Simulacrum needs to be toned down a bit

I know very few players that do 40/40 with multiple characters made for that purpose, most have a single strongest one that does all the footwork and you might get some grind done on another.

unless you have 100m+ dps, I dont think you can do simis as a glass cannon

that's a good thing imo because most other things in the game can be trivialized by going glass


simis require the most gearing out of most content - some of it can be bypassed by flask swapping, but if you want to do it deathless or/and with very little portal use, you have to gear correctly


you need good chaos res because of chaos pen+ phys as chaos
you need crit immunity/reduction
you need ailment immunity or be very strong against ailments, ie be crit immune for brittle, be overcapped for scorch, have enough damage for sap, have great fire res or ignite immunity for ignite, etc

you need good avoidance to not get overwhelmed, ie block, very high evasion or even acro (yes, acro)

you need good ele mitigation to not get screwed when you do get hit

probably phasing if you are doing one of the crappy layouts
also some form of slowing down (chill, freeze,

preferably also some explosion skill since packs are so dense





one thing I realized is that act 1 and act 3 locations are much better for camping. act 1 is the best because there is a bottleneck for the boat entrance. this is how I did it this league with my totems.

then again, my build is around ~50m ST dps buffed, I have 54/75 block when my bone offering is up (its about 50% uptime), 90% max res against fire and lightning damage. I had to flask swap since my chaos res is crap, pray against crits that my block avoids them, and had to camp the entrance for bosses so my shockwave totems can take care of bosses almost from offscreen. and still it was tough as hell on some waves

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Draegnarrr wrote:

I know very few players that do 40/40 with multiple characters made for that purpose, most have a single strongest one that does all the footwork and you might get some grind done on another.

Yes I'm aware of this and I think this is a problem. In my opinion challenges SHOULD lean you towards creating specialized builds because if you want to complete a challenge, that's what it should take: ingenuity and specialization. Not complete randomness or insane amounts of time.

Xzorn, this is where I differ from you. Challenges are not a requirement for a league: challenges are a choice people can make to get something out of a league. Certain mechanics simply don't or can't lend themselves to meaningful challenges, if they are solely based on the league content. But if we wanted to do something like that, then GGG could create challenges using the items or skills released in a league to beat conditional content.

I think challenges can be a good way to make players want to interact with bosses and content they might not otherwise interact with. For those who like getting 40/40, that's enough of a pull for them to attempt a certain boss or build that they have no experience with (yet).

Basically, I think there shouldn't be a single challenge that = grind. There should be maybe 10/40 freebies. Things like, "Complete the atlas", or "Beat the maven" etc. But the vast majority of the challenges should be REAL challenges. Something the game doesn't set you up to do. I'm thinking a la nuzleaf challenge pokemon or other self-inflicted challenge modes. THAT is where the challenges should be.

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jsuslak313 wrote:

Xzorn, this is where I differ from you. Challenges are not a requirement for a league: challenges are a choice people can make to get something out of a league. Certain mechanics simply don't or can't lend themselves to meaningful challenges, if they are solely based on the league content. But if we wanted to do something like that, then GGG could create challenges using the items or skills released in a league to beat conditional content.

Well take the current Challenges as example. I played 8 whole days this league at the start and I'm missing 2. That means less than 10 Challenges are even based on the league content.

Players like myself make builds for leagues. The league itself creates new build concepts and styles of play. Ultimatum made me create the most durable character I'd ever made. The goal of the league. Stand in a circle and don't die. Kinda similar to Simulacrum.

This was a build choice. A specialization. That's not really what they've turned challenges into. Even when it's not a blatant grind it's a grind for currency and chase items so you can do content that you could have done via builds. That Ultimatum build would get crushed in Simulacrum now, not because of build specialization but because she wouldn't have the stats anymore.

We're not catering to new player to get them to explore content they haven't done. Most of us have done it and either like or dislike it. Challenges based in this don't make the game fun.

