A somewhat new player's review of Path of VexOhmIstDol
" Thorns are natural to roses, and only mutant chimera roses don't have thorns. “One only understands the things that one tames,” said the fox. “Men have no more time to understand anything. Some would be PoE players stop to tame the roses. Others only see thorny flowers and spend their unsatisfied time slashing what they see as weeds. Waltz into act 3 and there's a good chance you will end up as a hat. "The only legitimate use of a computer is to play games." - Eugene Jarvis
PoE Origins - Piety's story http://www.pathofexile.com/forum/view-thread/2081910 |
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Lot's of interesting debate here. But as a long time D2 (and D1 player) and PoE since 2011, I'm very, very sure that I personally have got an enormous amount more pleasure and sustainable enjoyment out of PoE than I ever did out of D1 or D2.
I can't speak for others and what makes them tic, so I won't try to. Petrov. |
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" Of course it's not epic, but it's a fairly long track through time until we get to something with at least half the effort invested into TLR. Personal tastes aside, most agree there are two basic types of game music: background music in original sense and mood enhancement. TLR soundtrack would mostly fit into first group and PoE would feel more at home in second. Soundtrack from the first one is defined as good if you notice it, it doesn't get annoying after a while and you can still remember it a year later. Soundtrack from the second category is good if the same part of the game feels considerably worse without it. The trouble is, I'm often playing without sound and only some areas feel much worse like that, for example riverways. So, I could pretty much agree the soundtrack could be better, some good music can make a hard encounter much more memorable and bosses here just lack that. A simple change of tune to something livelier at map bosses would feel nice, and also when you encounter a rogue exile, it's sometimes hard to notice those. Wish the armchair developers would go back to developing armchairs. ◄[www.moddb.com/mods/balancedux]► ◄[www.moddb.com/mods/one-vision1]► Last edited by raics#7540 on Dec 12, 2013, 11:03:19 AM
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" While some of the posts in this thread are extensive, you really should spend some time reading through. This thread so far has lots of constructive feedback and posts like yours just take away from the merit of the thread. I also wanted to comment on two other things which are difficulty and D2. The comparisons by the OP were with D2: LOD. Now I know lots of people preferred LoD but personally, Vanilla D2 was better. LoD provided a bigger variety of abilities/options etc but at the same time reduced the depth of the game imo. If the comparisons were between PoE and vanilla it would be a bit more comparable. Anyways... If you think back to D2, after you've played through a few times you could speed level like it was nothing. zzzzzzzzzzz. Some people like that aspect, they see it as a positive. If that were to be introduced into PoE it would be awful. Currency being one of the main pitfalls. I don't have time to expand fully but things like speed levelling (D2-style) only work because the game had currency (gold) and crafting mats. PoE ofcourse has them hand-in-hand. Just for try for see and for know -2013!
She corpse exploded the corpse of the boss... |
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Wow. Well, this thread went good places =).
Regarding Last Remnant: I agree that most of the best themes were significantly into the game (final boss music, Press to Victory, Melphina, Nagapur), however, some were pretty amazing early on (struggle eternal, gates of hell--you first hear it upon fighting the first idol, Athlum). On 5-links: I suppose I can try and find gear that will have lifeleech on it, such as my current carnage heart, but that -25% life is painful, but realistically, I'd like to have a 5L for LA->LMP->pierce (with pierce gem it's around 95%--passive is only 35%)->blood magic ->LGoH. If I had a 6L, it'd be even more amazing since I'd put in a Power Charge on Crit right into lightning arrow rather than think about having to get a separate item to hold ice spear->PCoC, and maybe trade for another cwdt. Also, yeah, I suppose D2 had its own latency issues, except, well, it's ten years later. I'm not sure if D3 has latency issues, or TL2, or any other ARPG of this generation, but for a company that wants to be mentioned in the same breath as D3 and TL2 rather than "hey check out this decent indie game but keep in mind it's an indie game", this is a case of "get your act together". That stated, the whole idea of "did you use uber rune words? Yes? You didn't play self found" to me, is a bit silly. I used meteorb sorceresses exactly because they were relatively easy to get the gear for, and even when not-geared, could clear a fair portion of the game fairly easily. Also, the reason I ask about "Insight" was that Insight didn't go on the character. It went on a merc. So if you were playing a fire/cold sorceress, that merc provided a third source of damage for dual-immunities (possibly an ancient, possibly Lister, always the countess). Spirit was not only cheap to assemble, but was also absolutely amazing for the cost. Especially the shield. And regarding crafting: the entire point was to get guaranteed solid mods. Unfortunately, D2's system was undertuned for weapons, but for gloves, amulets, boots, possibly belts and rings, it was terrific. I don't understand why we can't have a crafting system that would allow most people to be happy. Honestly, I don't understand the whole "you shouldn't be able to get BIS in no time flat!" strawman attitudes that so many of the "elite" players have. Nobody is asking for instant BIS. The request is to be able to get a half-decent upgrade per day or two of playing. I don't think that's unreasonable. |
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That half decent upgrade every day is impossible. At some point there won't be any upgrades. It's called a gear curve for a reason. Eventually, it turns to an almost flat line.
