Path of Exile 1 Gameplay Help and Discussion - Looting -- The official thread for discussing the loot system. Updated 18th March, 2013. - Forum

" TremorAcePV wrote: They don't deserve to complain about "their" loot being stolen, because it is not "their" loot until they pick it up. Then it can't be stolen. They can complain if they don't like the system. Hence this mega long thread and a zillion others like it. The intentions of the system doesn't make it a good system or something that people can not like or not critique. " TremorAcePV wrote: The intent of the timer has everything to do with it. Because it wasn't intended for players to get the loot that has their name on it, it's not their loot. So them complaining about not getting it when it's not there's is not acceptable. This is a fact. Not my opinion. People can complain that the system is confusing and doesn't make much sense. Anyone could have seen this coming that people will feel like the item is meant for them because it has their name on it. That was obvious. Its not acceptable to you, so what. People complain that they don't want to compete in public games and they don't see a reason why they should be forced to compete. They can complain about that if they want. Get over it. If it wasn't acceptable to complain about it then this thread wouldn't exist. This isn't your forum to dictate what people can say or not say about the system. BTW every skill gem or passive on the tree was INTENDED by the devs, that doesn't mean it will stay forever and isn't subject to change. " TremorAcePV wrote: If I complained to everyone that I wasn't the number one player on PoE because the game wasn't set up for me to win no matter what, would you say it's acceptable for me to complain about that? Or would you say it's not acceptable? That's taking what everyone is doing to an extreme, but it's the equivalent, if only magnified. And it's sad. That is seriously a horrible comparison. I shouldn't even have to explain why. " TremorAcePV wrote: They have no right to complain about their loot being stolen when it's not their loot. And by this, they have no right to complain about the loot system. Your opinion. There's plenty of great reasons for people to complain about this system. " TremorAcePV wrote: I didn't say it didn't. But to ignore everything else as if it doesn't matter (XP and the like), would be wrong. They get plenty of reward for participating. They have whites. If they get "nothing" as you say, then that's their own fault. Especially with whites being everywhere all the time. Why do people keep saying this? Your acting like the system is fair. Its not fair by a long shot. Its slanted towards certain classes, playstyles, computer performance, placement of the drops, lag, etc etc People miss out on loot AT NO FAULT OF THEIR OWN all of the time. But you can believe what you want to believe. " TremorAcePV wrote: Fun Fact: The easiest way to get good loot for your build is to trade for it. You don't particularly need to farm for it to get it. lol. Everyone can just accept not getting anything good in game, JUST trade for it!!!!! LOL " TremorAcePV wrote: It is fair. Then the player who got XP can go solo loot farm on their own now that they are higher leveled and strong enough to do so. Perfectly fair. That player who gets little to nothing now no longer wants to play in public games. Thats a problem. Standard Forever	Posted by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 12:54:54 AM Quote this Post
" iamstryker wrote: Spoiler " Jackel6672 wrote: That's where were different, by contributing you don't deserve loot. You are not entitled to loot. You pick up loot along with your fellow players, and if you don't get any that's no ones fault but your own. This game is not consistent in its execution. It is not just a competitive pvp only type of game. Its not an MMO where all players can always influence your game. It doesn't make a lot of sense that you can play single player and get all of the rewards for your efforts and then jump into public games and receive little to none. Its confusing to the playerbase to be like this. Either go all out cutthroat or provide options for different playstyles. Makes a lot more sense. I think all players should feel entitled to loot. I don't think it makes sense to tell a player that to go solo or only play with friends in order to not have to deal with loot competition. " Jackel6672 wrote: If you refuse to adapt to the game and quickly get stuff with your name on it, then you will not get drops. (especially if you won't pick up things with another's name on it.) Your still acting like people only lose loot when they don't immediately try to pick it up. This is not true at all. Your last statement there encourages people to not cooperate with eachother. I feel thats a downfall of public games. " Jackel6672 wrote: Its not the games fault you will not adapt to