PoE vs Diablo 2 - Why D2 is still better

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tikitaki wrote:

Don't selectively quote, and comparing CoD to D2 pretty much invalidates your argument and makes you look very very silly.

I didn't quote selectively, your thought ended after that one sentence. And I didn't compare CoD to D2, I just used your argument on another game to show you that it's flawed :)

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tikitaki wrote:

The developers of PoE themselves probably love the shit out of D2...There's tons of similarities. The idea of socketed items, the dark art style, the core gameplay....All of this came pretty much primarily from the Diablo franchise and D2 was the creme de la creme.

Without D2, PoE would not even exist, so it's hard for me to take you very seriously.

So, to reword your argument, some people love D2 and it's in some ways similar to PoE, that's why it's superior to it? That makes zero sense, you just aren't very good at pointing out why exactly D2 is better than PoE. Your arguments so far were basically 'yeah I played it for 6 years and it's very popular so it must be better than PoE'.

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tikitaki wrote:

Well at least they have something. They don't seem to be doing a very good job of following it though. Like I said, PoE was actually MORE balanced when I first started playing.

It's regressing.

Some people started when PoE only had one act and a handful of skills. Of course it was easier to balance back then :) Btw you still haven't said anything specific about PoE's balance. 'It's bad' and 'D2 balance is infinitely better' don't count as arguments :)

I said plenty of things about PoE's balance.

Namely, the balance between Life and ES has never been good....Right now it's never been more skewed, with ES builds being the "master race."

Heck, you can get a 650 ES chest for fairly cheap. Not only does it have 65% of the "life" of a Kaoms, but probably about 5% of the cost.

Evasion is still AWFUL. It's very easy to get "pigeonholed" into certain builds in PoE because once you start on a certain track the passive tree often forces you down certain paths to get whatever mandatory survivability you need.

Doing a bow build with life? Bettter head towards all the life nodes.

D2 kept the core survivability separate from the skill tree, thus opening up huge doors for build diversity.

In fact, what most people don't even realize about PoE is that the passive tree is not even your "skill tree" in that that's not where you get skills from.

Your skill tree is actually socketed items, with the more linked sockets correlating to the depth of how far you have gone down the skill tree. Linking gems together unlocks higher "tiers" of your base skill (Eg LA -> LMP -> Chain -> etc).

In PoE it's intertwined and limiting because the survivability passives are so mandatory that you have to far out of your way to get enough of them to "function," with whole certain sets of them being useless (stacking evasion without IR) or if not useless -- horrible compared to competing stats.

You need to get passives that emphasize the skills you want to use while stacking the shit out of life or ES, then either armor or evasion if you have IR...

Haven't launched the game in days because everything else is more interesting and entertaining.

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CharanJaydemyr wrote:

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fr0st2k wrote:

1. In D2, you could 'rush' a char from 1 to 70 in just a few hours and start MFing

If that makes a game better, then I'm very glad PoE is 'worse'.

Agreed 100%

The OP is wrong.

Here's a list of real reasons why D2 'was' better. D2 is currently worse, the patch that brought enigmas and synergies pretty much ruined D2.



Anyways... D2.

1.) Classes where unique when it came to skills. In POE the only thing different is the starting point of the passive trees.

2.) FFA pvp.. Any time, any place and any where.

3. Vocal emotes.

And that's pretty much it.

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Vooodu wrote:

The OP is wrong.

Here's a list of real reasons why D2 'was' better. D2 is currently worse, the patch that brought enigmas and synergies pretty much ruined D2.



Anyways... D2.

1.) Classes where unique when it came to skills. In POE the only thing different is the starting point of the passive trees.

2.) FFA pvp.. Any time, any place and any where.

3. Vocal emotes.

And that's pretty much it.

I agree with this guys list, however i do feel like the uniques in poe are risky thing to use because most of them have a "sacrifice" if you will... and OP.. regarding leveling, it is possible to rush like in D2 :) not as fast though.. but definitely faster then normal playthrough

Hi frost2k,

why do you think that YOU have completely figured out what makes THE great arpg?

...humans are very different, and the purpose of the developers should be to make the game - on average - the most fun to the majority of people. That means that inevtiably some people - like you - will be unhappy. The nostalgics who always loved d2 will always love d2.

In my opinion POE is way better, the uniques are more interesting, the gameplay is more complex, every single fucking aspect. Not much more to say about it.

Bye

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tikitaki wrote:

I said plenty of things about PoE's balance.

