Advancement WITHOUT trading?

Ok, so, pretty new player here, and my question is fairly simple: How far is it realistically possible to get without using the trading system? And preferrably without then grinding for 2 zillion hours.

The problem is, well.... the trading system... ehhh. This game, really, what I've played of it so far has been excellent. Very, very good. It is utterly baffling to me then, for a game that gets EVERYTHING ELSE right to get this one aspect so very, very wrong. The current style of trading brings back old nightmares of the early days of Everquest, sitting in Freeport or Qeynos and psychically shrieking "WTS EPIC PANTS OF THE GODS!!!!" over and over again (often for HOURS) to everyone in the zone. There's a reason why this sort of thing simply isnt done anymore, and why games like that use marketplace systems, and that's because it's absurdly tedious, as well as having all sorts of other problems (like an utter and total lack of secutiry, no way to browse, having to be on at the exact same time as whoever you're buying/selling from/to, and so on...). And yes, before anyone mentions it, I'm aware of the sites designed to make this easier... but doesnt it seem just a BIT odd that players need to use a third-party tool for a function that SHOULD just be in there to start with? And there's still the aspect of being able to log in at the right time to catch the player you want to trade with (damn near impossible for me most of the time with my screwball schedule; I cannot reliably say "Ok, I'll be on at THIS time here". Not viable.). And it's still really dramatically slower to do that than to use a proper marketplace system such as many MMOs use (which make the process both very quick, AND very secure for both parties).

And before anyone mentions D3's Auction House for the squillionth time, the reason THAT was horrible was because some dolt had the bright idea of allowing real money trades, which is a big no-no in these games, be they a Diablo-style game or an MMO or whatever. Auction Houses or Markets or whatever as a rule NEVER do this, and thus work out just fine.


But I'm aware that this game gets quite difficult later on, and I wonder if it's even really viable to get far into that without trades, which I SERIOUSLY do not want to do. Even if I had the undying patience to do so... which I dont... I probably still wouldnt just on general principle, as the idea just irritates me. So I'm HOPING that it's not absolutely necessary to use the trading at all to keep advancing. Wanted to hear some general thoughts on this before I decide wether or not to continue with the game.

And I'm not trying to bash the game or anything here... like I said, the gameplay is great and all. But that's the thing: When I play the game.... I want to PLAY THE GAME. Screaming "WTB SOMETHING OR OTHER" over and over again is NOT playing the game. It's really my one and only issue with it, but to me, it's a pretty big one.

By yourself to merciless 70 maps with some broken build/slow build

But what is chance to do hard mods without trading? 0 monsters just instant kill you
if you did not find self found amazing items that you can find only when you play mage culler with 600ir 100iq .

I did myself self found to 73maps then I replaced 5 days of farming with 1 minute of trading.

Interesting question.

I've been playing for only a very short time, and I have similar thoughts. I hated trading in the old days for exactly the reasons you list, and I have yet to do any trading in PoE, though the game itself is rather addictive.

I suspect that there are several reasons. One may well be philosophical; in theory, the community-based peer to peer trading mechanic (I wouldn't dignify it with the label of "system") fosters communication and community. In practice, not so much, but whatever, it makes a sort of sense. Another may be technical. Perhaps an auction house was too much trouble for an indie F2P game to develop, I don't know.

And yeah, D3's debacle may have influenced things too. Though I do think D3's problem with the AH wasn't just the RMAH (I only play Hardcore, so that never bothered me), but the way loot is (prior to Loot 2.0 at least) generated and handled in general in D3. With no BOE/BOP items, unlimited legacy usage of items, and pretty much no way to take items out of the economy in standard mode at least, having an AH where you could dump your unneeded gear and sort of recycle it made gathering gear by killing mobs pretty redundant. The ease of gold generation didn't help; at mid to high, non end-game levels, you could fully outfit a character with 95% of what you wanted for a pittance.

So far, playing only Hardcore (Nemesis league) characters in PoE, I've found the loot system more rewarding than D3, but I have struggled to fill in the gaps I need for ideal builds, even at low levels. If there was an AH, I'm sure I'd have been able to unload the stash full of rare polearms and other crap I have no use for but as it is, I sort of hold on to them or vendor 'em, because, really, I have better things to do than hang around in trade channels. Which is sort of a shame, but eh, whatever.

I never traded much at all in MMOs until user stores in games like DAOC popped up. I want to shop in game like I do in real life--via Amazon! Point, click, gimme.

No, you can get to level 70 and farm piety with a slow, heavy life leech unfun spec, but you wont get into worthy maps.

For me, D3 auction house wasn't that bad tbh.

It just simplified things. Most people complained that the RMAH allowed players to Pay to win, and i Agree.

In my opinion, i would prefer some built in trading system like the auction house. I loved the non RMAH as I could sell the gear i don't want and buy the gear i do want without too much hassle.

To a new player this will also allow them to prevent being robbed of the item that they found which may have turned out to be extremely valuable.

Not everyone hated the D3 auction house.

Got to the so called end game called maps. Tried to see what it brings, but it just random mods on a specific title set mixed in with some monsters and 1 or 2 bosses (depending on your maps rolls). It does not offer anything expect keeping you busy grinding some mobs. Played self found, have not bother with trading. Maybe that's why i haven't logged in for a week now.

PoE is fun playing and testing some build, but you hit a steep point around lvl 80 were everything grinds to a halt in terms of progressing in the game. You either then have 2 choices:

Trade or grind.

Pick your poison. I decided to go with my MMO tactic, play something else, wait for new content.