the style of game you are playing. This game as a whole does not have the style your acting like it has. Only one part of it "public games" is forcing this mechanic on the playerbase. Don't refer to the game in this way because this game is not competitive pvp only. Its just not. They are working on it. I would expect us to eventually be able to raid other player's instances and kill them for their gear. That'd be fun. I'd assume it would have normal PvP rules and dying in Hardcore wouldn't matter for it. "I think all players should be entitled to loot." You said players should be entitled. At all. That's not good. It never will be. Call this opinion if you want, but you don't know what that will cause. I do. It's not good. That's not true because of desync. This will be fixed eventually. Your complaint is irrelevant because of this. You want a game that's all nice and easy. I get it. But this isn't that game. It's not meant to be. Trying to change it will be bad for PoE because changing something to be what it was never meant to be can only hurt it. "this game is not competitive pvp only." True. However, public games are. They are supposed to be to an extent. But we are getting back into the usual points of arguement. I'm not interested in that. Edit: Read the post above this. You understand nothing. I'm done talking to you. You want this game to be something it's not. You are the poison. I can only hope GGG won't drink you. (metaphor) Last edited by TremorAcePV#7356 on Feb 27, 2013, 12:59:45 AM	Posted by TremorAcePV#7356 on Feb 27, 2013, 12:57:29 AM Quote this Post
Spoiler " There may be other reasons for favoring a FFA system over an instanced one, but this melee and ranged, risk vs. reward thing isn't one of them. I've already gone over this several times in my previous posts, but let's be even more explicit here. What you're arguing is that because someone needs to attack mobs in close range, they are playing a more dangerous build or style and so should be rewarded for it via items. First of all, just because someone is melee or closer to the enemy doesn't automatically mean that they are in greater risk of dying compared to a ranged. This is blatently obvious and it's easy to think up several examples. A glass cannon and a tank when fighting a group of flicker strike mobs. A glass cannon and a tank when fighting a group of piercing multi-projectile archers. Melee and close range characters by their very nature are built tankier. Sure, proximity to mobs does have something to do with risk but you're vastly oversimplifying things. It's not as obvious as you make it out to be. However, let's be generous and assume that what you say is completely true, melee/close ranged characters automatically take much more risk to play. Except that it still doesn't follow that they should get more loot. Someone decides that they want to go run around naked and start punching monsters. Is he melee? Yes. Is he taking a huge amount of risk? Yes. Is he entitled to more items through the ingame loot system? I don't think so. Yet as of right now, the system clearly benefits players like him who do little to nothing in contributing to groups except looting everything in sight. Nothing to do with fairness. You mentioned previously to kick players like that. Except that you're once again vastly oversimplifying things. It's nearly impossible to tell what's going on in most groups. There isn't some easy DPS meter next to each player's portrait. The ninja could very well be the party leader. Bottom line, the kick system isn't meant to be a bad excuse of a fix for underlying problems in FFA. Now, let's say then that you add the qualifier that those risky melee guys aren't just standing around doing nothing and actually participating. Except once again, it still doesn't make sense to reward them with more items. Melee being too dangerous to play is a skill gem and/or passive tree problem. The logical thing to do here would be to buff the appropriate skill gems and/or passive tree nodes so that it isn't so dangerous. It has no relation at all to looting. To claim that their easier time in FFA is a solution for the fact that they may or may not be weaker than ranged is pretty dumb. No, what i'm pretty sure you're actually arguing for is that the only people who deserve loot are those who are willing to be cutthroat and competitive about it. I don't have a problem with this. The problem lies with the fact that you're trying to take some moral high ground with vague statements about risk vs. reward. If you like FFA loot because you like FFA, that's fine. But don't argue that it's fair when it has absolutely nothing to do with any reasonable measure for "fairness". I'll say this once again, leave in the current loot system but add in the option to group with instanced loot (you only see stuff that drops for you and can't interact with anyone else's items). Being closer to