwards to my whim. However it would be simply ignorance not to see where issues do or do not exist, and be aware of them. We then need to gear around them (as we do) but that does not mean we should not be vocal about the issues that are around, so that they get dulled a bit where beneficial to the health of the game.

As I mentioned, Lightning Thorns is fine. I am 'dealing with it'. Do not attack me for being aware.