This community is embarrassing and it needs to stop

...

"

Ayxera wrote:

It would be fine if the negative experiences weren't totally biased, non-factual and sound like angry essays.

This is where you lost me. When one of the founding members of the game himself says "melee sucks", and a driving core principle of PoE2 is to prevent said suck, then the years of outcry from the community is vindicated. He even hit at the main core complaint from that portion of the community, word for damn word. This is also only one instance of this. Look at Kalandra, this league and harvest where in response to the outcry, GGG heavily patched league content to improve it.

It's in GGG's best interest to filter through the nonsense and find valid criticism. The PoE community has aged significantly since the days where the forum was less emotionally charged. I've been active on the forum for 11 years now, because I care about it. GGG are also known for adding hidden nerfs and setting up content release to not be nerf-fests, only for them to end up feeling as such.

I think the confirmation bias your hinting at me be something you're also suffering from when you look for negativity.

Lamo I love when people think PoE 2 will "fix melee".

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Aynix wrote:

Lamo I love when people think PoE 2 will "fix melee".

I mean if character attack can use both right and left hand im sure it will be good

What? Its dumb? Tell that to ggg

"

hmcg020 wrote:

...
This is where you lost me. When one of the founding members of the game himself says "melee sucks", and a driving core principle of PoE2 is to prevent said suck, then the years of outcry from the community is vindicated. He even hit at the main core complaint from that portion of the community, word for damn word. This is also only one instance of this. Look at Kalandra, this league and harvest where in response to the outcry, GGG heavily patched league content to improve it.

It's in GGG's best interest to filter through the nonsense and find valid criticism. The PoE community has aged significantly since the days where the forum was less emotionally charged. I've been active on the forum for 11 years now, because I care about it. GGG are also known for adding hidden nerfs and setting up content release to not be nerf-fests, only for them to end up feeling as such.

I think the confirmation bias your hinting at me be something you're also suffering from when you look for negativity.

I go so far as to say that the audience GGG has fostered as the game became ABOUT the meta (off the rails speed and loot dumpster explosions) is the reason we have the present climate of:

1. everyone raging about everything (because as you point out it works I'm guilty of this myself because it works)
2. some people raging about the most trivial matters (see 10% xp loss, or a nerf to an OP skill that deserved it, or about how some goblin sound bite gives them "PTSD" and makes then run off crying hysterically to their hidoeout)
3. entitlement to be catered to and outrage when that doesn't happen


Catering to clear speed meta is why the game is off the rails it attracted that kind of player. That kind of player posts on the forum now.

But its also why reddit is filled with upvoted bad faith arguments because that's where that player knows to go to get catered to and validated by group think/circle jerk

its why "the vision" is a meme to those idiots instead of "what the game could have been" (to me) if they hadn't been catered to and the game hadn't been distorted into unrecognizable space ship shooter/cookie clicker.

Chris Wilson seems to be stepping away, I speculate that you can see the moment this happened on a reddit post. When EMpy and Baylormage had lots and lots of morons convinced that "mah loot is broke" because those specific strats employed by those .00000001% group/megasweaty strats were nerfed; and Chris tried to tell them that for normal players alc and going maps they were showing MORE loot.

Love Chris only wish he had gotten to actually make the game of his vision. Sure it wouldn't appeal to the masses... but as a wise man once said... the masses are... well never mind.

Speed meta isn't the problem. GGG made the game. They implemented all the power, pinnacle and gains the game offers.

The best leagues they added were the speedy ones. You just need to look at how unpopular Harvest and Necropolis were in their era. They were roundly disliked.

Chris just lost it. Less the vision more the want for the 2013 version of the game very few people bothered with. We had belief in them to better their game. So they did. They added the fidelity, the speed, the complexity and pinnacle power gains that got all of us to spend money on a free to play game.

It happens to the best of us. I'm not chiding the guy. It's just the truth. A game like this that has endured a decade+ of satisfying us isn't design-driven. It's organic. Like D2 before it. A community has grown around the offered product. Just like Coca Cola. Just like Cadillac. Just like every other product out there with a devoted community. They're not clueless about why they play and pay for the game. They know what they want.

Nobody is asking for melee to have 10x the effectiveness and efficiency of ranged meta. The argument has been crystal clear. That when you reach pinnacle content melee falls behind. The spread of defensives, itemization and skills doesn't cover the needs for pinnacle content.

So when you boil down the people defending the vision their replies are "don't play hardcore it's not balanced"

Well no kidding. That's exactly the problem.

EDIT: I can go back to ~2014-2015 and see people defending the game desyncing horribly. 'It's an indie company they're learning.'

The problem is the close-minded approach the defenders offer. It's like they've never see a better PoE design when 3.14 wasn't that long ago.

GGG has saved the league with these changes or 'nerfs'

Data is out.
Confirmed and this ends the argument.

Day 17, has shown to be the 3rd best in terms of concurrent players.
It will likely trend at 4th best...so its going to be an average 'meh' league overall when seen retrospectively in the long term.

This proves definitively and conclusively that the playerbase and the community does not want abuse farming. Better they go back to D4.

hoho this ends nothing carry on exiles.

"

Izrakhan wrote:

Speed meta isn't the problem. GGG made the game. They implemented all the power, pinnacle and gains the game offers.

The best leagues they added were the speedy ones. You just need to look at how unpopular Harvest and Necropolis were in their era. They were roundly disliked.

Chris just lost it. Less the vision more the want for the 2013 version of the game very few people bothered with. We had belief in them to better their game. So they did. They added the fidelity, the speed, the complexity and pinnacle power gains that got all of us to spend money on a free to play game.

There is a shift in generational thinking. Closed beta and early open beta where mostly played by people born in the 70s, 80s and early 90s. Later POE was taken over by the zoomer generation from the late 90s, 2000s. The younger generation has low attention span and in order to grow the game, they had to make the game zoomier, speedier and give bigger loot explosions.

Personally I don't recognize this game anymore.

I feel like the game has taken a massive step back from 3.23 despite what I'm sure were GGG's intentions to make it less "Friction" to do end game mapping.

For example, you can only juice 1 single league mechanic in your maps now as opposed to being able to do 2-3 last league, and the ones before that. The Scarab changes have enforced this.

This leads to a situation where you either farm T17 maps with a very strong build or do a very suboptimal farm in comparison on t16 maps. A lot of the farms you would do passively in the past that were in conjunction with your main currency farm are no longer viable due to the removal of Sextants.

Yes, there is still currency to be made but it has shifted more in the top 1% direction

A lot of people are missing the point of this post entirely.

I am not asking people to not make criticism of the game in order to try and improve it. I am asking that people first do their research to understand whether they are indeed angry about the facts rather than their perception. Furthermore, write it in a constructive way instead of essay long rants with dramatic and accusatory language.

There seems to be this culture of not accepting ones own responsibility for their character and instead blaming it on an external source. It is not true for all posts here, but it is true for many and it is a big waste of time for developers, or anyone for that matter, to read that nonsense.