Namely, the balance between Life and ES has never been good....Right now it's never been more skewed, with ES builds being the "master race."

Heck, you can get a 650 ES chest for fairly cheap. Not only does it have 65% of the "life" of a Kaoms, but probably about 5% of the cost.

Evasion is still AWFUL. It's very easy to get "pigeonholed" into certain builds in PoE because once you start on a certain track the passive tree often forces you down certain paths to get whatever mandatory survivability you need.

Doing a bow build with life? Bettter head towards all the life nodes.

D2 kept the core survivability separate from the skill tree, thus opening up huge doors for build diversity.

In fact, what most people don't even realize about PoE is that the passive tree is not even your "skill tree" in that that's not where you get skills from.

Your skill tree is actually socketed items, with the more linked sockets correlating to the depth of how far you have gone down the skill tree. Linking gems together unlocks higher "tiers" of your base skill (Eg LA -> LMP -> Chain -> etc).

In PoE it's intertwined and limiting because the survivability passives are so mandatory that you have to far out of your way to get enough of them to "function," with whole certain sets of them being useless (stacking evasion without IR) or if not useless -- horrible compared to competing stats.

You need to get passives that emphasize the skills you want to use while stacking the shit out of life or ES, then either armor or evasion if you have IR...

I think the main thing that is 'limiting' in PoE is its difficulty. GGG could nerf everything and you'd have your D2 balance. Imo that'd be boring though. It's also quite fun to try non-cookie cutter builds and make them viable :)

P.S: D2 also had its pigeonhole builds, Hammerdin anyone?

Major problem I have with Path of Exile

-=-=-=-=-=-=- Currency/orbs and rng -=-=-=-=-=-=-

In PoE you can find all currency from start. You have to bee extremely lucky to find high one, and then you wont use it, but trade for other currency you need. Because of this, drop rates are really low.

Lets go further in this. By hitting higher level, you want to make 5-Link to slay monsters with banana on your face, but no. Having higher level than zone, you get less, and less orbs, and further on you can't farm better places, because you are too weak. You weren't lucky, and with low currency can't do any 5-L or even 4-L. One thing left, just pretend, bad didn't happened. Join any party, and simulate, that you do some damage ;-) This is not funny anymore.

Everybody have different luck, but when you find X Exalt, you're proud, fell like a baron. Doesn't mater if you want sox or links, you can burn everything, and be looser. By burning currency you're helping economy. This is not funny anymore.

In my opinion currency is equivalent of luck. Currency isn't the measurement of rich, but luck. It's my main problem with Path of Exile.

For example in Diablo II, when you found Jah rune, or any other, You could not lose it by been unlucky further more, drop rates were always the same for monsters.

Well wait, some one will bash me right now “gold in D2 is usles”, “pgms are usles” etc...
Don't forget, Everything in D2 is valuable. Starting from gold, ending on perfect crafts. Describing all relationship will make this topic endless. In Path of Exile I don't know, if those 3000 fusings is enough? Probability to make 6-L with first fuse is same, as with 3000th. This system is unrewarding, and is not funny anymore.

-=-=-=-=-=-=- D2 have no desyc ;p
Looks like this game is not for me :P, but hell, can't wait to see full exile on run.

OP is right, game should be first easy to level, then horrible hard.
..............
Oh damn, if D3 would have everything from D2+ new ideas, like endless dungeon or maping...
Dreams

Everything OP said is exactly what I hated about Diablo 2.

Don't get me wrong I still love Diablo 2 (at least before Blizzard ruined it). I wish I could take the Druid and Necromancer from that game and implement them in this game. I'm halfway tempted to say the same about the Assassin. The storyline was solid and you actually cared what was going to happen next. The animations were beautiful and each built had a unique feel. All of these things are lacking in Path of Exile which I won't drum on too much because it IS in beta and the developers ARE aware of a lot of the issues that players are having.

With that said, I feel like the gaming experience in Diablo 2 was flawed. What ruined Diablo 2 was the horrible meta game. No one actually played the game. Beating the game was easy. Nothing was really hard. Leveling was laughably easy. What was hard though was finding useful items. The uniques rendered every other item in the game worthless. Rares were pointless to pick up and only certain magic items were worth something. So if you were new to the game you either got lucky with someone gracing you with good items to start out with or you spent months trying to break into mainstream game play.

So here you were building a character to get the extremely hard to find items so that you were able to trade to get what you needed to create a character that served no point outside of pvp and more magic find because no one gave a damn about the actual game. If you DID play through people thought you were retarded.