monsters means they are automatically closer to dying. Yes, there are anti ranged mobs. Doesn't change the fact that there are still more monsters per capita that are melee style or anti melee. The naked guy would die. I would purposely let him die if he was in my group, and then kick him. I would party chat everyone to let him die. Your example is bad. In these games melee is always at higher risk, and will always be. Ranged has to take risk to get loot, melee is already at risk when picking up loot. FFA lives up to its name, its completely fair. If you don't grab the item, someone else will. I said before this is the best implantation of this system I have seen, and I still stand by it. Ranged isn't entirely gimped loot wise. They have survivability, and chances to pick stuff up in this game. I see nothing to change about it. To the last paragraph, an option like that will remove FFA. Its not going to be implemented unless its somehow its own league. The two options cannot co-exist because the easier play style will always be chosen. "Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right!" Henry Ford	Posted by Jackel6672#4463 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:08:24 AM Quote this Post
" TremorAcePV wrote: They are working on it. I would expect us to eventually be able to raid other player's instances and kill them for their gear. That'd be fun. I'd assume it would have normal PvP rules and dying in Hardcore wouldn't matter for it. I think your way out of touch if you think this will EVER happen on default. I have not seen any hints from the devs that they would do this. Stuff like that is for the other leagues "cutthroat" which surprisingly enough is an OPTION. wow what a concept. " TremorAcePV wrote: "I think all players should be entitled to loot." You said players should be entitled. At all. That's not good. It never will be. Call this opinion if you want, but you don't know what that will cause. I do. It's not good. No idea what your trying to say here. I am comletely entitled in single player is there a problem with that? Diablo 3 had instanced in public games and that particular system worked fine. So I have no idea what your getting at. " TremorAcePV wrote: That's not true because of desync. This will be fixed eventually. Your complaint is irrelevant because of this. There will always be performances issues to some extent that isn't even the fault of the players computer. This is a big deal when the timers are only a few seconds. My complaint is relevant right now and I think it will be relevant for a very very long time if not the entire life of this game. " TremorAcePV wrote: You want a game that's all nice and easy. I get it. But this isn't that game. It's not meant to be. Trying to change it will be bad for PoE because changing something to be what it was never meant to be can only hurt it. No you definitely don't get it at all. Please see the same argument I have made a zillion times in this thread or go look at my position on other issues such as full respecs or death penalty. I don't want the game to be easy. I just don't want pvp to be a requirement to play in public games. Thats a huge difference. You don't get it. BTW there is nothing easier than camping near monsters to poach drops. I can do that but I don't think its fun at all. " TremorAcePV wrote: You understand nothing. I'm done talking to you. You want this game to be something it's not. You are the poison. I can only hope GGG won't drink you. (metaphor) You think way too highly of yourself. If your done talking then don't come back to this thread spouting the same nonsense (Not a metaphor). Standard Forever Last edited by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:10:28 AM	Posted by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:09:51 AM Quote this Post
" Jackel6672 wrote: FFA lives up to its name, its completely fair. That is seriously ridiculous. Nothing "fair" about it. Which I guess is exactly why GGG added the silly timers/names. Standard Forever	Posted by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:12:10 AM Quote this Post
Spoiler This game is not consistent in its execution. It is not just a competitive pvp only type of game. Its not an MMO where all players can always influence your game. It doesn't make a lot of sense that you can play single player and get all of the rewards for your efforts and then jump into public games and receive little to none. Its confusing to the playerbase to be like this. Either go all out cutthroat or provide options for different playstyles. Makes a lot more sense. I think all players should feel entitled to loot. I don't think it makes sense to tell a player that to go solo or only play with friends in order to not have to deal with loot competition. Your still acting like people only lose loot when they don't immediately try to pick it up. This is not true at all. Your last statement