Fix Raise Spectres disappearing when logging out

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elitedesolator wrote:

I don't know how recruiting is done where you are, but frankly if a programmer cannot explain what their programs do in a layman fashion, he or she should not be considered as a viable candidate.

This is the most idiotic post I have seen in a while, and considering this is the internet and I have been on youtube recently, that says A LOT. Mark gave a very thorough explanation that even an 8 year old could understand and that aside he is programmer, not a goddamned teacher.

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elitedesolator wrote:

You're guessing just as much as I am and somehow my logic and thinking should be discredited, just because I am not educated as a computer science major?

I don't know how recruiting is done where you are, but frankly if a programmer cannot explain what their programs do in a layman fashion, he or she should not be considered as a viable candidate.

Everyone except GGG are just guessing, and your original point was a valid question, and sometimes a programmer will get a question like that, look at the code and go "huh, I guess I could do that".

However, from GGG's response I don't think that is the case here, they have already stated that "Raise spectre would need an entirely new system, because it stores completely different information." and there is absolutely no reason to believe this to be untrue.

So let's just let them have the point on their list of wanted features and hope it bubbles to the top at some point.

considering that zombies themselves aren't even stored as character attributes, could definitely see how spectres are even more complicated. OP got a good answer, now needs to stop trolling and go do some learning.

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Asmosis wrote:

considering that zombies themselves aren't even stored as character attributes, could definitely see how spectres are even more complicated. OP got a good answer, now needs to stop trolling and go do some learning.

The one who is apparently "trolling and should do some learning" is elitedesolator, not me. I am the OP and all my posts have been directed to Mark from GGG so far...

On to the point: Zombies and spectres were created as temporary creatures, not because it was "complicated" to do so, but because that's how they were designed. If they had meant them to be permanent, they would have made them permanent when creating the skills. However, it just so happens that they didn't, and that people want it now.

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cryptc wrote:

Everyone except GGG are just guessing, and your original point was a valid question, and sometimes a programmer will get a question like that, look at the code and go "huh, I guess I could do that".

Really? Can people stop mistaking me for elitedesolator already?

But you're right.

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DirkAustin wrote:

I rather summon my monsters again than have them already when i login. I would feel even lazier than i already am with my summoner.

You people are just too lazy to go to the solaris temple and grab your OP sentinel spectres.

And not fixing the issue makes them less lazy than me? I don't believe so. The difference here is that numerous threads have been created about this issue, and will continue popping until they fix it. My previous thread on the matter of summoner problems was huge, my posts in the thread were huge and I got pages of replies and I replied further. I'm not exactly the lazy type.

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Khazrad wrote:

Fact is: We don't know the implementation behind this. If Mark says 'it's not that easy because our storage design doesn't allow it at the moment' - then that's how it is.

It doesn't help anyone to drop semi-educated knowledge bombs like 'just use the code for eternal orbs and imprint the current spectres into the gem'.

Although programmers are very knowledgeable and experienced in their domain and it would be impossible for a non-programmer to understand what they do is even about, sometimes, an input coming from a "fresh" mind can't hurt, and could reveal things that would seem obvious to an outside observant, such as us, but aren't to someone so deeply involved into the technical procedures of something as deep as programming, such as them.

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ciknay wrote:

From what I can gather, specters base themselves off a temporary mob, instead of anything carried on the player. Hence when the game closes, the data is cleared from the RAM.

Yes, I believe this is what we can conclude from what Mark said. However, this doesn't mean it is the end of it. I will simply add the sentence "But this can be altered by changing how the system works" at the end of yours, and we got a nice little thing going on. :)

Of course it requires some work.

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Although programmers are very knowledgeable and experienced in their domain and it would be impossible for a non-programmer to understand what they do is even about, sometimes, an input coming from a "fresh" mind can't hurt, and could reveal things that would seem obvious to an outside observant, such as us, but aren't to someone so deeply involved into the technical procedures of something as deep as programming, such as them.

User input is valuable when it comes to identifying the purpose of software (ie., requirements/problem analysis) however musings on the implementation details (such as this thread seems to be dominated by) is really not useful and serves mainly in the interest of the users to provide fodder to argue over.

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Emjayen wrote:

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Although programmers are very knowledgeable and experienced in their domain and it would be impossible for a non-programmer to understand what they do is even about, sometimes, an input coming from a "fresh" mind can't hurt, and could reveal things that would seem obvious to an outside observant, such as us, but aren't to someone so deeply involved into the technical procedures of something as deep as programming, such as them.

User input is valuable when it comes to identifying the purpose of software (ie., requirements/problem analysis) however musings on the implementation details (such as this thread seems to be dominated by) is really not useful and serves mainly in the interest of the users to provide fodder to argue over.

They're called suggestions, ideas. Developers aren't gods by the way, they're human, they can overlook things/not think about something.

No one has been trying to remake the code here...

The Big Question is though, What is it time for?

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elitedesolator wrote:

Also in terms of the piggyback issue isn't there already a system that you can potentially draw information from?

No. You aren't understanding what Mark stated.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

We already store items between sessions (in inventories) and Animate Guardian can piggyback on that because items are what it needs to store.

Imagine you had a second character sheet, and the items placed into those slots were the items used by Animate Guardian. From a database standpoint, it is probably not too dissimilar to how your equipped items are handled. Since the inventory systems already save the items in them, then the Guardian can persist between sessions.

Since monsters do not exist as inventory, they cannot be piggybacked in the same way.

Hopefully that explains the issue a little more clearly.

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Daxtreme wrote:

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cryptc wrote:

Everyone except GGG are just guessing, and your original point was a valid question, and sometimes a programmer will get a question like that, look at the code and go "huh, I guess I could do that".

Really? Can people stop mistaking me for elitedesolator already?

But you're right.

I meant his original question, not yours "Now I'm not a computer science major or anything, but why would it be difficult to set up a "system" that tells your system to store one line of coding designating the monster you have as a spectre?", sorry that I was unclear, thought it would look messier if I started quoting several different posts.

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Mark_GGG wrote:

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Daxtreme wrote:

So now, no one can say that the code "isn't there" and that they should concentrate their energies on working on something else, because it's there, Animate Guardian works that way, so it requires only a very simple translation of properties.

This is not correct. Raise spectre would need an entirely new system, because it stores completely different information. We already store items between sessions (in inventories) and Animate Guardian can piggyback on that because items are what it needs to store. It also relies on the fact you can only ever have one guardian. That same code cannot be used for spectres.

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Daxtreme wrote:

It's a very simple fix really

It really isn't.

It's something we'd like to be able to do eventually. But saying that because one minion can store information we already store by using the existing system means that we already can, or could simply add, storing of completely different information (multiple times over), of a type of which we currently have no system for storing, is incorrect.

Just as an idea:

How about hijacking this inventory piggyback system to store Spectres? Basically, create a translation table between Spectre stats and an item. So for instance, a Drowned from Twilight Strands maps to a Rusted Blade, and the Increased Physical Dmg mod maps to HP, or something like that. Then when the player logs back on, it'll just translate that back into the Spectre.