"

pantherios wrote:

Got to the so called end game called maps. Tried to see what it brings, but it just random mods on a specific title set mixed in with some monsters and 1 or 2 bosses (depending on your maps rolls). It does not offer anything expect keeping you busy grinding some mobs. Played self found, have not bother with trading. Maybe that's why i haven't logged in for a week now.

PoE is fun playing and testing some build, but you hit a steep point around lvl 80 were everything grinds to a halt in terms of progressing in the game. You either then have 2 choices:

Trade or grind.

Pick your poison. I decided to go with my MMO tactic, play something else, wait for new content.

This is a ARPG/Hack-And-Slash games, it's meant to get slow and the point of this game is....grinding. IF you dont like that aspect of the game then maybe this game isn't for you.

"

KopaKabana wrote:

No, you can get to level 70 and farm piety with a slow, heavy life leech unfun spec, but you wont get into worthy maps.

My Scion is about to hit 77, and she uses entirely self-found and self-crafted equipment. It is a physical Spectral Throw build that is both fun and fast, and it was at no point slow or boring. I also have a summoner witch who is 74 and also entirely self-found. I had some painful stretches with her, especially in normal, but she too can do low and mid level maps (I haven't tried high level maps.)

You're the guy who said before that you die a lot when trying to get to Piety. I feel that the issue is your build or your understanding of the game mechanics. (If I remember correctly, you had almost no +life on your gear.) There is no offense intended here, but I feel that you -- and others like you -- are too quick to find fault with the game instead of asking themselves, "What could I do to improve my character? Am I doing something wrong?".

But self-critical thinking isn't encouraged by society, so I guess that isn't unusual.

Lots of us play entirely self found. You wont make it by playing a single character all the way through merciless. I'm playing 7 HC, self found, bind on equip, no character over 5 levels over the lowest (a pretty strict ruleset). I'm going to make it through cruel with all 7 some day and piss around in Merciless. I probably will never make it through it though.

We set our own goals and our own rules.

Trading. Once you trade, expect to never find anything comparable by drops or crafting. It's too easy to pick your item out of millions simply by shopping. Even a mediocre trade will trump all the drops you're likely to see in a week's farming. That's not a function of drop rates or crafting RNG... it's just the reality of trading in any game. You trade for something you think is best. You get it. And the game gets easy. Much too easy for me.

i for one kept going without trading until i found a few things then sold those things and now im sitting on a few exalts and i dont want to buy anything for a coupple good reasons of my own.

see i´ve played a lot of diabloesque games and the moment you cave in and simply pay2win the game becomes less and less entertaining.
there is no excitement and fun involved anymore once you´ve almost perfect very good items in every slot.
you don´t really play for much by then.
you either start to trade even more and harder trying to make a bit of profit here and there to get closer and closer to your own perfection.

OR

you play yolofound nonstop , you sell what you cant use to others for a reasonable price maybe even inform yourself before you sell something for too high or too low so you dont have to spam trade for hours or even worse days.

see i had a 5link kaoms 213% primacy i tried selling for 5ex
ive gotten these offers.
"i dont have much my sire im only a humble player but i can offer you these few orbs and some 1chaos uniques"
it broke my heart but i had to tell these people "no sorry this is a 5link unique 2h axe i expect around at least 5exalts"
days came by and these people popped up more and more.
which ultimately when my patience ran out (because im not going to sit on something i already have 6linked like a black dragon on his goldpile) someone came around who offered me a bunch of regrets , cartographers chisels , alchemies , some chaos regals a meginords and i said to myself "fuck it" so i gave it to him for around 3-4 exalts more or less lower then intended.

now this story might have no relevance to yall but in the end you just have to be patient , keep on farming and dont even look at mirrored 2h axes maces swords or armors.
you know where those things come from which you actually want and go "damn thats fucking awesome?" they come from MONTHS of grinding of multiple people putting shit together to gamble on an ultimate piece of gear.

im 83 by now and ive found the following things
2 exalted orbs - i bought 2 andvariuses with them from a guildy (thanks again if you happen to read this - you know who you are)
this has allowed me to grind piety and dominus with more rares and more uniques over time.
ive gotten to a point where i started to get pissed off at loot.
i had nothing to show for.
literally nothing besides my 2 IIR rings
until one day i walked over a kaoms primacy , i was filled with joy because i needed a new weapon AND i was getting bored of maces so the axe was mighty fine.
i managed to 6sock and 6link it in under redicoulus conditions (5jewelers 65fuses) which is pretty much winning the lottery in PoE.
this has allowed me to snowball and faceroll most content so hard that it kept me playing.

i´ve found a deaths oath , the new daressos defiance thingy i then traded for a BoR.
i sold fuses for exalts
i did this and that but i´ve yet to buy myself something expensive and i prolly wont for a long time.
why ?
its simple most people are delusional and want 10-20exalts for a rare that i almost vendor on a daily basis because its just not good enough anymore.
trires boots gloves ? is magically exalted orbs in peoples eyes.
a 5-6linked weapon or armor of any kind ? exalts ofcourse

while ive no problems with it because i could afford this or that by now after only "grinding" for a month the core of this game is to keep yourself motivated wether it is rolling a new char with items you found or respeccing something , playing with friends whatever.

you can do it , it just takes gargantuan time and if you do not want / have that time=effort mindset for PoE then i highly suggest you and everyone else that doesn´t want to / can´t trade not to care or to play something else when the game starts bugging you out more then it empowers you with endorphines.






>>>>>>>>TL;DR version<<<<<<<<<<
dont trade its not neccesary the game is coded that way that after a certain ammount of time farming dominus piety maps you get a bigger fish then usual all you need is patience and farm farm farm farm farm