I'm all for kill X in style Challenges and similar but in case of a challenge like Sim it's just a grid like the others which varies slightly on build. They've put too much weight on itemization.

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Xzorn wrote:

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jsuslak313 wrote:

Xzorn, this is where I differ from you. Challenges are not a requirement for a league: challenges are a choice people can make to get something out of a league. Certain mechanics simply don't or can't lend themselves to meaningful challenges, if they are solely based on the league content. But if we wanted to do something like that, then GGG could create challenges using the items or skills released in a league to beat conditional content.

Well take the current Challenges as example. I played 8 whole days this league at the start and I'm missing 2. That means less than 10 Challenges are even based on the league content.

Players like myself make builds for leagues. The league itself creates new build concepts and styles of play. Ultimatum made me create the most durable character I'd ever made. The goal of the league. Stand in a circle and don't die. Kinda similar to Simulacrum.

This was a build choice. A specialization. That's not really what they've turned challenges into. Even when it's not a blatant grind it's a grind for currency and chase items so you can do content that you could have done via builds. That Ultimatum build would get crushed in Simulacrum now, not because of build specialization but because she wouldn't have the stats anymore.

We're not catering to new player to get them to explore content they haven't done. Most of us have done it and either like or dislike it. Challenges based in this don't make the game fun.

I'm all for kill X in style Challenges and similar but in case of a challenge like Sim it's just a grid like the others which varies slightly on build. They've put too much weight on itemization.

back then we didnt have the top of the iceberg aspirational content
back in ultimatum simulacrums had 20 waves, and reaching 20 waves is not that hard on most endgame builds

30 wave as being part of a challenge was not a good decision, I agree. its on level of ubers, blight-ravaged maps, etc and none of those are on challenge list

30 wave simulacrum is a lot tougher and more specific build-dependent than 80 quant feared if you have good dps, thats for sure.

This is content that promotes having a lot of defense where the league itself (sanctum) is promoting being a glass cannon deleting stuff off-screen.

I had a character that was good at sims in 3.19. 14 400 ES, 40% leech per second, 100% suppression, 90k evasion + ghost dance, fortify implicit on weapon and good DPS. Deathless 30 happened many times. Enough DPS to take on Kosis wave 29-30. If Kosis rolled with 80% lightning resistance mod then I would just fuck that and pop another sim in - it would take too long to kill.

This league I can't get past 25-26. And its ok, i haven't built defenses on my characters cos the game promotes having 50 million DPS instead.

often chaos and physical mitigation was lacking on my builds for similacrum, dps might also be a bit low in some cases and monsters pile up on occasion so thats not great, tone it down and it might be too easy though, a few people i'm playing with have beaten it and their investments are high but not mirror-tier.

its tough content but if anything i'd like to see it expanded rather than nerfed similar to how we have tiered versions of other content make the base version slightly easier but add another that starts off harder and ends up even harder than the current one is at wave 30 with higher item level.

of course if they made an easier/harder version then the loot would have to be changed and maybe you wouldn't be able to get the fancy voices unless you did the uber tier one.. or maybe you could still get the best voices but the drop rates would be different.

if we are talking about improving it, I think first 10-15 waves could easily be discarded or made a lot faster or something. majority of your time in those waves is wasted

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grepman wrote:

if we are talking about improving it, I think first 10-15 waves could easily be discarded or made a lot faster or something. majority of your time in those waves is wasted

i agree with sim being too long now. When it was 20 waves it was alright. But at 30 this is pushing my patience, especially when waves 21+ are much harder and take longer.

Perhaps an atlas tree keystone that makes sims go 11-30 with it allocated (and 1-20 without it)? Could be placed in the middle of that "W" cluster.

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Esubane wrote:

Perhaps an atlas tree keystone that makes sims go 11-30 with it allocated (and 1-20 without it)? Could be placed in the middle of that "W" cluster.

+1 great idea.