Nerfing the fun out of the game

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StormHUN#4493 wrote:

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himenoinu#2580 wrote:

Maybe it would be viable, to have crazy builds, if those builds weren't made by just trading your currency for the items that break the game if properly combined.

I don't know what you mean.

The Lightning Conduit Stormweaver did not need any special items, just cutting some gems, and getting some nodes on the passive tree.

I believe the SRS explosion build also didn't require special items - but I'm not entirely sure so correct me if I'm wrong there.

Some automation was always part of the game. It changed in PoE 2 in that we don't have CwDT, Cast on Crit, etc. (at least for now) but we have new types: Cast on [ailment]. And that's fine. But then they nerfed these gems to the point where they are just not worth the Spirit.

At the end of the day though. why do people care about how others play? Play the way you want and like, and let others do the same. If someone wants 1-button or zero-button builds, that's their decision and has no effect on anyone else who chooses to play differently.

Also, consider this: some people have injuries or diseases that make a lot of clicking/tapping/mousing hard and/or painful for them. Eg. the "Stress-free PoE" builds for PoE 1 were made by a guy with such problems. I also sometimes suffer from wrist and/or finger pains because I'm an artist and drawing can be tough on the joints sometimes. Also carpal tunnel syndrome and cubital tunnel syndrome (had both)... mmm, juicy nerve pain!

Peoplecare for hwo others play because there is a sahred economy. IF there are builds that can do map in 20 seconds, then the standard price ot items in trade will reflect the exalted supplies from THAT SPEED.


When a build is too fast it skews the market and without proper crafting, the market is essential. IF GGG gave us a better crafting then we coudl care less for how others play

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StormHUN#4493 wrote:

For me personally, playing games is about relaxing and having fun, to counteract the stress, anxiety, and depression of life. Who are you, to tell me that I'm not allowed to do that?

Who are you to tell me that games are not for achievement and overcoming obstacles? Understand something.. POE1 was kept because they seen that they could not cater to both groups with a single game!

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

because there is a sahred economy.

OK, you have a point there.

But isn't there a better solution?

Not only did they nerf the fun out of the game, they made literally almost all "Cast on X" gems unusable after those changes. Nobody is going to do 100 casts of a spell to crit with it so they can proc a single Cast on Crit lol

Why even have the "Cast on X" gems in the game then? They're already basically useless and nobody will ever play a build with them now unless a specific unique enables the build to work somehow. All the dev time spent on these gems was totally wasted the moment they nerfed the builds. Literally no fun allowed.

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

Who are you to tell me that games are not for achievement and overcoming obstacles?

I have never said that.

I have no problem with the game being hard. I simply wish to have the freedom to choose a playstyle I like.

If they nerf the automated builds in a way where they are not OP, but not killed either, I would be OK with that.

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Hsover#6583 wrote:

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himenoinu#2580 wrote:

Maybe it would be viable, to have crazy builds, if those builds weren't made by just trading your currency for the items that break the game if properly combined. If the only means of getting those items were dropping them or slowly crafting them up to snufff.

As it is, with both PoE1 and PoE2, visiting the market to get your Maven 1-shot build gear is not "crazy build" fun, it's just a sad thing. That makes the gameplay itself 1 mile wide and 1 inch deep. Market > 1-shot everything > ???? > Wait for next league.

The gameplay style of PoE 1 at the moment is just a walking and exploding simulator and this is not wrong, it is just not the proposal of PoE 2 and many don't like this.

There, fixed it for you

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StormHUN#4493 wrote:

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At the end of the day though. why do people care about how others play? Play the way you want and like, and let others do the same. If someone wants 1-button or zero-button builds, that's their decision and has no effect on anyone else who chooses to play differently.

Also, consider this: some people have injuries or diseases that make a lot of clicking/tapping/mousing hard and/or painful for them. Eg. the "Stress-free PoE" builds for PoE 1 were made by a guy with such problems. I also sometimes suffer from wrist and/or finger pains because I'm an artist and drawing can be tough on the joints sometimes. Also carpal tunnel syndrome and cubital tunnel syndrome (had both)... mmm, juicy nerve pain!

People care about how others play because if such builds are possible and used massively - thanks to streamers promoting them and making guides on them - then GGG will have to either balance the game around such builds, making it harder for those that don't want to go into brain-afk playing style.

I also cared that most uber-viable builds showcased always relied on buying your gear and I hate when all my drops are obtained on PoE.trade or all the looting in the game is diminished to just a currency farm (making it very much akin to grinding trash in BDO, so one could acquire then the gear from the AH).

I am considering that, yes. There are fights I find stupid in both PoE1 and PoE2 with how intense they are when approached with an average build. But it's those encounters that need tweaking so that it's not just a hectic fight when playing "wrong builds".

I like the fact that most encounters in PoE2 are less rng effects spam (although, they can still be, giving me massive headaches) and that the idea of those is similar to how the Settlers of Kalguur, with slower paced, more mindful approach. Some are still dumb, true (like that Za...something fight in act 2), but it's EA, so maybe things change until release. All in all, it can be relaxing if you're actively playing at the slower pace at which PoE2 seems to roll, even if you don't "win" by just holding down 1 button, no?

It's version 0.1. Of course they're gonna balance the game more quickly then they would if it was a full release.

What many of you don’t seem to understand: Skills like these are nerfed to the ground for good reason.

A large portion of players always gravitate toward meta builds that dominate everything – this happens in every game. But is that actually helpful during Early Access? Are players really testing the game thoroughly and providing useful feedback when everyone is using the same build? Definitely not. That’s why you should expect quick and heavy nerfs to obviously overpowered skills.

That doesn’t mean the skill will stay this way forever. CastOnX will definitely be buffed again – just not within a few days. The developers already have enough feedback on CastOnX and now need to shift attention to other skills, so they can receive proper testing and feedback as well. Once people stop playing it as much, it will inevitably be buffed again.

This is Early Access. GGG will handle things very differently in EA compared to the full release. After these 6–12 months, we’re going to lose everything anyway. We’re here to test the game and provide feedback. Anyone reacting emotionally to a heavy nerf hasn’t really understood the purpose of EA. My advice would be: either stop playing or adjust your mindset.

Of course, you can kindly ask for a free respec – I agree that it would fit the purpose of Early Access.

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Urza_Mechwalker#7393 wrote:

That was the possible fun in POE1.. this game is to explore other types of fun (specifically for people that hated the gameplay that POE1"fun" generated". We want the engaging combat with combos... not the "stack mroe and more % with some auto cast that becomes a walking simulator". I hope they restart POE1 development soon to catter the POE1 crowd so POE2 can be POE2 as was intended.

I'd love it if it worked. But it doesn't and it never will. I mean GGG did try to make it work, but after just a couple days people found incredibly broken builds, and those are the builds most people will play. Nerfing the "fun" would just result in less builds that people consider "viable". And the lack of build varety would be death sentence for a game like PoE.

I'm currently trying to make mercenary 1h+shield/crossbow work because i feel like it's a shame that the devs put so much work in allowing us to quickly switch weapons and even gave us weapon specialization points, but it is all ignored by 99% of the playerbase. I also know that such a build will never actually work.