Reduce the amount of loot. Add an Auction House. Make item acquisition and liquidation MATTER

Reduce the amount of loot yep. Ever since the passive skill tree, it's become insanity.

"

Xzorn wrote:

AH systems aren't worth the price. Esp in a F2P game.

One could argue the reason itemization is so bad at this point is exactly because of the AH systems that were added. If I were thinking about drop rates with a global (not even regional) AH I'd be considering all players not individuals. Bots are exactly why they refuse to fully automate it.

Even in it's current state this game only survives the bot scourge thanks to league resets.

Well if that's how it is. Then ok. I sure hate bots. Bots ruined Ragnarok Online. So ye if the online site helps with that, I suppose there's no other way.

Still want better towns tho, even if no ah.

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

Well if that's how it is. Then ok. I sure hate bots. Bots ruined Ragnarok Online. So ye if the online site helps with that, I suppose there's no other way.

Still want better towns tho, even if no ah.

It's not all without hope. There are options and even old school concept that would work today while still keeping that manual interaction that GGG wants in trading.

My preferred concept is an account Vendor NPC. The requirement for this vendor is at least having a premium tab. Players load this NPCs with items. They can set Buyout price and even reserve items by player name. Fairly similar to how the tab already works with some extra features. The biggest being the NPC is server side. This allows items to be sold while the player is off-line.

Buying is pretty much the same except instead of a generic msg players get a join ID. They can then visit the player's hideout whenever long as the join ID is valid (item is on sale). The seller benefits greatly from this as they don't have to stop what they're doing and don't get spam for 5 min.

Bots in this game tend to plague the currency, shard and card type items in this game so it won't have much effect on them but for players selling legitimate items is a decent QoL.

Literally every trade I did this league was a bit. Just make the ah already.

"

Xzorn wrote:

"

RuneLuthien wrote:

Well if that's how it is. Then ok. I sure hate bots. Bots ruined Ragnarok Online. So ye if the online site helps with that, I suppose there's no other way.

Still want better towns tho, even if no ah.

It's not all without hope. There are options and even old school concept that would work today while still keeping that manual interaction that GGG wants in trading.

My preferred concept is an account Vendor NPC. The requirement for this vendor is at least having a premium tab. Players load this NPCs with items. They can set Buyout price and even reserve items by player name. Fairly similar to how the tab already works with some extra features. The biggest being the NPC is server side. This allows items to be sold while the player is off-line.

Buying is pretty much the same except instead of a generic msg players get a join ID. They can then visit the player's hideout whenever long as the join ID is valid (item is on sale). The seller benefits greatly from this as they don't have to stop what they're doing and don't get spam for 5 min.

Bots in this game tend to plague the currency, shard and card type items in this game so it won't have much effect on them but for players selling legitimate items is a decent QoL.

Not a bad idea at all. It keep automatics from abusing in whatever way they can. It allows you to afk trade and forces you to "refill" your shop periodically.

"

Noble_Seiken wrote:

Chris Wilson said that in order to have an AH they'd have to reduce the amount of drops across the board.

Do it.
There's too much shit anyway.

That means trade becomes mandatory, and they lose a lot of customers... Not going to happen...

I absolutely hate the thought of an AH... for anything else beside the currency/bulk/stack items...

for those who never noticed, the whole dynamic trade market is actually really cool and interesting; prices fluctuate during day/night and also depending on peak times when certain regions seem to come online or close off.
Therefore i strongly believe in the current way the trade system works, with the exception for the currency/bulk-like items.
I expect that any implementation of an AH will completely kill this dynamic for items.

That being said....

i DO believe there should be some improvements in the way you interact with the trade now.
I would love to see the trade website and listing somehow gets integrated into the game with an decent user interface, and thus removing the need for a second monitor and/or switching between the browser and the game itself.
a second thing should be how.

For bulk items/currency i hate having to spam atleast 45 people to get 1 response, here i think some AH-kind of system would be more in order.

"

Xzorn wrote:

AH systems aren't worth the price. Esp in a F2P game.

One could argue the reason itemization is so bad at this point is exactly because of the AH systems that were added. If I were thinking about drop rates with a global (not even regional) AH I'd be considering all players not individuals. Bots are exactly why they refuse to fully automate it.

Even in it's current state this game only survives the bot scourge thanks to league resets.

Bots are a poor excuse to withhold a QoL feature like automated trading. Runescape's had something of that nature for years and that game's doing just fine, economy and loot drops included. It has bot problems, but instead of telling players they're not allowed to have convenient trading like GGG's doing, they take a more proactive approach in combating them. Meanwhile PoE doesn't have an AH and it's still infested with bots, on top of the price fixers exploiting the system we have currently.

Just because Blizzard royally fucked up their own AH in D3 doesn't mean every other game can and will suffer the same fate.

And before we forget: PoE on console has had automated trading for quite a while now and it hasn't turned into a dumpsterfire yet.

"

Pizzarugi wrote:

Bots are a poor excuse to withhold a QoL feature like automated trading.

Not really. Bots destroy games.

Bots destroyed GW2 and Arch Age within a few months of release.

They plague every modern MMO because of their 'on-rails' design. Essentially treating players like bots themselves. Their most recent victim was Lost Ark where 600k of 800k players were bots though the game's design would eventually be it's downfall anyways.

In the end, it's players fault for RMT to the bots.

Bots control currency, esp if there's a premium currency. I'm guessing you didn't play one of the few leagues GGG did wipe bots and the economy went to hell? Exalts selling for 30c mid league.

Games like Runescape have been around since the 90's. They're not going to attract large bot farms because there's not enough money in it. PoE is a questionable impact given previous bot purges. It's obvious they have an impact and make money already or they wouldn't be here.

Given the trade system is global and not regional. You're just asking for this...

"

Noble_Seiken wrote:

Chris Wilson said that in order to have an AH they'd have to reduce the amount of drops across the board.

If you've been watching, they have been. Just about every league since around Harvest, has seen a reduction in overall loot explosions. In 3.17 I observed (arguably) a rather large cliff in the number of random/trash unique drops. Between 3.16-3.18 there was an observable drop in trash/random white items, that most people likely filter out anyway.

Humans as a default don't like change, couple this with people's inability to self-control their emotional response and you have a tidal wave of negative sentiment directed at whatever target meets people's eyeline be it "The Devs!" or "GGG!" or "That Chris Wilson So-and-so!".

Rather than just lump such a massive change in one patch, outright changing the loot drops to almost nothing, loot abundance and other changes have been iterative; slowly changing "the norm" with each league/patch.

I still don't see the addition of an auction house ever happening, based on all of CW's disclosures thus far (including, the Trade Manifesto and various pod cast discussions) -- especially on the non-console platform. Speculation by me, but a lot of it has to do with operational costs: You need more compute, more storage, more spend to maintain an auction house. If an AH ever happens, it will be well after the new engine is released (PoE2).

Trade is so awful in the game I go out of my way to avoid it as much as I can, and I have accepted that this is by design and will just be how it is for the foreseeable future.