Evasion not counting towards honor in trial?

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Why should 1 count and the other not?

Because 1 is EHP and 1 isn't. As I said, it's straightforward.

Evasion, armour, resistances all reduce the damage your EHP takes, and therefore the damage your honour takes.

Life/ES don't do that - they are the EHP - the resource you need to preserve - just like (for example) honour.

If you include evasion in the honour calculation and allow it to reduce damage taken (to both life and honour) you are double counting it.

This is a really weird thing to complain about. To my knowledge, even people who hate the Sanctum redux trials aren't failing out because of traps, they're failing out because they're getting hit by the enemies they're fighting.

Evasion helps you not get hit as much by enemies you are fighting.

Ergo, evasion helps you get to the end of the trials.

???

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Because 1 is EHP and 1 isn't. As I said, it's straightforward.

Evasion, armour, resistances all reduce the damage your EHP takes.

Life/ES don't do that - they are the EHP - the resource you need to preserve - just like (for example) honour.

Evasion doesn't "reduce the damage your EHP take" It's a 'am i hit or am i not' that's not a reduction at all.

re·duc·tion
/rəˈdəkSH(ə)n/
noun
1.
the action or fact of making a specified thing smaller or less in amount, degree, or size.

Evasion is a defense, doesn't reduce or make smaller hits at all, its a hit or not. Evasion is a defense just like energy shield and should be counted towards honor just like energy shield does

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This is a really weird thing to complain about. To my knowledge, even people who hate the Sanctum redux trials aren't failing out because of traps, they're failing out because they're getting hit by the enemies they're fighting.

Evasion helps you not get hit as much by enemies you are fighting.

Ergo, evasion helps you get to the end of the trials.

???

It doesn't matter if people don't "fail because of traps". If ES build A accidentally runs over 2-3 traps and loses 1.5k honor, and Evasion build B does the same thing, evasion build B has probably lost the trial cause of lost honor and ES build A can just restore honor and keep going. Thats my argument. Im not sure why its such a bad thing that i feel ES builds are punished when GGG counts ES and Evasion both as defenses but only gives honor to ES builds

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the action or fact of making a specified thing smaller or less in amount, degree, or size.

It's been a while since I studied mathematics but I'm pretty sure making a positive value zero is making it smaller.

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Evasion doesn't "reduce the damage your EHP take" It's a 'am i hit or am i not' that's not a reduction at all.

LOL ok then spec out of evasion if its so worthless.

It's not going to change just because you don't understand the basics of POE 2 mechanics however.

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LOL ok then spec out of evasion if its so worthless.

It's not going to change just because you don't understand the basics of POE 2 mechanics however.

You make some really weird statements... i don't think you should really be on this part of the forum called "Feeback" when you just tell people it's not going to change and to spec out of it.

At no point did i call evasion worthless. My entire point on a FEEDBACK FORUM was to say to make evasion count towards honor. It's my feedback on an early access game.

And the basics of POE2 is that GGG labels both evasion and energy shield as defenses but only counts 1 towards honor. It's pretty simple really.

Ignoring the entire debate on whether or not evasion is reducing damage (which it absolutely is) if you add evasion or armor to honor your gunna have people with 30-50k honor in trials and trivialize the entire game mode lol. And no that's not an exaggeration.

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Bornforexile#6932 wrote:

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LOL ok then spec out of evasion if its so worthless.

It's not going to change just because you don't understand the basics of POE 2 mechanics however.

You make some really weird statements... i don't think you should really be on this part of the forum called "Feeback" when you just tell people it's not going to change and to spec out of it.

At no point did i call evasion worthless. My entire point on a FEEDBACK FORUM was to say to make evasion count towards honor. It's my feedback on an early access game.

And the basics of POE2 is that GGG labels both evasion and energy shield as defenses but only counts 1 towards honor. It's pretty simple really.

Honour isn't based off defences though, it’s based off life+es.

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Ignoring the entire debate on whether or not evasion is reducing damage (which it absolutely is) if you add evasion or armor to honor your gunna have people with 30-50k honor in trials and trivialize the entire game mode lol. And no that's not an exaggeration.

If you are a chef and you reduce a sauce... you cook it down to less. You don't completely throw it away and be left with nothing and call it a reduction. Evasion is a hit or miss, not a reduction. Of course there could be an argument for "reduced to 0" but to me that's outside the scope of a hit or miss, but to your other point, there's VERY few builds that run armor, es, energy shield, and life. Yes it could happen and a select few could have 30-50k honor, but the vast majority of people run...

1) Lots of ES, little to low life, no Evasion, , 0 armor
2) Life and energy shield with some evasion and 0 armor
3) Lots of evasion, little energy shield, little life, no armor
3) Lots of armor and life, little to no evasion and energy shield

which would balance out.

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Honour isn't based off defences though, it’s based off life+es.

GGG specifically states that ES is a defense. When you equip a relic or get a boon that increases defenses it increases armor, evasion and energy shield. Hence why i am giving feedback that since they specify that ES is a defense that increases honor, evasion, since it is also classified as a defense, should also increase honor

To avoid addressing the actual issue here, and merely talk about semantics:

The discussion here appears to be breaking down due to a lack of established framework for discussing the varying types of defence and health.

I would suggest establishing a framework for that discussion, and I recommend taking some of the language that EVE Online players have developed for that purpose.

In that context, EHP is the total number of damage points, on average, that a player avatar can receive from a specific damage source (this accounts for different resistance types, projectile/melee, etc.). Importantly, this already accounts for evasion and armor by incorporating that into the calculation for the actual number of points of damage received, or effectively received, on average, as opposed to just the damage output from the enemy/trap/whatever

So, using that framework, I believe the disconnect is that one group of people is saying that Evasion and Armor dont contribute to Honor, while they do contribute to overall EHP; while the other group is saying that they do contribute to honor, in exactly the same way they contribute to EHP, by reducing the frequency or magnitude of damage when it is received.

I haven't tested it in game, however, if the enemy attacks the player, then that player evades that damage, and the honor bar reflects that fact by not reducing, then the honor system is functioning as it should. No increase to the actual Honor Number Total necessary.

If it isn't functioning like that, then yeah, shit's fucked.

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MrChance#0297 wrote:

if the enemy attacks the player, then that player evades that damage, and the honor bar reflects that fact by not reducing, then the honor system is functioning as it should. No increase to the actual Honor Number Total necessary.

If it isn't functioning like that, then yeah, shit's fucked.

That's exactly how it works. OP is going ballistic over nothing in this thread.