And what is considered a day or two. 2 to 4 hours? 8 to 16? |
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" What I don't understand is that the main complaint about the gear progression compared to D2 is horridly slanted when I try to defend it as it isn't as bad as people put it. Main reason why D2 felt that it had more item progression is that it has a metric shit ton more items to find as well as ways to increase your power that PoE doesn't have outside of just items. You could find jewels, runewords and had a merc to help you and so on. If your going to compare the merit of finding items vs items of D2 vs PoE they are exactly the same. PoE is missing early game sets, early game runewords and so on, It has an extreme lack of content by time/being a younger game as oppose to design choice. Why do you think every week they release a new skill and 3-4 new items? You can still beat the game in very cheap gear, there are builds on the forum that allow you to beat the game in self-found/vendor gear only like the 2h ground slam marauder. Some more builds even open up to have an easier time in the 1-3 chaos per item range. This accusation of comparing it to D3 or that the drop rates are bad is unfair because it wasn't like d3 were they messed up the itemization and made it boring/terrible were they are obviously trying to add much content every patch. Like I said too many people complain about how it's "not" like D2 as oppose to taking ideas from D2 that would make path of exile better. Increased drop rates does not fix the problem when you hit the act 3 merc gearwall because there is almost literally nothing better other then map gear or high end double/3x resist high hp gear. Last edited by RagnarokChu#4426 on Dec 12, 2013, 3:47:48 PM
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My wife and I have played three characters to ~70 (a3m, early maps) self found with the exception of several key off-class gem purchases (reduced mana, auras), and 4 leveling weapons, all of which were replaced by self found in the 50s or 60s.
Did this in OB, then in Anarchy, and now again in Domination. In each case we stopped playing them not due to difficulty (all were smashing well, in our opinion), but because the new league started. Never understood the difficulty some people seem to have with playing self-found. We definitely craft "as we go". As someone else mentioned, if you find some particular mod critical for your build, but you are still wearing an item half your level, its not that many alteration orbs to roll that mod yourself. More typically for us, if we find a 4l white item with a level dramatically higher than what we're using, it gets an alch. A non-negligible amount of the time we get a solid upgrade. And it does seem like GGG is moving towards a more controlled "good mod" craft system: see the recipe for movement speed on boots, and the very new one for X-Y <type> damage on weapons. I have yet to use either, but it is nice to know they are there. A lot of the self found curve being "right" requires adaptation, both through holding good gear in reserve and crafting new as needed, and by understanding game mechanics. Play another character or two up. The fact that you do not "understand" how ES builds would even work does say something about your true experience with the game. You may well find things different when everything isn't new and opaque. |
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The reason that the criticisms of "you don't have as many items as D2" is that, well...
D2 came out. Its ideas were good. In academic research, you don't just ignore a key paper. If you want to create a next generation game, then shouldn't the ideas of the previous one at least be prerequisites in some way? |
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" Your speaking for other people when it shouldn't be, I retried playing D2 a year ago, and I played TL2 like 6 months ago, I can say definitely 100% that the progression in PoE sucks when compared to those games, and I have outlined reasons why " That and sockets/links (you can't use items in PoE straight away due to you have to blow currency on them so they have the right socket/fuse combination) + larger mod pool + more necessary stats (endgame you basically need life or ES on all of your gear, again this is unique to PoE due to a lot of mechanics punishing you more for having low life), completely nondeterministic progression At the end of the day, there are like 10+ things in PoE which make progression harder in PoE, and although some of those things may be small, all of those things stack with eachother. If it was just one thing it wouldn't be an issue, and although you list some things below, there are many more which you are ignoring " PoE should stop releasing so many skills and actually looking at improving the core experience of their game " D3 obviously had its own problems, the difference is that at least admitted and realized their problems, where as it appears that Chris lives in a delusional bubble regarding PoE's issues, and then we have this whole white knighting fanboy brigade that defend PoE at all costs because it has the "hardcore" label and because GGG called it D2's "spiritual sucessor" " The people who claim this game is like D2 are being delusional, its just a facade. The main critical difference of course, between D2 and PoE, is that D2 was never designed, or balanced, around any economy, which allowed the developers of the game (same guys who made TL/TL2) to fine tune the game for self found progression very well. Arguably the reason why D2 was so popular is it was the only real aRPG that got this formula for self found progression right. If the progression is too fast, people get bored fast, and if its too slow, it starts exhibiting the same issue that Korean MMO's exhibit. The thing is, its not really possible to balance a game around an economy and self found progression, you have to do one or the other, else you get a game which is a weird hybrid between MMO and aRPG which just brings out the worst of both worlds. And the only aRPG's with this problem currently are, PoE and D3 (until RoS). |
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