there encourages people to not cooperate with eachother. I feel thats a downfall of public games. This game as a whole does not have the style your acting like it has. Only one part of it "public games" is forcing this mechanic on the playerbase. Don't refer to the game in this way because this game is not competitive pvp only. Its just not. 1. Its constant. You get full drops by yourself, because you are by yourself. East enough. You receive little in pubs because you are not fast enough to get your timed drops. Camping is an issue, but instanced is not the solution. Also, you keep neglecting to mention that parties gain xp at a much faster rate, and get more drops overall. Its only confusing to those who don't adapt. If you don't "play to win" you will not get much, and that may just not be your cup of tea. So you play single player. Pubs are invigorating for me. "Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right!" Henry Ford	Posted by Jackel6672#4463 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:15:05 AM Quote this Post
" iamstryker wrote: " Jackel6672 wrote: FFA lives up to its name, its completely fair. That is seriously ridiculous. Nothing "fair" about it. Which I guess is exactly why GGG added the silly timers/names. Tell me a valid reason its not fair. The guy next to the drop has an easier time picking it up, obviously. You miss out on opportunity by being ranged, and get survivability for it. "Whether you think you can or you think you can't, you're right!" Henry Ford	Posted by Jackel6672#4463 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:19:21 AM Quote this Post
I just don't get it. We say: Give us choice. Win-win for everyone. You say: NO! Our experience will be ruined if you have choice! The lack of logic simply blows my mind. And say "adapt" one more time, and you'll forever forfeit the right to complain about anything you feel imbalanced or wrong with the game unless it's a straight-up bug. Because, you know, the way they've developed the game must be the way it was intended to be. Who are you to question that. And yes, that was irony. If the developers didn't want feedback, these forums wouldn't exist. Last edited by mercetron#6323 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:34:08 AM	Posted by mercetron#6323 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:21:59 AM Quote this Post
" Jackel6672 wrote: 1. Its constant. You get full drops by yourself, because you are by yourself. East enough. I can also go full drops in private parties. I guess public games are obsolete? " Jackel6672 wrote: You receive little in pubs because you are not fast enough to get your timed drops. Camping is an issue, but instanced is not the solution. Also, you keep neglecting to mention that parties gain xp at a much faster rate, and get more drops overall. They get more drops as a result of the game being easier because they are killing the monsters together. There is actually less loot per player. This does nothing to stop ninjas from getting anything at all good. " Jackel6672 wrote: Its only confusing to those who don't adapt. If you don't "play to win" you will not get much, and that may just not be your cup of tea. So you play single player. Pubs are invigorating for me. 1) That assumes that everyone can "adapt". If people can't find it to be fun then they will never adapt because video games are supposed to be fun. Thats why they are playing in the first place. 2) Pubs can still be invigorating for players like you. Options wouldn't change the game for anyone except players who currenty have no other choice in regards to public games. More players would be happier with the game. Standard Forever Last edited by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:34:12 AM	Posted by iamstryker#5952 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:33:53 AM Quote this Post
" mercetron wrote: Spoiler I just don't get it. We say: Give us choice. Win-win for everyone. You say: NO! Our experience will be ruined if you have choice! The lack of logic simply blows my mind. And say "adapt" one more time, and you'll forever forfeit the right to complain about anything you feel imbalanced or wrong with the game unless it's a straight-up bug. Because, you know, the way they've developed the game must be the way it was intended to be. Who are you to question that. And yes, that was irony. If the developers didn't want feedback, these forums wouldn't exist. Yes, you don't get it. And, at this point, I don't expect you to. However, miracles happen every day. What you say is incorrect. Simply put. It's not a win-win for everyone, as much as you think it is. Plus there are no good alternatives to the current loot system. There is no "choice" in this because of that. Last edited by TremorAcePV#7356 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:38:22 AM	Posted by TremorAcePV#7356 on Feb 27, 2013, 1:36:58 AM Quote this Post